Their best playoff run was without Rudy Gay. If they can flip Randolph for a scorer on a rookie deal and an expiring, it's a win.
The Grizzlies, as cons uted, had topped out. They were sliding into the second tier of playoff teams in the West. They were done as contenders.
You don't like this for DET - taking what they do this season out of consideration (might not hurt their draft status too much at all and it's slated to be a very weak draft) = Calderon's expiring contract opens up quite a bit of cap space. Makes sense to me at least.
Good trade for both the Grizz and the Pistons. Grizz add a grizzled veteran in Prince who can still contribute as a role player and will finally be motivated to play well for a contender. He would be an adequate replacement for Gay and will also add three point shooting. The Grizzlies will also use up the space vacated by Gay for a decent FA next season or perhaps use it to retain Tony Allen.
For the Pistons, Prince was a consistent performer but a coach killer and a malcontent in some sense. Losing his contract opens up a lot of salary cap space for next season while still keeping them under contention with Jose Calderon going to be a useful contributor for them in the race for the 8th spot in the Least compe ive of the Leastern Conference spots.
For the Raptors, the buffoons continue to add more heavy contracts and a collection of individuals without any philosophy. Got to be stuck in irrelevance for another 3-4 years under perhaps the worst GM in the NBA now.
Keep in mind this is about money just as much as basketball. Also, no team was going to let them get rid of Gay's large contract (even though it's only 2 years long after this year) and give them top young prospects in return. I agree that in a bubble Gay is probably being undervalued a little too much, but in the real world this was likely the best total package they could get. Not many teams are jumping at taking on big contracts right now for underperforming stars. Let along giving up talented cheap young big men to boot.
I agree that in a perfect world they get a good wing scorer back (which is why the half hearted Pierce talks were amazing to me), but they still have some options to address that.
Yeah, BYC isn't as big of a deal with the 150-percent rule added in. This makes it easier to take back bigger salaries.
For example: In a trade Derozan's out-going salary is $3.3 Million. So the Raptors can take back no more than $5.05 Million for him in a one-on-one deal. To the receiving team, his incoming salary is $8.26 Million, so they have to send out at least $6.25 Million. That $1.478 Million gap isn't very hard to bridge by sending a couple of cheap players to other teams, and it doesn't even account for a team like Phoenix just using their cap room.
I refuse to believe the Raptors front office was smart enough to lowball the Grizzlies out of getting back Ross. If I were Toronto, I'd rather give up Ross than Davis any day. Really, I just don't think Memphis wanted him, which boggles my mind. I agree they weren't going to get good value for Gay, but they had better leverage after getting under the tax last trade. They weren't supposed to be as desperate this time around.
What about trading Jax+De Colo+Neal for Randolph?
The bottom line for the Grizz -
They swap Rudy Gay, Marreese Speights, Wayne Ellington, Josh Selby and future (most likely late and complicated) First round pick for
Tayshaun Prince, Ed Davis, Jon Leuer, Austin Daye.
They secure their financial future, dump a borderline but underwhelming and overpaid All Star in Rudy Gay, a defenseless offense only big in Speights and some roster fillers to get a defensive minded veteran with championship nous, a young and talented big in Davis, and two floor spacing bigs who could possibly by resuscitated in Leuer and Daye.
John Hollinger. Impressive!
I am fairly confident this is wrong. I know I read that TOR made Ross untouchable in this trade.
Raptors in active trade discussions for Rudy Gay
Canada.com-Jan 29, 2013
According to Adrian Wojnarowski, the Rudy Gay to Toronto deal is ... draft pick, however the Raptors have made Terrence Ross untouchable.
Like timvp said, all the Grizzlies did was add to their strengths on defense and rebounding, but they didn't do anything to help their offense. As a matter of fact, they've probably taken a stepback. I think the Spurs may match up even better with them now without Gay. Yeah the Grizzlies are HUGE on the frontline and may beast on the boards, but they have no legit offensive perimeter threat now. Tony checks Conley, and Green/Manu and Kawhi can dig down and help out against Randolph and Gasol now. Tony Allen and Tayshaun Prince won't provide even half the scoring threat that Rudy Gay provided. Good move for the Pistons to clear Prince and Daye off their pocket books. They'll have some pretty good change to spend in the off-season now. Stupid move for Toronto, but that's to be expected like everybody else here has said.
That's what i don't get as well. Memphis was low-balled when they tried to trade Gay at first because teams knew they were desperate to dump salary in order to avoid the lux tax. Still, even after that move giving a future 1st round pick + decent role players for Leuer (essentially a salary dump), they still got a crap offer for Gay anyways.
Memphis did not want Ross and the reason is Hollinger. He made the Gay move happen (high salary with below average PER) and he obviously prefers Davis over Ross (look at their PERs).
You can like the MEM trade or not, but theres something clear from my point of view: They have a plan and they are following it. Thats not minor, thats a lot. It can work or not, thats another issue.
I dont know if I can say the same thing about Toronto.
They traded Ed Davis ???????????????????????????????
Colangelo
That is not true. They asked for Ross, and he was deemed untouchable.
Raptorsforum quotes:
my only real worry about Gay is that by coming here he will be relied on more heavily than in memphis and we don't know if he's that type of player
it was like when the Nets lost a bunch of their guys after that championship run and Richard Jefferson became the star player on the team and we found out he wasn't that type of player, he got about 10-15 more touches a game but was missing about 70% of them
that's not what the team really needs. As was mentioned twice yesterday, the Raps are 10th in points per 100 possessions. We were already able to score the ball. The problem is getting stops. We give up leads because we don't stop teams, not because we can't score.
We're going to be destroyed in the paint by every team that plays us now, and we're going to be a perimeter team that shoots about 41%. This is going to be so ugly.
Even Amir won't be the same without Calderon, and dollars to donuts the soft one goes back in the starting line-up. We're 28th on defense and fully capable of being last.
Not many are happy...
Not really challenging you, but where'd you see that? I guess I could believe it, but that seems like a poor move on their part.
With Gay and Derozan locked up for a couple more years, I don't see where Ross fits in (meaning why he'd be untouchable). Maybe Derozan is on the move?
Exactly. The deal-breaker to me is that Davis isn't an especially good off the ball player. Hamilton, Reggie, and Ray Allen are all examples of guys who could move really well without the basketball and who you could tailor your offense around somewhat. Splitter, Noah, and maybe Howard would probably be the bigs who are better at scoring off the ball (although Noah's touch is debatable ..). I'm with you in that I love advanced stats but I try to temper my expectations with the eye test as well. Because Davis has been playing on a bottom-feeder, scoring efficiently, and rebounding on a team that can't be bothered to do anything well, I think people have an unrealistic idea of what he's capable of.
But he is a solid player who will most likely produce stat-wise. If the plan is to move Z-Bo as well, however, the Grizzlies will have to upgrade their wings/backcourt to stay in contention. People who think Gasol, Conley, and Davis will be enough to make it in the West are going to be disappointed.
Detroit definitely came out well on this one. Calderon's a PG who's really good at getting guys the ball exactly where they like it. He's also got a really calm and steady game management style which I think is good for the young guys they have over there. He's not an all-star but he's a fabulous player who will win you games if you give him quality pick and roll players as well as a more aggressive backcourt running mate. I would've loved to have him in San Antonio.
Not including Ross kinda redeems the Raptors and yeah they need to get rid of some of their big salaries now because their situation is pretty bad cap wise, especially when it'll come to resigning Lowry.
Colangelo is in love with Bargnani and they are way deeper at SG-SF than at PF so yeah Derozan is probably the logical choice if they are gonna trade someone.
Just a hunch here, but I don't think Colangelo's love for Bargnani is the reason why they haven't moved him. I think this contract is actually worse than Gay's.
Sounds like here.
Raptors in active trade discussions for Rudy Gay
Canada.com-Jan 29, 2013
According to Adrian Wojnarowski, the Rudy Gay to Toronto deal is ... draft pick, however the Raptors have made Terrence Ross untouchable.
It's a good trade for Pistons tbh. The 2 young bigs need more touches and a pg to play with them...knight and co sucks...
i saw Detroit a lot and even if he is past his prime a long time ago, Prince is a very nice player to have. He is humble, play for the team, shoot the 3 and long 2s very well, I actually believe he is going to be great for the Grizz. Motivation can be an issue for him, he loves Detroit so at his age I m not sure he will be 100%.
Sucks that Prince has been traded
They should have allowed him to end his career in Detroit
He is great with young players
Memphis already beat the Spurs without Gay.
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