The 2nd half rotation for tonight's game..

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Was this the worst rotation during a mid-season game in the Duncan era, tbh?..

Cory Joseph- elite D-league player that shouldn't be anything more than a 12th man

Matt Bonner- no longer a rotation player in the league, doesn't have any mobility remaining

Baynes- Great D-league player that shouldn't be anything more than a 14th/15th player on the roster

Nando De Colo- should not be playing in the NBA

God, that hurt to watch, tbh..

Tell us more about how great Malone and Jaeger are propping up lesser coaches. I love your generalizations, anecdotes and general bull .

[ElNono]

I dont' expect TP to play better than he is, currently atleast till late-March, April. Makes no sense for him to dial up effort and intensity at this stage of the season. What the Spurs are clearly lacking is athleticism and by relying on the "Big 3" to do the brunt of the scoring, they are only subjecting them to more and more fatigue. So what seemed a weakness (lack of backup 3) is now such a huge liability. The trade is clearly, for me, an inevitability.

RE: Parker, that's what I hope. A trade won't take the ball off his hands though. Not this season.

[HarlemHeat37]

Tell us more about how great Malone and Jaeger are propping up lesser coaches. I love your generalizations, anecdotes and general bull .

Baynes sucks, bro, sorry..

[AntiChrist]

It seems like just recently we had the best bench in the NBA. What the happened to that?

Manu can make the 2nd unit shine, but, hammy ...

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Baynes sucks, bro, sorry..

Such insight. I want more cliches!

[AntiChrist]

Baynes sucks, bro, sorry..

Truth bomb. That dude doesn't even know where to go. In the Heat game, he kept getting in Tim's way and ing up spacing.

[HarlemHeat37]

Such insight. I want more cliches!

so much anger because of a running inside joke in the NBA Forum about Black coaches..

[HarlemHeat37]

Truth bomb. That dude doesn't even know where to go. In the Heat game, he kept getting in Tim's way and ing up spacing.

He received most of his hype on ST due to stretches in the playoffs where he played good post D against Dwight Howard, on a Lakers team with no spacing and arguably the worst perimeter rotation in playoffs history..

[FuzzyLumpkins]

so much anger because of a running inside joke in the NBA Forum about Black coaches..

If it makes you feel better to generalize me as feeling as such then so be it. It runs about par for how much you really bring to the table.

And for a running joke you sure tried to argue it hard on merit. You normally do that? Back something up hard until it fails and then try and play it off as a joke? We both know that if Mem and Sac were rolling you would be pounding your chest.

I think you mistake a complete lack of respect with anger.

[AntiChrist]

He received most of his hype on ST due to stretches in the playoffs where he played good post D against Dwight Howard, on a Lakers team with no spacing and arguably the worst perimeter rotation in playoffs history..

Yep

[HarlemHeat37]

If it makes you feel better to generalize me as feeling as such then so be it. It runs about par for how much you really bring to the table.

And for a running joke you sure tried to argue it hard on merit. You normally do that? Back something up hard until it fails and then try and play it off as a joke? We both know that if Mem and Sac were rolling you would be pounding your chest.

I think you mistake a complete lack of respect with anger.

I do stand by it, it's been widely reported that Joeger designed Memphis's defense, and that Malone played a huge part in the Warriors' success, many people agree..

The Grizzlies have been depleted by injuries and they're actually playing really well since getting healthy, and the Kings don't have much talent, anyways..

I just find it humorous that you were so angered by it, tbh..

[apalisoc_9]

One of the biggeset downfall this year is Pop and the big 3 thinking there is still a big 3..Play wise.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I do stand by it, it's been widely reported that Joeger designed Memphis's defense, and that Malone played a huge part in the Warriors' success, many people agree..

The Grizzlies have been depleted by injuries and they're actually playing really well since getting healthy, and the Kings don't have much talent, anyways..

I just find it humorous that you were so angered by it, tbh..

You just said it was a joke.....

You are going to go the 'he's angry' response so this isn't worth more time

[DMC]

The system is built around a certain talent set that has some ability to flex, however it cannot be as nebulous as it is now and remain viable. Eventually the system is going to fail, especially when you put in enough players that A) don't play often and don't even practice with the team (in Nando's case) and B) aren't even the "bench" as we've grown to know them.

From the starters, down the list, it goes something like this:

Tony Parker - Doesn't trust teammates other than Tim and Manu, has ability to hero ball but doesn't seem to know when that should be used. Really the only redeeming quality of the team on many nights.

Tim Duncan - Still high basketball IQ but his body cannot do what his mind wants it to. Cannot defend against other bigs, cannot attack the rim effectively on most nights and seems to miss more PnR rotations than he ever did, probably because of his lack of foot speed. Either way, he's still our best big and should work for us if fully healthy, but not an anchor any longer (unless you mean boat anchor).

Tiago Splitter - Decent footwork, not very athletic for his size. Still too soft going to the rim and that flip shot is annoyingly passive. Still better than a lot of the bigs he goes against. Runs the floor well, sets good picks, plays the PnR well. He's not good enough to be a face though, just a role player who probably won't get much better. He can have good, productive nights though especially when the defense is focused on the perimeter shooters. Big enough to where his presence in the paint deters intruders, and plays good defense at the rim most of the time. Rotates well, knows the plays on offense and is a good passer.

Kawhi Leonard - Suffers from the opposite condition as Manu: his mind isn't convinced of his body's abilities so he's hesitant to do anything. Suffers from confusing team role. Currently in a Bermuda Triangle at the offensive end, gets lost between the big three. His injury notwithstanding, can be a big piece of the team but has been incredibly overhyped by both Pop and the fans here on this forum. He hasn't proven himself in enough tough situations to know whether he will ever get it. His quietness is often mistaken for being wise and listening to instructions. It could just be a lack of confidence.

Boris Diaw - One of the most capable, talented players on the team but basically apathetic to the game itself. His physical shape is evidence that he's not serious about it, even though his game is incredibly well developed. Seems comfortable hiding in the group and contributing in cherry picked moments. Has come on lately as a scoring threat, but with his abilities, there should be no reason for him to defer to Patty Mills or anyone else when he's got a one on one. Boris is, in my opinion, the "make or break" guy. His play is the real X factor.

Danny Green - Spot up shooter, decent transition defense and one of the best perimeter defenders on the team. Lower basketball IQ, tends to lack awareness of the current situation while the game is in progress (shot clock, paint, foul count, etc...) and often cheats off his man to try to get a break away. If healthy though, is a threat and spreads the defense.

Manu Ginobili - Injury plagued still, has more drive than ability now and like Tim, his body cannot do what his mind tells it to. High basketball IQ but in self denial about his tendencies vs his abilities. That leads to piss poor decision making (and some fantastic passes). Unlike his younger years, not able to overcome deficiencies through increased energy output at the other end. Spotty outside shooter, takes too many of them instead of taking it a few steps inside, but he's aware of it and takes what's given.

Marco Belinelli - Elite 3pt shooter, can sometimes get his own shot. Good ball handler, good finisher, cannot play a lick of defense so he's a one way player. We have too many one way players, but still, Marco is a big deal for the team this year. He cannot be a big minutes guy because he doesn't make the best decisions and only trades baskets, but good for spurts and an integral part of one of the best benches in the league.

Patty Mills - Energy player, decent BB IQ, hustles on every play, never takes a second off on either end but suffers from lack of size. Decent passer, not great. He does what we expect him to do.

Matt Bonner - Barely able to get up and down the court. Smarter than people give him credit for being, rarely makes bad passes however indecisive and non-compulsiveness makes him a liability in a fluid offense. His 3pt shot needs more room than ever to get off, and it's almost easier to just put in any other good 3pt shooter. Plays stiff defense, his size is a deterrent but not much.

Jeff Ayres - Bad hands, worst I've ever seen for a big. Not very intelligent where spacing and awareness are concerned. Doesn't seem to connect with the rest of the team on team defensive rotations and on offensive sets. Can dunk, that's almost his only asset. Gets a rebound now and again, but he has the athletic ability to do more and lacks the wherewithal to actually do it. Proof positive that athleticism < talent since Boris plays circles around him and has some of the best hands in the game.

Aron Baynes - Big, easily winded (size related or lack of playing time perhaps), probably could do more given the training time, better hands than you'd think, more agile than he appears to be. Spurs don't develop bigs very well, so he'll probably never see his full potential on this team. Just a foul pawn at the moment, even with the injuries.

Corey Joseph - Better PG than people give him credit for being, but incapable of going head to head against the former starting PGs of the leagues like Brooks or Fisher. Playing at a level higher than he should be, given he's basically just a really good D-league guy. Being a UT ex gives him more clout than he deserves.

Nando de Colo - Too soft, Spurs have enough soft Euro style players that just float around and look for easy layups. Doesn't do anything particularly well, but I've been impressed by his passing a en from time to time. Probably do good on a team where he gets more burn.

There are some in and out guys but there's not enough known about them to draw any meaningful conclusions about their impact to the team.

Team in general - Cannot get stops, relies on jump shooting and trick plays to get to the rim. Limited ability to post up. Relies too much on Tony's shooting percentage and Tim's obligatory, low percentage long 2pt attempts. Lacks a real iden y this season so far. Has been buoyed by their bench for too long in the season. If the starters are coasting, they might have fallen asleep at the wheel.

The RRT should allow some of these guys to make it or break it for their careers with the Spurs. I'd like to have Leonard playing with these "scrubs" as it would enable him to be the alpha on the floor. Then we'd get a good look at him over a few games and see what he can actually do. Either way, these guys might learn to play together and we could be better for it by the end of the season. That's what I'm telling myself anyhow. We have nothing to lose, as we are currently playing on house money.

[murpjf88]

Was this the worst rotation during a mid-season game in the Duncan era, tbh?..

Cory Joseph- elite D-league player that shouldn't be anything more than a 12th man

Matt Bonner- no longer a rotation player in the league, doesn't have any mobility remaining

Baynes- Great D-league player that shouldn't be anything more than a 14th/15th player on the roster

Nando De Colo- should not be playing in the NBA

God, that hurt to watch, tbh..

I know this is all one big joke to you being a Heat fan and all. I guess trolls will be trolls.

[AntiChrist]

The system is built around a certain talent set that has some ability to flex, however it cannot be as nebulous as it is now and remain viable. Eventually the system is going to fail, especially when you put in enough players that A) don't play often and don't even practice with the team (in Nando's case) and B) aren't even the "bench" as we've grown to know them.

From the starters, down the list, it goes something like this:

Tony Parker - Doesn't trust teammates other than Tim and Manu, has ability to hero ball but doesn't seem to know when that should be used. Really the only redeeming quality of the team on many nights.

Tim Duncan - Still high basketball IQ but his body cannot do what his mind wants it to. Cannot defend against other bigs, cannot attack the rim effectively on most nights and seems to miss more PnR rotations than he ever did, probably because of his lack of foot speed. Either way, he's still our best big and should work for us if fully healthy, but not an anchor any longer (unless you mean boat anchor).

Tiago Splitter - Decent footwork, not very athletic for his size. Still too soft going to the rim and that flip shot is annoyingly passive. Still better than a lot of the bigs he goes against. Runs the floor well, sets good picks, plays the PnR well. He's not good enough to be a face though, just a role player who probably won't get much better. He can have good, productive nights though especially when the defense is focused on the perimeter shooters. Big enough to where his presence in the paint deters intruders, and plays good defense at the rim most of the time. Rotates well, knows the plays on offense and is a good passer.

Kawhi Leonard - Suffers from the opposite condition as Manu: his mind isn't convinced of his body's abilities so he's hesitant to do anything. Suffers from confusing team role. Currently in a Bermuda Triangle at the offensive end, gets lost between the big three. His injury notwithstanding, can be a big piece of the team but has been incredibly overhyped by both Pop and the fans here on this forum. He hasn't proven himself in enough tough situations to know whether he will ever get it. His quietness is often mistaken for being wise and listening to instructions. It could just be a lack of confidence.

Boris Diaw - One of the most capable, talented players on the team but basically apathetic to the game itself. His physical shape is evidence that he's not serious about it, even though his game is incredibly well developed. Seems comfortable hiding in the group and contributing in cherry picked moments. Has come on lately as a scoring threat, but with his abilities, there should be no reason for him to defer to Patty Mills or anyone else when he's got a one on one. Boris is, in my opinion, the "make or break" guy. His play is the real X factor.

Danny Green - Spot up shooter, decent transition defense and one of the best perimeter defenders on the team. Lower basketball IQ, tends to lack awareness of the current situation while the game is in progress (shot clock, paint, foul count, etc...) and often cheats off his man to try to get a break away. If healthy though, is a threat and spreads the defense.

Manu Ginobili - Injury plagued still, has more drive than ability now and like Tim, his body cannot do what his mind tells it to. High basketball IQ but in self denial about his tendencies vs his abilities. That leads to piss poor decision making (and some fantastic passes). Unlike his younger years, not able to overcome deficiencies through increased energy output at the other end. Spotty outside shooter, takes too many of them instead of taking it a few steps inside, but he's aware of it and takes what's given.

Marco Belinelli - Elite 3pt shooter, can sometimes get his own shot. Good ball handler, good finisher, cannot play a lick of defense so he's a one way player. We have too many one way players, but still, Marco is a big deal for the team this year. He cannot be a big minutes guy because he doesn't make the best decisions and only trades baskets, but good for spurts and an integral part of one of the best benches in the league.

Patty Mills - Energy player, decent BB IQ, hustles on every play, never takes a second off on either end but suffers from lack of size. Decent passer, not great. He does what we expect him to do.

Matt Bonner - Barely able to get up and down the court. Smarter than people give him credit for being, rarely makes bad passes however indecisive and non-compulsiveness makes him a liability in a fluid offense. His 3pt shot needs more room than ever to get off, and it's almost easier to just put in any other good 3pt shooter. Plays stiff defense, his size is a deterrent but not much.

Jeff Ayres - Bad hands, worst I've ever seen for a big. Not very intelligent where spacing and awareness are concerned. Doesn't seem to connect with the rest of the team on team defensive rotations and on offensive sets. Can dunk, that's almost his only asset. Gets a rebound now and again, but he has the athletic ability to do more and lacks the wherewithal to actually do it. Proof positive that athleticism < talent since Boris plays circles around him and has some of the best hands in the game.

Aron Baynes - Big, easily winded (size related or lack of playing time perhaps), probably could do more given the training time, better hands than you'd think, more agile than he appears to be. Spurs don't develop bigs very well, so he'll probably never see his full potential on this team. Just a foul pawn at the moment, even with the injuries.

Corey Joseph - Better PG than people give him credit for being, but incapable of going head to head against the former starting PGs of the leagues like Brooks or Fisher. Playing at a level higher than he should be, given he's basically just a really good D-league guy. Being a UT ex gives him more clout than he deserves.

Nando de Colo - Too soft, Spurs have enough soft Euro style players that just float around and look for easy layups. Doesn't do anything particularly well, but I've been impressed by his passing a en from time to time. Probably do good on a team where he gets more burn.

There are some in and out guys but there's not enough known about them to draw any meaningful conclusions about their impact to the team.

Team in general - Cannot get stops, relies on jump shooting and trick plays to get to the rim. Limited ability to post up. Relies too much on Tony's shooting percentage and Tim's obligatory, low percentage long 2pt attempts. Lacks a real iden y this season so far. Has been buoyed by their bench for too long in the season. If the starters are coasting, they might have fallen asleep at the wheel.

The RRT should allow some of these guys to make it or break it for their careers with the Spurs. I'd like to have Leonard playing with these "scrubs" as it would enable him to be the alpha on the floor. Then we'd get a good look at him over a few games and see what he can actually do. Either way, these guys might learn to play together and we could be better for it by the end of the season. That's what I'm telling myself anyhow. We have nothing to lose, as we are currently playing on house money.

I don't really disagree with much of that.

[timtonymanu]

Yep not gonna anything done when you play guys that should be inactive.

[DMC]

I don't really disagree with much of that.

I'd probably add that Manu seems to lack the part of the brain that recognizes situation based priority. His goal is always the same. Score on one end, get the stop on the other. He's overcome it from time to time, so I have to be fair about it, but his drive to do those two things often overlaps the times in the game when he should do something else (e.g. Dirk foul, shooting early in shot clocks when the time is more important than the points, risky passes unnecessarily, etc...)

[AntiChrist]

I'd probably add that Manu seems to lack the part of the brain that recognizes situation based priority. His goal is always the same. Score on one end, get the stop on the other. He's overcome it from time to time, so I have to be fair about it, but his drive to do those two things often overlaps the times in the game when he should do something else (e.g. Dirk foul, shooting early in shot clocks when the time is more important than the points, risky passes unnecessarily, etc...)

Manu was a hero in that game until he fouled Dirk. A friend of mine told me Manu cried in the locker room after that game. He cares a lot about the team and is super-compe ive (like Tim), that's probably why I give him a pass on so many bone-headed decisions. He'd be willing to pass the torch to someone else, but what player on the Spurs is a good ball handler and passer?

[DMC]

Manu was a hero in that game until he fouled Dirk. A friend of mine told me Manu cried in the locker room after that game. He cares a lot about the team and is super-compe ive (like Tim), that's probably why I give him a pass on so many bone-headed decisions. He'd be willing to pass the torch to someone else, but what player on the Spurs is a good ball handler and passer?

It's not about blame. It's about having the wherewithal to not even contest that layup. Manu has to. It's like a dog that's trained to react, and just does. Manu just does. I'm sure he cried, a lot of people who do boneheaded things cry afterward.

[Chinook]

I thought Cory played well tonight. Ayres was awful. The idea that the team can afford to trade Splitter is laughable. But yeah, the team needs to find a way to get a strong two-way forward. I'm still on the Wilson Chandler wagon. But Thad would be good, too.

Really, no trade will save the Spurs. They're going to sink or swim with their top seven. Even though I think getting a legit four like Amir Johnson would be nice on paper, there's little room for four full-time bigs in a playoff rotation.

[ChumpDumper]

lol spurfan

[HarlemHeat37]

lol spurfan

What's up?..

[james evans]

Spurs left a lot on the table this off season and it's coming back to bite them. The record is still fine, but with a team this age and with the West wide open, they had the potential to have a very solid off season and secure a reasonable spot for a deep run. They left a lot on the table.

yeah, they chose loyalty over winning games. we have 16 million per season tied up in ginobli and ter.

[ThaBigFundamental21]

Not sure what great lineups most of you are hoping for? Everyone is hurt right now. We are without 4 very important pieces. Don't expect these D Leaguers to come in and tear it up on Defense let alone Offense. The Spurs have to ride out that storm right now. Soon Green and Splitter will be back and that is huge.

Aside from injuries, the Spurs IMO have no choice but to try and make a trade. IDRC who they have to part with outside of the Big 3. If they can trade a Diaw, Splitter, Marco, Green, or even Leonard to get "substantially" better then the Spurs should do it. IDC if it sounds crazy or not, you trade what you have if you can get better pieces, no matter how painful it may be. This is all or nothing this year. I'm not advocating trading these guys for moves that are damaging or lateral either, so don't start. It just so happens these are the best pieces we have, and if the Spurs can get a game changer they have to go for it. The FO needs to change their mentality to WIN NOW AT ANY COST. I don't know what they are thinking, but after next year, there is no Pop, there is no Tim, and there is no Manu. It's time we all realize this. This has been an amazing ride, but it is nearly over. I don't think it has sunken in to anyone yet. Maybe not even Tim, Manu, or Pop are thinking in those terms. But I'm sure it is in the back of everyone's mind. The FO needs to be aware and do their job.