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[FuzzyLumpkins]

What about Washington DC...

What about it? You make up as a matter of cours; I am not going to guess what your idiocy has cooked up.

[TSA]

I already showed you a study where they looked at places where there were more guns and there was no less crime.

You are right, enough with being civil, you are a ing idiot. An absolute ing idiot. We are not arguing more guns equals less crime you illiterate . Your argument is more guns equals more crime, and unfortunately all data s on that notion. Until you can dispute the well known fact that gun ownership has gone up, while crime has gone down I have nothing more to say to you on this matter. Have you failed to realize the rest of the anti-gun crowd here is silent on this particular issue except you? I took you to be an intelligent person but after this back and forth I've changed my position.

Fact: crime is down
Fact: gun ownership is up
Fact: more guns does not equal more crime

you and good night.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You are right, enough with being civil, you are a ing idiot. An absolute ing idiot. We are not arguing more guns equals less crime you illiterate . Your argument is more guns equals more crime, and unfortunately all data s on that notion. Until you can dispute the well known fact that gun ownership has gone up, while crime has gone down I have nothing more to say to you on this matter. Have you failed to realize the rest of the anti-gun crowd here is silent on this particular issue except you? I took you to be an intelligent person but after this back and forth I've changed my position.

Fact: crime is down
Fact: gun ownership is up
Fact: more guns does not equal more crime

you and good night.

Have you taken the Stanford IQ test? If you have I will be more than happy to compare results. Correlation does not imply causation and you clearly lack the insight or intelligence to make any attempt at a proof of what you claim.

Bandwagon fallacy. Look it up as I doubt you have the education to already understand it.

More on that: I am hardly the only one taking a gun control stance. EN created a thread taunting you guys for your fear mongering tactics. He does not necessarily favor the same policies as I. Others have posted similar trains of thought. I also have shown Gallup polls indicating that a majority of Americans want better gun control.



I am hardly alone in this as much as your delusional ideologically-forced ignorance self does not want it to happen.

Oh and btw when you sold your gun was there a background check?

[Wild Cobra]

Typical Fuzzy logic.

Opinion equals fact.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Typical Fuzzy logic.

Opinion equals fact.

What opinion did I insert for fact? If you claim that it was the poll data, you would be wrong as that was a rejoinder to what he was claiming as per me being the only one. I prefaced the statement by mentioning the bandwagon fallacy. You need to look it up as well. Its more like you lack critical thinking or the ability to follow the flow of an argument..

[Wild Cobra]

You can't win with fact, so you interject an opinion poll.... Need I say more?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

What opinion did I insert for fact?

Cannot mention one can you?

[Wild Cobra]

I explained my words. You are subs uting opinion because you have no facts.

Am I wrong that you think your opinions are comparable to facts?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I explained my words.

No, you haven't. What opinion?

[Wild Cobra]

No, you haven't. What opinion?

Are you saying a poll isn't people's opinion?

[boutons_deux]

NPR has the NRA President on Friday.

One of the gun-industry talking-point LIES he told was that hammers kill more people than guns.

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/hom...weaponstab.cfm

the cries of less macho fakers: Freedom! Water the Tree of Liberty with (other people's) Blood! 2nd Amendment!

[rascal]

You are right, enough with being civil, you are a ing idiot. An absolute ing idiot. We are not arguing more guns equals less crime you illiterate . Your argument is more guns equals more crime, and unfortunately all data s on that notion. Until you can dispute the well known fact that gun ownership has gone up, while crime has gone down I have nothing more to say to you on this matter. Have you failed to realize the rest of the anti-gun crowd here is silent on this particular issue except you? I took you to be an intelligent person but after this back and forth I've changed my position.

Fact: crime is down
Fact: gun ownership is up
Fact: more guns does not equal more crime

you and good night.

Gun crime is not down enough, still too high because too many guns . More guns = high gun crimes

[DMC]

Another blanket dismissal. Australia was a frontiersman country that was a post colonial UK state. Just like us. They had a frontier just like us. They fought aborigines just like us and that causeed very similar opinions towards minorities. Australians are notorious as being as racist as you 3. They, before the rebuys, had a very large number of guns. Both were mainly populated by debtors ie the indentured farmers and given the opportunity to pay off debts. The difference was between religious puritanical types that were sent here and more violent types sent to Australia.

All of your GOP WASP types that are anti-gun control come from a UK cultural background. Again we were a British colony. The principles that shaped the structure of government were heavily influenced by UK and French philosphers like Locke and Colbert. Adam Smith, a scot, is a central figure in our and their economic culture. Both banking systems are similar with central banks. Our fashion is heavily influenced by them and vice versa. The Cons ution was inspired by the magna carta. Our structure of central government is the same with bicameral legislatures and a bureaucrat in chief. We share the same language for s sake.

There are no better similes to US culture than the UK and Australia. Again, nothing will convince you because you are ideologues. Ignorant ones at that.

Australia did not emancipate slaves, did not have 300 years of slavery of a people who now comprise a significant portion of the states with the highest crime rates.

However, they do have their indigenous population that are fundamentally a tribal people:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigen...ians_and_crime

Indigenous Australians commit a disproportionately high amount of criminal offences in Australia.^[1] The 2006 census do ented that there are 455,031 Indigenous people, who are either Australian Aborigines or Torres Strait Islanders, in Australia, accounting for 2.3 percent of the population. Australian Bureau of Statistics figures show that Indigenous Australians account for around 25% of Australia's prison population.










Not much different than America's "anomaly" with blacks having a disproportionately high incarceration rate.




Here you can see that the uptick in the early 90's was attributed to that tribal population, as the white rate remained constant and much lower per 100,000.


These facts are undeniable and they are available, but people like Fuzzy are too sensitive to even address them so they look for secondary points in which to attack. The "racist" label scares a lot of people, but you look at the facts and see if you draw a different conclusion. The underlying reasons are another issue, but the facts, as I stated, are undeniable unless you think the DoJ crime stats are biased.

[DMC]

Gun crime is not down enough, still too high because too many guns . More guns = high gun crimes

Let the rational minds discuss this, you meditate with your invisible sky buddy and don't hurt yourself or blow up an abortion clinic.

[boutons_deux]

More UNREGULATED guns is more gun homicides and suicides nationwide, even in "law abiding" homes.

Type right-wing LIARS: up is down, black is white, my blind ideology says it's so.

[DMC]

More UNREGULATED guns is more gun homicides and suicides nationwide, even in "law abiding" homes.

Type right-wing LIARS: up is down, black is white, my blind ideology says it's so.

Admitting you have a problem is the first step to recovery.

[boutons_deux]

Admitting you have a problem is the first step to recovery.

RIF

[mavs>spurs]

you're a fiesty angry little r arent ya boy?

[boutons_deux]

you're a fiesty angry little r arent ya boy?

you gun-sucking macho fakers really hate any push back, doncha? stick your guns up your wimpy asses. There's more illumination in there than in the between your ears.

[mavs>spurs]

that post really embodies the whole angry black man phenomenon, tbh

[boutons_deux]

The Suprising Unknown History of the NRA

It is hard to believe that the NRA was committed to gun-control laws for most of the 20th century—helping to write most of the federal laws restricting gun use until the 1980s.


“Historically, the leadership of the NRA was more open-minded about gun control than someone familiar with the modern NRA might imagine,” wrote Adam Winkler, a Second Amendment scholar at U.C.L.A. Law School, in his 2011 book, Gunfight: The Battle Over The Right To Bear Arms In America. “The Second Amendment was not nearly as central to the NRA’s iden y for most of the organization’s history.”

Paranoid Libertarians’ Hostile Takeover

Perhaps the sportsmen of America could abide by the new law, but within the NRA’s broad membership were key factions that resented the new federal law. Thoughout the 1960s, there were a few articles in American Rifleman saying the NRA was waiting for the U.S. Supreme Court to declare the Second Amendment included the right to own a gun, Joan Burbick recounts in her 2006 book, Gun Show Nation: Gun Culture and American Democracy.

A split started to widen inside the NRA, Burbick notes. Gun dealers thought they were being harassed. Rural states felt they were being unduly punished for urban America’s problems. In 1975, the NRA created a new lobbying arm, the Ins ute for Legislative Action, under Harlon B. Carter, a tough-minded former chief of the U.S. Border Patrol who shared the libertarian goal of expanding gun owners’ rights. Bur writes that “by 1976, the political rhetoric had gained momentum and the bicentennial year brought out a new NRA campaign, ‘designed to enroll defenders of the right to keep and bear arms’ in numbers equal to ‘the ranks of the patriots who fought in the American Revolution.’” Looking back, the seeds of a hostile takeover were everywhere.

Harlon Carter wasn’t just another hard-headed Texan who grew up in a small town that was once home to frontiersman Davy Crockett. He was an earlier era’s version of George Zimmerman, the Floridian young man who claims to have shot Trayvon Martin in self-defense in February 2012—even though police records and 911 recordings seem to show Zimmerman was looking for a fight. According to Carol Vinzant’s 2005 book, Lawyers, Guns, and Money: One Man’s Battle With The Gun Industry, a 17-year-old Carter found and confronted a Mexican teenager who he believed helped steal his family’s car. When the 15-year-old pulled a knife, Carter shot and killed him. His conviction was overturned when an appeals court said the jury should have considered a self-defense argument.

In November 1976, the NRA’s old guard Board of Directors fired Carter and 80 other employees associated with the more expansive view of the Second Amendment and implicit distrusting any government firearm regulation. For months, the Carter cadre secretly plotted their revenge and hijacked the NRA’s annual meeting in Cincinatti in May 1977. The meeting had been moved from Washington to protest its new gun control law. Winkler writes that Carter’s top deputy Neal Knox was even more extreme than him—wanting to roll back all existing gun laws, including bans on machine guns and saying the federal government had killed Martin Luther King and Bobby Kennedy as “part of a plot to advance gun control.”

Using the NRA’s parliamentary rules, the rebels interrupted the agenda from the floor and revised how the Board of Directors was chosen, recommited the NRA to fighting gun control and restored the lobbying ILA. Harlon Carter became the NRA’s new executive director. He cancelled a planned move of its national headquarters from Washington to Colorado Springs. And he changed the organization’s motto on its DC headquarters, selectively editing the Second Amendment to reflect a non-compromising militancy, “The Right Of The People To Keep And Bear Arms Shall Not Be Infringed.”

After Carter was re-elected to lead the NRA in 1981, The New York Times reported on Carter’s teenage vigilante killing—and how he changed his first name’s spelling to hide it. At first, he claimed the shooting was by someone else—and then recanted but refused to discuss it. Winkler writes, “the hard-liners in the NRA loved it. Who better to lead them than a man who really understood the value of a gun for self-protection?”

After the coup, the NRA ramped up donations to congressional campaigns. “And in 1977, new articles on the Second Amendment appeared” in American Rifleman, Burbick noted, “rewriting American history to legitimize the armed citizen unregulated except by his own ability to buy a gun at whatever price he could afford.” That revisionist perspective was endorsed by a Senate Judiciary Subcommittee chaired by Utah Republican Orrin Hatch in 1982, when staffers wrote a report concluding it had discovered “long lost proof” of an individual’s cons utional right to bear arms.

The NRA’s fabricated but escalating view of the Second Amendment was ridiculed by former U.S. Supreme Court Chief Justice Warren Burger—a conservative appointed by President Richard Nixon—in a PBS Newshour interview in 1991, where he called it “one of the greatest pieces of fraud—I repeat the word ‘fraud’—on the American public by special interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime.”

http://www.alternet.org/suprising-unknown-history-nra

And the Repugs saw gun owners as suckers to be recruited to vote for the Repug's 1% candidates, just as the Repugs suckered the southern Dem racists to the Repug 1%-party with Roger Ailes Repug Southern (racist) Strategy, and just as the Repugs suckered (racist, rural, poor, uneducated) "Christians" to vote Repug.

Brilliant Repug politices, but it has really ed up and polarized the country, taken in backwards.

And obviously, the gun-fellators here have no idea how duped and suckered they are.

[mavs>spurs]

when you're not posting articles that nobody reads, you're making angry black man posts tbh

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Australia did not emancipate slaves, did not have 300 years of slavery of a people who now comprise a significant portion of the states with the highest crime rates.

However, they do have their indigenous population that are fundamentally a tribal people:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigen...ians_and_crime

Indigenous Australians commit a disproportionately high amount of criminal offences in Australia.^[1] The 2006 census do ented that there are 455,031 Indigenous people, who are either Australian Aborigines or Torres Strait Islanders, in Australia, accounting for 2.3 percent of the population. Australian Bureau of Statistics figures show that Indigenous Australians account for around 25% of Australia's prison population.










Not much different than America's "anomaly" with blacks having a disproportionately high incarceration rate.




Here you can see that the uptick in the early 90's was attributed to that tribal population, as the white rate remained constant and much lower per 100,000.


These facts are undeniable and they are available, but people like Fuzzy are too sensitive to even address them so they look for secondary points in which to attack. The "racist" label scares a lot of people, but you look at the facts and see if you draw a different conclusion. The underlying reasons are another issue, but the facts, as I stated, are undeniable unless you think the DoJ crime stats are biased.

Scared. You are such a putz.

Thank you for admitting that there are good parallels between the two countries.

Both the aborigines and blacks are disproportionally poor. There are also those such as yourself that presume they are inclined to criminal activity. There are many possible causes and I still see no legitimate link genetically ie they are inherently deviant. You even admit that yet you still post unrelated studies trying to claim a genetic inclination.

That is not a secondary issue. It was the first cause you brought up in this discussion.

When you attribute negative traits on the basis of race that is racism. You are a racist and it doesn't scare people, they just do not like bigotry. Some people value equal protection and egalitarian spirit. You don't.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

versus

You are determined to make it a racial thing though.

[TSA]

Hey Fuzzy glad you're back after saying you weren't going to waste any more time with us. Here's a nice article for you to read, figured you enjoy it since its done by a psychiatrist and all.


Raging Against Self Defense:
A Psychiatrist Examines The Anti-Gun Mentality


http://www.vcdl.org/new/raging.htm

Have fun and let me know what you think. Boutons, would love to hear your take too as you've now been officially labeled.