My fam - that's not the point. The point is, because it was DPG, you immediately caught feelings and called me a monkey and dismissed my questions. Then plenty of other people agreed with the questions. Then actual NFL (or former NFL players) came out and asked the same questions. You don't have to agree, but to catch feelings off the jump towards DPG only to have many people (both on ST & in the NFL) pose the same legit questions is odd.
I am not blaming him either. Said so many times. But in your blind rage, you keep quoting random portions of my posts trying to paint a picture that is not there because you caught feelings. Again, I know this situation is infuriating and we all catch feelings from time to time, but damn.
you're coming off as very emo and immature right now because i won't pay your victim blaming any attention. YOU quoted Me with the victim blaming, going on and on about how you don't understand why he took the abuse. its not for us to understand, unless you've been a victim of this. there is no argument and i don't know what you're trying to gain from this other than attention from da gawd
- You must be playing dumb. It's a funny schtick though.
a schtick you've been pulling throughout this thread, doggie. sad.
Nah - not keeping score, but that is why many in the thread have agreed with the questions. So are Rolle and Chris Carter monkey's like me who ask passive aggressive dumb questions?
this guy can't be serious. i called you a monkey because you quoted me on some victim blaming bull and you called martin mentally and physically weak for allowing the bullying, harassment and extortion to go on...oh and you called him a beta for not standing up for himself. did carter and rolle say that? you aren't making any sense and its sad to watch you do this to yourself.
Nah fam - I very clearly said Martin was not to blame. Your issue was not with the answers to the questions, but the questions itself. You had issue that anyone could question if Martin was to blame or how he could allow this to happen. Regardless of the different ways to frame the argument, Rolle and Carter both asked the same questions (and Rolle in fact blamed Martin where I did not) that you deemed "stupid passive aggressive questions".
I asked how mentally weak do you have to be to allow this to happen. I didn't say he was mentally weak. I said it was beta behavior and that is what shocked me considering he is a well educated, wealthy, strong beast of a man. I said it doesn't make sense which is why those questions were valid.
You were praising a man who had a meltdown and walked out on his team while allowing himself to be bullied for over two years when he had the mental, physical & financial resources to end it much sooner as "handling it like a true professional". That's how this started and you caught feelings.
*Mic Drop*
You will continue to keep not paying my victim blaming any attention though by continuing to respond lol. Watch. I will not respond because I have already proven my point. But its funny how you shy away from calling Rolle/Carter out for asking the same questions..
paragraphs= feelings lol. keep the mic on the ground fam and please don't pick it up.
its not funny. its expected
how would i call them out lol? if they asked ME why MARTIN didn't speak up earlier then i would have the same response, i don't know and what diff does it make?
i bet if bob costas or somebody similar asked the same questions you'd be fuming tho
Underrated post.
The more I sit and think about it the more it feels like there could be more truth to this assertion than we know. Per Martin's wiki:
So not only are Martin's parent's lawyers, they are both big s...not some run of the mill ambulance chasers. I see the scenario going something like this...Incognito gets a little out of hand with his rookie hazing, Martin is talking to his parents about it and the conversation gets around to Incognito being an all around piece of , parents tell Martin to continue remain passive and perhaps display behavior that invites even more hazing...all while coaching him on ways to effectively collect evidence and then when the time is right...boom...calculated bomb.Martin's father, Gus Martin, is a Harvard University graduate and a professor of criminal justice administration at California State University, Dominguez Hills. His mother, Jane Howard-Martin, is also a Harvard graduate and is a corporate lawyer for Toyota.
I can see Martin cracking a smile as he is staring across the courtroom at Incognito during the civil suit while Martin's parents squeeze ass for millions. Perfect ending tbh.
I like this viewpoint. I'm rolling with this one.
BREAKING NEWS: DOLPHINS COACHES ASK ICOGNITO TO TOUGHEN UP MARTIN
Miami Dolphins' coaches asked player Richie Incognito, who was the offensive line's undisputed leader, to toughen up teammate Jonathan Martin after he missed a voluntary workout last spring, at least two sources told the Sun Sentinel.
The sources told the paper they believe that Incognito, who is accused of using racially incendiary language and bullying tactics against Martin, may have taken those orders too far.
It's not clear whether those marching orders will now become part of a pending investigation by the NFL into the Dolphins' locker room culture, and the alleged bullying that took place between Incognito and Martin.
"I'm just trying to weather the storm right now. This will pass," Incognito told WSVN-TV when reached outside a doctor's office.
Incognito has been suspended indefinitely by the Dolphins for conduct detrimental to the team for his tactics involving Martin, the team's 2012 second-round pick, who left the team last week and later accused the Dolphins of having an unsafe working environment.
Martin's smoking gun is a threatening, and racially offensive voice mail Incognito left him in April. In that voice message Incognito calls Martin, who is bi-racial, a "half n-----," threatened to slap his mother across the face, and uttered the words "I'll kill you."
Sources say that communication took place when Martin skipped two days of the team's OTA program, and Incognito was encouraged by his coaches to make a call that would "get him into the fold," one source said.
Even though OTA workouts are voluntary, the NFL culture forces coaches to strong arm the team's leaders to make sure everyone attends. Sources say Incognito was doing his job, but they admit he crossed the line.
"Richie is the type of guy where if he's on your team you love him," a teammate said. "If he's not on your team, you hate him. Every team needs a guy like that."
A Dolphins spokesman declined comment when told about Incognito's directives from the coaching staff, saying the franchise is fully cooperating with the NFL's independent investigation, which was requested by owner Steve Ross.
It is clear Incognito embraced his role as the team's enforcer and tough guy, his teammates said. However, nobody knew how troubling his relationship was with Martin, who started 10 straight games next to Incognito going back to the 2012 season, those same teammates added.
Martin abruptly left the team last week after a lunch room prank orchestrated by his fellow offensive lineman caused his emotional distress, and forced him to return to his California hometown, where he's receiving treatment.
The NFL Player's Association released a statement Tuesday saying it will monitor the NFL's investigation to ensure all the players the union represents, which includes Incognito, get a "fair investigation."
"We expect that the NFL and its clubs create a safe and professional workplace for all players and that owners, executives, coaches and players should set the best standards and examples," the statement read. "It is the duty of this union to hold the clubs and teams accountable for safety and professionalism in the workplace."
During Martin's rookie season he was nicknamed "Big Weirdo" by his teammates, and was forced to sport an embarrassing haircut given to him by the offensive linemen. He also forked over $15,000 for a veterans trip to Las Vegas he didn't attend.
The Dolphins traditionally hold rite of passage rituals for its rookies, and some of the team's antics – which included ridiculous haircuts, hair dying, and elaborate dinners paid for by the rookies – could be considered hazing. Those would make them a violation of the NFL's personal conduct policy.
Sources say players were annually directed by coach Joe Philbin to "cut out" the rookie hazing. Philbin comes from a Green Bay Packers culture where rookie hazing is minimal, or at least subtle. While Philbin tried to rein it in with the Dolphins, he and his coaching staff never policed it when the team was dying and shaving heads for the second straight training camp.
However, Philbin did insist that the rookies got decent haircuts before the team's first exhibition game, but that was after weeks of them sporting their embarrassing looks.
Linebacker Dannell Ellerbe indicated that Martin should have come to the leadership council with his problems, which apparently carried over to his second season. The problem is Incognito was also on the leadership council, and possessed a tremendous amount of power and influence.
That might explains why Martin hid his issues with Incognito, and on occasion hung around with him in South Florida, and during road trips. It is possible Martin felt he had to do so to feel accepted.
According to ESPN, Martin told former Stanford teammate Zach Ertz he planned to continue playing football. The Dolphins have kept him on the team's 53-man roster, and players have gone out their way to make sure he knows he's welcomed back.
If it's any kind of a big settlement, Martin will have it against the Dolphins and not Incognito himself. Incognito strikes me as the white trash type who blows everything he makes (total speculation), and it's not like he'll have future NFL wages to garnish
Yeah, if this is true then he has a fat claim against the Dolphins and is totally set. Philbin is also a total ing moron for going to Incognito as some kind of team leader
its like asking jerry sandusky to babysit for you while you go out of town lolYeah, if this is true then he has a fat claim against the Dolphins and is totally set. Philbin is also a total ing moron for going to Incognito as some kind of team leader
Sorry but Ireland deserves to be fired 10x more than Philbin imo. He's the one who's assembled this offensive line of severe character flaws (Pouncey, Martin, Incognito) while letting Jake Long go, and has had god knows how many ty draft picks since he was hired. He also hired Philbin, I've never understood when a coach gets fired but the GM who hired him keeps his job.
True, Ireland sucks ass too, they basically need a housecleaning from top to bottom at this point, tbh....
It's actually amazing how long Ireland still keeps his job based off the2008 Dolphins
I never thought the lawsuit would be against Incognito, it's been evident that Martin is going to sue not only the Dolphins, but also the NFL, tbh..
If I'm Martin, I'd claim to be bisexual, even if it's a lie, tbh..
Incognito has given himself a potential out, too, by blaming the coaches..I find it interesting that many Dolphins players have come to Incognito's defense, and most of them are Black..it should help his cause, if he plans on blaming the coaches throughout this ordeal..
The racial stuff didn't bother me a bit. It's almost silly to think it would bother an NFL player. I honestly agree with Ricky Williams. Martin is probably not cut out for the league if he has that thin of skin. It may not be in his genes to stand up to a "bully", but that may explain why he can't hold down a starting job on that line.
Last edited by Chinook; 11-06-2013 at 02:48 PM.
I'm loving all the player comments from the Dolphins and among the NFL community...even socially awkward Ricky Williams hit it out of the park.
I'm happy to see the camaraderie of the players fighting back against fake outrage.
Not new, but this is the stuff I find the most relevant:Ricky Williams (who played with Incognito) when asked what he would do if Incognito left him a voicemail calling him a "half-n*gger piece of sh*t":
"I'd call him back and say 'shut up you redneck' and then we'd both laugh about it." He also went on to say that "The NFL isn't made for everyone. There's a reason I left in 2004. The NFL wasn't what I expected it to be and I couldn't handle it at first."
Trevor Matich, who played in the league for 12 years, just said, when asked if he had ever seen anything close to the Incognito-Martin stuff, said "it's a matter of degree" and that "things which are completely inappropriate in the regular world are absolutely necessary in the NFL."
Cris Carter spoke to Mike Pouncey, a (black) Dolphins OL, and Pouncey said that they don't consider Incognito a racist and that they think it's unfair that he's being depicted as a racist and is not getting a fair shake. Said that Mike Wallace also agreed with that.
Pouncey, Wallace, and other Dolphin payers also said that Incognito was well-respected in the lockerroom and that they wish he was playing for them this Sunday. Also, that Martin had thought about quitting football before any "hazing" incidents had happened, and that his background coming from a rich, well-educated family may have played a role in that (Martin's "lack of commitment" to football).
Incognito took it too far but this kind of behavior isn't out of the ordinary in the NFL. The players recognize that there is a crazy guy in every locker room. Incognito happened to be that guy. You can say racist things and not be a racist. You can be completely PC and outwardly tolerant and still hate minorities. I don't think any of this has anything to do with racism. Dude is obviously a head, but heads are usually guys you want on your OL/DL, not a puss like Martin.
Take an anonymous poll of every player in that locker room, including the rookies, and ask them who they'd rather have on the team. Incognito or Martin? We all know how that would go. It would be Incognito.
Last edited by jag; 11-06-2013 at 02:53 PM.
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