Coaching Changes thread

[JoeTait75]

But saban was a load of other places beforehand. Bielema wasn't. Plus, saban. His pedigree isn't strictly big ten, like ol brett's is...

Fair point.

[DesignatedT]

I don't think Bielema is a home run hire at all. Good guy, good coach but I don't think his philosophies (if he's running the same type he did at Whisky) will work at Arkansas. That slow down ground and pound will have a hard time working without those big ole O lineman he could get up there and with the speed of SEC defenses.

Arkansas should have went the spread route, similar to what we did. Bielsma's style requires certain players to be effective, and if he doesn't have those guys it's going to fail. Running the spread allows you to hide a lot of weaknesses in many different ways.

I can't see Arkansas be successful when they are trying to emulate Florida. They don't have the resources.

[symple19]

Bielsma was a home run hire for Arkansas.

I could be wrong, as I often am, but this guy was disparaging the SEC only a few years ago and then bolts for the "promised land" when the money is right. Wisconsin is a big-time, Big-Ten school, with an entire state fanatically behind it. To leave for Arky is unconscionable, IMO. He has a better chance to win in Madison, year in and year out, and can make comparable money.


His playbook is Miles-ish without the dominating defense and he has ZERO knowledge of how to recruit in this region. I would love to hear you justify how this is a "home-run" hire.

That being said.. His coaching style is pure SEC. Dominating run offense, massive O-line, solid defense, and a squad that doesn't turn it over. He benefited massively from a transfer QB last year and has shown that he can run a clean program. But good god, this guy has known nothing in his life but Iowa and Wisconsin, and Fayettville is a long goddamn way from home, both professionally and personally. He may adapt and overcome, but I seriously doubt it.

[DesignatedT]

That being said.. His coaching style is pure SEC. Dominating run offense, massive O-line, solid defense, and a squad that doesn't turn it over.

I don't think Arkansas trying to go this route is the smart move. I don't see it working out for them and I don't think it would have worked out for us if we went down that road as well. The SEC and College Football is changing. This philosophy has dominated at places like Alabama, LSU. Florida and such but Arkansas does not come close to those programs and I don't see a bottom tier program being able to really be successful running that type of offense. He will never have an O line like Alabama to run behind and he will never have the athletes on defense to play this style.

Best Jobs/Programs in the SEC:

Florida,Bama,LSU,Georgia,Auburn,A&M,SC,UT are all superior jobs to Arkansas. Missouri is a comparable program.

[symple19]

I don't think Arkansas trying to go this route is the smart move. I don't see it working out for them and I don't think it would have worked out for us if we went down that road as well. The SEC and College Football is changing. This philosophy has dominated at places like Alabama, LSU. Florida and such but Arkansas does not come close to those programs and I don't see a bottom tier program being able to really be successful running that type of offense. He will never have an O line like Alabama to run behind and he will never have the athletes on defense to play this style.

Best Jobs/Programs in the SEC:

Florida,Bama,LSU,Georgia,Auburn,A&M,SC,UT are all superior jobs to Arkansas. Missouri is a comparable program.

But think about this, T. Half of the Natty's won in the SEC (in the current streak) have been won by "boring offensive" teams that also have ridiculous defenses. The other half are Florida and Auburn, both of which had, if not dominant defenses (florida), then at least dominant defensive players (Auburn and Fairley). It makes sense on paper to hire a guy like Beliema. However, I agree with you in general. The SEC is changing. LSU, Bama, and teams of their ilk are becoming the minority while everyone else is moving towards the spread. Vandy, USCe, and Tenn are, more or less, sticking with the old formula while the rest are adapting.

The SEC, best conference in America (whether you like it or not), is becoming ground zero for a fundamental battle ground over which philosophy will rule. Auburn made an emphatic statement by hiring Malzahn, while Arky went toward the "Saban Model." Most Auburn people wanted that old school way of doing things. That's why they wanted Patterson, Smart, or Strong. On the other end of the spectrum, those like myself wanted an innovative guy who would push the envelope. Malzahn fits the bill. Now it's time to see which way UT will go.

What's awesome, is that the SEC will be almost evenly divided between the old and new school. It's the ultimate proving ground. What emerges should be the dominant force in college football for the foreseeable future.

[symple19]

By the way. I'm so happy about the Auburn hire that I am getting completely obliterated tonight. I apologize in advance for all the youtube music videos that I will inevitably post later on

[JoeTait75]

I don't think Arkansas trying to go this route is the smart move. I don't see it working out for them and I don't think it would have worked out for us if we went down that road as well. The SEC and College Football is changing. This philosophy has dominated at places like Alabama, LSU. Florida and such but Arkansas does not come close to those programs and I don't see a bottom tier program being able to really be successful running that type of offense. He will never have an O line like Alabama to run behind and he will never have the athletes on defense to play this style.

Thing is, "bottom-tier" is exactly what Wisconsin was when Barry Alvarez first came in and implemented that style. And Arkansas historically is a more prestigious program than Wisconsin, imo. I don't see why what worked at Wisky won't work at Arky.

[JoeTait75]

BTW, Darrell Hazell is going to Purdue: http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2012/1...ng-to-reports/

So both Kent and Arkansas State will likely have interim head coaches in their bowl game. At least we'll be even on that score.

[symple19]

Thing is, "bottom-tier" is exactly what Wisconsin was when Barry Alvarez first came in and implemented that style. And Arkansas historically is a more prestigious program than Wisconsin, imo. I don't see why what worked at Wisky won't work at Arky.

Would love for you to respond to my post above. I have a lot of respect for your takes and would love to hear what you have to say.

I think that BB may be successful at Arky, but he is at a huge disadvantage in terms of recruiting and a cultural understanding of what the SEC is all about. I realize this sounds conceited, but it is what it is.I know because I live in Big 10 country now. It's a whole new ballgame. Nobody in this part of the country takes this as seriously as we do.

[symple19]

Hornets78

Still haven't heard why you think BB is a homerun

[symple19]

And by the way, I'm wrong all the goddamn time. Not trying to piss anyone off. JMO

[symple19]

BTW, Darrell Hazell is going to Purdue: http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2012/1...ng-to-reports/

So both Kent and Arkansas State will likely have interim head coaches in their bowl game. At least we'll be even on that score.

It's crazy that Freeze and Malzahn bounced after their first year. Feel sorry for Ark St.

[DesignatedT]

Thing is, "bottom-tier" is exactly what Wisconsin was when Barry Alvarez first came in and implemented that style. And Arkansas historically is a more prestigious program than Wisconsin, imo. I don't see why what worked at Wisky won't work at Arky.

Symple already hit on it but this conference is a lot different in a lot of areas. Caliber of players, recruiting styles, level of compe ion, etc.

[JoeTait75]

I think that BB may be successful at Arky, but he is at a huge disadvantage in terms of recruiting and a cultural understanding of what the SEC is all about. I realize this sounds conceited, but it is what it is.I know because I live in Big 10 country now. It's a whole new ballgame. Nobody in this part of the country takes this as seriously as we do.

It is completely different. Really, if you take Ohio out of the equation the midwest is probably more of a basketball region than a football region. Even in Ohio we love our football, we know it and take it seriously- but the south is still on another level.

I have no idea how Bielema will make that transition. tbh he's one of the last guys I saw leaving his current position. He could have gone on posting 8-5 records at Wisky for the next twenty years and probably kept his job.

[symple19]

Symple already hit on it but this conference is a lot different in a lot of areas. Caliber of players, recruiting styles, level of compe ion, etc.

And pressure... What other school outside of the state of Alabama would, no matter how bad he is, fire a guy 2 mother ing years after winning a natty? Look at Iowa. Kirk Ferentz is making a top ten salary by winning ten games every third year. Penn State is a kid ing nightmare. Michigan is content with a fat guy who says all the right things but loses when it matters. Ohio State is the only school that took seriously and hired a guy who can conceivably make them into a legit national powerhouse instead of the sperm that runs down the corner of the SEC's mouth.

[symple19]

The PAc 12? Completely irrelevant except for the one team that plays "SEC football"... And Oregon, which lost to the one team that plays sound fundamental football

ACC?

[JoeTait75]

That's why I don't get into the SEC-vs-Big 10 thing. It's an apples-to-oranges comparison. Different levels of talent, different levels of commitment, etc. There is one basketball school in the SEC (Kentucky) vs. three in the Big 10 (Indiana, Purdue, Illinois) for example. There isn't as much football talent in the midwest as there is in the south. It's just different.

[symple19]

That's why I don't get into the SEC-vs-Big 10 thing. It's an apples-to-oranges comparison. Different levels of talent, different levels of commitment, etc. There is one basketball school in the SEC (Kentucky) vs. three in the Big 10 (Indiana, Purdue, Illinois) for example. There isn't as much football talent in the midwest as there is in the south. It's just different.

Completely agree about B-ball, although now that Missouri is in the SEC it will help it's stature in a big way.

However, people in the south have almost nothing to be proud about other than sports, specifically football. The midwest has academics, prosperity, racial equality (kinda), jobs, and a more prosperous way of life than does the south. It also has a plethora of pro teams to get behind while the south has Atlanta and New Orleans.

See, even you don't understand it JT?! The South clings to the few things it has to be proud of; football, religion, and guns... In that order

[symple19]

Texas doesn't really count in my assessment. You guys are a special kind of crazy,

[symple19]

Big 10 is ludicrous this year in Basketball, BTW


What, 6 teams are legit Final Four compe ors?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The PAc 12? Completely irrelevant except for the one team that plays "SEC football"... And Oregon, which lost to the one team that plays sound fundamental football

ACC?

The Pac is the 2nd best conference in football this year. Idk why you've been jerking the Big-12 off all season.

[symple19]

The Pac is the 2nd best conference in football this year. Idk why you've been jerking the Big-12 off all season.

Eh, I was hammered last night

I still think it's the best conference this year, despite the lack of defense. (top to bottom)

Pac, like the SEC, is probably is probably better at the top than is the Big-12, but the two conferences suffer for having dog teams at the bottom, imo

Oregon (as well as Stanford, obviously) is legit and OSU/UCLA aren't far behind. I guess when I look at conferences I place as much importance on the bottom as I do the top, if that makes any sense. Practically every team in the Big12 is compe ive, and that counts a lot for me. fwiw

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Eh, I was hammered last night

I still think it's the best conference this year, despite the lack of defense. (top to bottom)

Pac, like the SEC, is probably is probably better at the top than is the Big-12, but the two conferences suffer for having dog teams at the bottom, imo

Oregon (as well as Stanford, obviously) is legit and OSU/UCLA aren't far behind. I guess when I look at conferences I place as much importance on the bottom as I do the top, if that makes any sense. Practically every team in the Big12 is compe ive, and that counts a lot for me. fwiw

I think you're confusing compe ion with parity similar to what people did with the Pac-10 in 2009 before it actually got better (mostly due to coaching improvements since then).

I think if you take the top 8 teams in the pac (Oregon, Stanford, UCLA, Oregon State, USC, ASU, Washington, UA) and the top 8 teams in the B12 (KSU, OU, Texas, OK State, Baylor, TCU, Tech, WVU) it's not a close call in any way. Top to bottom the Pac is better. The top teams in the B12 being weak is what has made the middle-of-the-pack teams in the B12 look better. The way OU has close calls against teams like TCU speaks more to how weak OU is than how good TCu is imo. The B12 has also become the new Pac-12 as far as the horrible defense is plays.

There are also a few several specific examples. The 8th best team in the pac destroyed the 4th best team in the B12 this season. Notre Dame at home against Stanford barely scraped by in OT while they went into Norman and destroyed Oklahoma. Their win against USC w/o Barkley was a lot closer than their win against Oklahoma. Those are just off the top of my head.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Also, the top 6 teams in the SEC (Alabama, Georgia, South Carolina, Florida, LSU, A&M) make it impossible for me to rank any other conference ahead of it, regardless of how ty the rest of the conference is.

[leemajors]

Yeah, the Big 12 had a down year and trended down over the whole year in quality. Err, got totally exposed for a mostly no defense conference. I think TCU's defense did play much, much better in the second half of the season, though. Can't really comment on PAC 12 since I didn't see too much of them outside of Oregon and USC. both conferences are littered with teams that can throw up a ridiculous amount of points in any game.