that's it? that ain't nuthin. what hypocrisy.
I think there's a difference between flopping and selling a foul. I thought the league didn't fine players if they were actually fouled. It's pretty easy to see when contact isn't made, but if the league gets into the gray area of "you didn't need to react that much" it gets a lot harder to enforce. Maybe Allen's case is clear-cut, but it sets a bad precedent, in my opinion.
not about the money imo, just the league saying they saw what we saw. and I'm glad to hear it
Terrible, nearly irrelevant fine with no apology by the league for calling it a flagrant which nearly cost the Spurs that game and possible the series. . . and they didn't rescind the flagrant from Manu. Extremely disappointed in the league's very lax reaction to that play.
Since the league is too pussy to issue a public warning to the Grizzlies threatening to eject any player that tries that again, I hope (and I know this won't happen) they don't give them the benefit of the doubt on plays like that again for the rest of the series.
also, someone should make a compilation of all the times manu has been taken down and just walks away, comes back and makes his FT (im thinking of the 05 series mostly but there are enough for a good 6 minutes of footage), but of course he is the flopper...
It should have been a flagrant anyways. stop whining.
And it's that little because they have a set fine for flopping in the playoffs this year that increases with each additional foul.
For crying out loud ... One thing is, according to the rulebook, Allen's reaction to the foul should not play any role whatsoever in determining if it's a flagrant foul or not. Granted, maybe/probably refs are not completely immune to stuff like that. Still, it was Manu that put the refs in that position. He just was a tad too far behind and made a dangerous play (pretty clear if you watch the replays, I think). And are you seriously saying Allen/the Grizz were trying to set a precendent for a Spurs player being ejected??
Ira Winderman: The Ian Mahinmi foul was a grab of LeBron James' arm that the Sun Sentinel has learned has been upgraded by NBA to a Flagrant 1.
This just in! USA Soccer is interested in his services.
I disagree completely. Under the anti-flopping rule, "The primary factor in determining whether a player committed a flop is whether his physical reaction to contact with another player is inconsistent with what would reasonably be expected given the force or direction of the contact" Under that definition, Tony Allen committed a flop. Not his initial fall, but his reaction to it.
? I'm not sure what you're getting at with talking about Spurs players getting ejected. I said nothing about that.
Manu's play was actually not dangerous. He grabbed Allen's forearm, not his neck or chest or around the body. Allen had almost complete control over his own body and only fell over because he chose to keep his grip on the ball instead of let go of it. If he let go of his grip on the ball, Manu would've just pulled his arm down and Allen would've landed safely on his feet, resulting in just a regular foul call.
You can argue Manu should have let him go and not have tried to stop the layup, but Manu did not commit a flagrant, so I'm not going to sit here and act like he was wrong when he wasn't. It actually was the right play because if Allen missed 1 of 2, the Spurs were then up 3 and have had almost no pressure shooting their free throws.
It was not a flagrant, and should not have been called one. The only reason it was, was because of Tony Allen's fabricated reaction and feigning of an injury. And yes, I do think THAT kind of flopping should be an ejectable offense if repeated in the playoffs. Not exaggerating actual contact, but fabricating contact and/or faking injury to try and draw a call.
I see what the NBA did there.
Nothing against Allen as there many many worse flop players. But NBA has to get serious with flopping, otherwise it would ruin the game like it did with soccer.
The current rule of post-game review by the League and posing fines does not deter any player a bit. They have to give the discretion to the referees and make it a technique foul counted into disqualification. Say, you get one technique foul for arguing, another one for flopping, you are out.
Like those hands on face when the other player didn't even touch the player, or Harden/Martin's lateral fall to the floor after shooting when nobody touched them. Those kinds of flop are extremely damaging the game.
Not worried about the money. Face it, there's nothing that you can reasonable fine these guys for this type of offense that is going to make them flinch. But, the NBA is essentially saying, "Look, we saw that what you did is BS and we're going to be keeping an eye on you." Much more important than a fine.
at least the league acknowledged Allen flopped.
Read the rule book. Manu did not, could not, make a play on the ball, He's lucky he wasn't hit with a clear path but same results. The foul had nothing to do with the Spurs letting them score AGAIN. The bigger issue was the consecutive trips where Bonner got the ball at the top of the key and the rest of the team abandoned him like he's Allen Iverson up there, then the last second flail at the rim by Manu. Shot clock violation would have been preferable. Why do people feel they need to risk a turnover that leads to a break instead of making the opponent inbound the ball allowing your team to get back on defense?
Not even the small blind on the team bus.
5k? Wow I'm scared now!
Okay, then I misunderstood you on that point.
However, we still disagree about this:
So deliberately cheat and it's a $5,000 fine, but rest players and field a team playing totally fair and honest and it's a $250,000 fine? Right, that makes sense.
It's all about basketball revenue for $tern.
No prob man.
I still don't think it was dangerous though, because Allen still had more than enough control over his body to not fall like that. Manu was just trying to stop the shot from happening (a foul, but a legit basketball play), not trying to hurt the guy. There was no intent or followthrough. He just grabbed his forearm but Allen was so concerned with getting the shot up that he held onto the ball until he was already tipping over.
If Manu had grabbed his neck, chest, or waist and pulled him over, I would agree that it was dangerous. . .but his forearm? Allen has to create all the counterforce himself in order for Manu to actually pull him over that way.
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