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didnt brits was on the defense if USA didnt join in to help?
What ways could of the joined Allies lost?
If I understand it, if Britain was taking over early (with u boats and such) it would have been a devastating blow.
Are there any good books/do entaries to read on this?
Please list other ways Allies could have faltered and lost. I am intrigued by the history on this.
didnt brits was on the defense if USA didnt join in to help?
If Hitler hadn't tried to fight a war on two fronts and just took Moscow right away instead of attempting to fight through the brutal Russian winter
This. He could have avoided Stalin the entire war, correct me if I'm wrong. Hitler and Stalin had a truce I believe and Hitler, being an avid historian, wanted to make history with this move. The US likes to believe we altered the momentum and changed everything in the war, but the Soviet Union had a equally large role in ending both the Pacific and European wars.
The Fuhrer and Stalin signed a non-aggression pact way before the Blitz on Poland I think even though the war was basically inavoidable between Nazi and Bolshevik, the Germans could've delayed it until after the UK was down. Nazis had air superiority (or at least evenly matched with the Royal airforce) and I don't think the Dover channel was such an insurmountable barrier for Germans, it was just a ditch that could even be bridged with human bodies.
If England would've suc bed after the London/Coventry blitzes then things would've gotten interesting. Up to that point in 1940 things were looking beautiful for the Axis powers, but Germany invading the Soviet Union a year later--coupled with the Nips bombing Pearl Harbor--pitted 2 industrial superpowers against them far too soon.
A good doc on the Coventry Blitz:
Breaking the Japanese naval codes was the tipping point in the war in the Pacific. If they hadn't been able to do that they wouldn't have been able to ambush the Japanese navy at Midway. Losing 4 carriers was the beginning of the end for Japan and the turning point in the war.
Hitler moved some key armies away from the D-Day Normandy invasion. Tom Hanks would have blown up otherwise
Hitler attacking 2 fronts
If Hitler invested more resources in using advanced tech especially air/anti-air like jet bombers
If Germany was able to complete their atom bomb
Nazis invading or allying with South/Central America nations
Russia gives up
etc
The war would at least be prolonged
Last edited by Cane; 07-18-2013 at 12:42 PM.
Several mistakes. One was invading Russia. Napolean was spinning in his grave. The other was declaring war on the US after Pearl Harbor. The other was the mistake of not moving troops to Normandy which ultimately resulted in his executing Rommel, his finest General. Not putting the STG-44 into action. Using his resources to exterminate the Jews. Fire bombing London. Had in not done those things, just invaded France, southern Europe, northern Africa, he probably would have gotten away with that. Had Germany developed a long range bomber to deal with allied shipping rather than U-boats it probably would have worked better as well.
The scheme by the Allies to get the Germans to split their forces was brilliant. They created a fake "First Army Group" to be led by Patton and convinced the Germans it existed...when Patton was still in England after the Normandy invasion the Germans thought that invasion was a diversion and the real invasion would be by Patton at Pas de Calais. The result was they trickle reinforced the Normandy invasion defense always thinking that there would be a second invasion.
In a nuts : If Hitler listens to his generals it's over, and fairly quickly (in the west at least).
Also, I once read a book about an alternate scenario in Normandy. In that book the Germans brought their tank reserves to bear in decisive fashion and destroyed the Omaha beach head. It forced the Allies to abandon follow up landings and allowed the Germans to use forces from the Western theatre to stabilize the Eastern Front and sue for a separate peace with the Russians.
All of that said, I forget the name of the book.
It was a good one though.
Hitlers war with Russia was unavoidable. It was no secret that Stalin hated the Nazis, and vice versa. Stalin was in the process of having war plans drawn up as the Germans began Barbarossa. As it turns out, the Germans simply preempted the Russians.
The biggest mistake was going after France and England when they should have gone straight after Stalin. I mean no way anyone gives a about the Soviet Union considering we were in a shooting war with the Bolsheviks barely twenty years before. Giving Stalin two more years to prepare was monumentally stupid, but it was great for us since the Soviets were the ones who broke Nazi Germany after having those two extra years to prepare their army, artillery, armor, etc.
Could you guys imagine how ed we'd be without the Soviet resistance to the Nazis? The Wehrmacht could have just sent troops and bombers into Mexico to bring the war to our turf. I don't think he beats us, but he would have probably slaughtered our people the same he did the Russians.
If you haven't seen the series World at War, check it out. This series is a bargain at $50; it is probably at least 30 hours counting all the DVD extras, and since it was done in the 70s it has lots of interviews with the people who conducted that horrible war, including Hitler's secretary who was in his bunker for the last days.
http://www.amazon.com/The-World-30th.../dp/B0002F6AH0
The Iwo Jima episode is really amazing, and I also really liked the one about the Communist-Fascist civil war that was brewing in Weimar Germany right before Hitler came into power.
Saw a do entary saying that Nazi's probably would have won the race in getting the atom bomb...but chose to put attention to other war strategies as they felt it was years away and they would be winning the war at that point.
They would have gotten the bomb first but all of the jewish scientists left Germany and Europe. All of those people who developed the bomb for us were German Jews. If he'd have just left the Jews alone he'd have had the scientists to do the job. So anyway, lots of mistakes but that's how wars are won and lost. But man them Germans were and still are, something else. Greatest engineers on the plant. They have developed a new high capacity battery that charges quickly and holds a long charge. Along with this, they've put in enough solar to power the US. Once they get the battery technology in place, they're in business. Amazing people. Just drive a Mercedes or BMW if you don't think so. ( and no I'm not of German heritage so it's not just tooting my own genetic horn )
Last edited by ErnestLynch; 07-19-2013 at 02:59 AM.
Cool thanks cosm
The VWRC wouldn't allow any other outcome.
I don't see the logistics working there unforch. Barbarossa was a massive operation requiring unprecedented manpower and material. Any invasion of the US would have to had occurred on approximately the same scale. I think the US is in Hitlers grille long before he has the manpower to launch a substantive strike from Matamoros.
Hitler and Stalin didn't only have truce, they were actually allies.
They've attack and divided Poland according to Ribentropp-Molotov agreement. Germans attacted on Sep. 1st; Soviets attacted Poland on Sep. 15th. They,ve met in the middle and shaked hands (in a process Soviets mass murdored 20.000 Poland officers in Katyin forrest).
During 1940 Soviets supplied Germans with raw material and food. In this way they acctually logistically supported Hitlers invasion on West Europe. Kommunust cells in Europe got instruction to be frendly with Germans etc...
MUST SEE: The Soviet Story
Sorry, but this is crap!
So why Hitler anected Austria and invaded Czech republick and Poland in 1st place?
True is, that Hitler and Stalin were acctually colleagues..
Is there any conspiracy theory you don't swallow whole?
lol they never even made it to moscow because of the brutal Russian winter
Nobody ever watches the stupid bull you're constantly spamming the forum with
There were multiple "pivotal" moments. I would not underestimate how big the U.S. entering the war was. But yes, Hitler really screwed the pooch by invading USSR. Battle of Stalingrad basically turned the war. U.S. entering officially sealed the deal.
This is still my favorite WWII do entary.
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