He got into a public feud with Lance Stephenson when during our game there. I saw George Hill give up a layup to ATL out of frustration. At Miami yesterday Hill had 0 points. 4 Assists, 2 TO. Vs. ATL he had 0 Assists, 2 TO. This is the starting point guard. Now, I am a George Hill fan, and would welcome him back to the Spurs, except I don't see a fit here. But can he not fill a leadership role at the Pacers?
It's not about his leadership, at all, tbh..
He's a PG that can't dribble a basketball..when you watch a Pacers game, you see that they're always late getting into their sets and that they struggle mightily against full court pressure..their only guard that can penetrate off the dribble is Lance Stephenson, a cancer and one of the most overrated players in the league..
Larry Bird deserves a large portion of the blame for failing to address the issue..
Hill being better would make the Pacers better. Yes. But Hill is who he is at this point. It's Bird's fault for assuming that Hill would become more than that. They badly need to get a true PG or at least a less erratic playmaking SG.
Looking at the pacers they seem to have three serious issues. First is that they get very stagnant on offense and don't move the ball. This is because they don't have many real scoring threats or natural distributors. Paul George isn't quite ready yet, and he isn't the passer at small forward that Granger at his peak was, which means teams can concentrate on him more. Hibbert is streaky and prone to disappearing on offense and on the glass. Stevenson is J.R. Smith but more willing to play defense and with a bit less talent on offense. Hill is a good defender, but merely a competent ball-handler and a bit lacking in court vision for a point guard. He can put up pretty decent numbers on offense when there is ball movement, but when there isn't going to be the one to create points or start breaking down the defense.
West is getting older and less mobile, which being slightly undersized for his position hurts him more than for a bigger PF, it also means his playing closer in to the basket, which doesn't help him as a distributor, and can make it harder to get a pass to him.
Also since they only have one player who is really able to be counted on as an offensive first option, in George, at least 2 of the group of West, Hibbert, Stevenson, and Hill have to be having a decent night on offense for them to win. Otherwise all the defense in the world can't beat an above average team.
Their second issue is no true leader, George really needed another year before he would have been ready for the roll. West doesn't have the personality for it and neither does Vogal. Hill has the personality but can't do it as an only moderately talented fairly young player. Hibbert might be able to but hasn't stepped up. Bird definitely can't do it from the GM spot even though he has made a few attempts.
Finally their final issue is panic, though it is partially related to the first two. This is a team that depends on team scoring and ball movement for their offense, that sort of team, can't panic and fall into pointing fingers, it definitely can't go into isolation scoring mode to try and get their points.
Lot of blame to go around, tbh... easy to focus on Hill because his limitations are fairly evident, always have been... but:
- coach run them to the ground chasing that imaginary #1 seed bliss
- West can't back up what comes out of his mouth
- Stephenson thinks he's way better than he really is (typical cancer)
- Hibbert consistently underwhelms and then es about it
- George needs to stop feeding TMZ
Distractions, ing to the media...
They're a flawed team, but a lot of that stuff is still correctable and no team in this league isn't flawed one way or another, so they can still get it together heading into the playoffs.
I think they'll be ok, but they do need a true PG. They don't have a point forward type player and Hill is a 2 guard at best. He'd be ok off the bench to bring energy and push the pace, but the starting lineup needs to have a true point guard. Outside of that, no it's not George's fault. He's frustrated like everyone else, and Frank Vogel is overrated as a coach. He's got a deep bench and does nothing with it. He's got Hibbert and West on the floor at the same time, but doesn't use them because Paul George and Lance Stephenson are too busy playing Durant/Westbrook.
Solid take. Most of that can be attributed to the coach who can be attributed to the GM who can be attributed to the owner. It's amusing to me then that owners get less credit for team success than do coaches.
Pacers current situation is... the whole team is fading away and thats everybody fault not just Hill come on guys even when he is the weakest piece this team was the best ´till the last 25 games now the spark(peaking) is gone and happens, same with Portland its useless to blame one particular player when all of them are falling apart.
It's amazing to me that a mere 3 years ago I wanted him to be our starting point guard and for us to trade Tony Parker. I thought George Hill's size, length, and athleticism as well as his superior outside shooting and youth would be a better fit for the Spurs long-term than Parker, who was struggling back then.
But DAMN. George Hill has been a complete bust. His ball handling has always been suspect, even here in SA, but I thought he'd improve on that over time. Instead he's gotten even worse. Furthermore, his outside shooting has declined, and he just looks so much slower than he did when he was with us 3 years ago. To be frank, he's nothing more than a decent/below average point guard right now, which is stunning.
I think he deserves A LOT of blame for the Pacers situation. He's one of the many critical pieces on their team who has very little talent (Hibbert and DWest being the other two). I mean when you have a point guard who turns the ball over constantly, doesn't have a consistent outside shot, and is too slow to drive to the basket? Damn. But in his defense, Paul George controls the ball a lot on the offensive end, and the Pacers as a whole are just a team with very little talent and and no shooters. And they don't have a bench to speak of. Talent wise I'd say they're around 20-25 out of the 30 teams in the NBA. Stunning for a team with such a gaudy record. But then again, that's what happens when you play 2/3 of your games vs the East.
They rely greatly on Lance ing Stephenson. That's the root of their problems, as well as George and Hibbert crashing back to Earth.
Hill isn't very good, but they have bigger problems to address
The number one culprit is Hibbert the mental midget... Guy is getting the max and is supposed to be in his prime yet he sucks balls and cries publicly about his teammates flaws... Also losing Granger and adding Turner and Bynum who are total opposite to blue collars was a bad idea, obviously ed up their chemistry...
Once Stephenson is gone this summer they become a treadmill team tbh...
Stephenson is one of Larry Bird's favorite players...so who knows what that does in the locker room when it seems pretty obvious that the other players have issues with the guy...
George Hill was always over-rated here, imo. As said in so many places by so many people, Pop's system makes a lot of players look better than they are/were/would be in another system. E.g., see Green, Danny; Diaw, Boris;Mills, Patty; etc. etc. etc.
George Hill was another 'system' success. But the offense always suffered when he was in charge of it here. Whenever Tony went out for whatever reason, the offense got stagnant and George would dribble around and around and around before figuring out what to do. Pop loved him because he was a hard worker. Pop always loves hard workers.
I don't think he's working as hard any more.
I think their coach messed them all up this year, but georgie didn't help at all.
It's unreal how bad Roy Hibbert has become, tbh..
He was always overrated, but at least he was showing significant offensive improvements by working with Timmy, etc..
Not only has his game collapsed, but he has become a locker room cancer with his interviews..telling the media that the locker room has some selfish players is a selfish move in itself, and demonstrates a lack of maturity..
this is a good post but I would argue that West absolutely has the personality to be a leader and is their leader in the same way Eric Snow and Aaron McKie were the real leaders of those Sixer teams. The bigger question is whether it's important that your leader is one of your 1-2 best players, which I think it is.
I think most people really underestimate Indiana's lack of overall talent, tbh..
Everybody seems to ignore the fact that they had the easiest or 2nd easiest schedule in the NBA during the 1st half of the season, along with George/Stephenson/Hibbert playing way above their heads..
George Hill is receive blame for Indiana to be bad but other George (one with pic on shemale computer) is more to blame. Also hill is give us pick to get Kawhi who very good and soon be top 10 and Charle Barkley is say on TNT
I agree, I don't think George Hill is working as hard as when he was with us. I know Tim Duncan caught heat from this forum for working out with Roy Hibbert during the offseason. But now I think it might have been Tim Duncan that benefited from using Roy Hibbert to hone his game - who is going to give him that kind of burn? I don't think Tiago Splitter is as good as Roy Hibbert, although I'm happy with having Tiago Splitter.
I do think in hindsight that trading Danny Granger had a hugely negative impact.
Hill should not receive much of the blame for the Pacers collapse. He was not overly responsible for their success, so he shouldn't get blame for their fall. This is on Paul George and Roy Hibbert. Hibbert has the physical tools to be a dominant NBA player, but he has never been able to play well consistently.
Yeah, the Pacers lack talent or in the very least have very flawed talent. Their lack of a viable offensive system makes that lack of talent even worse. They have to rely on fluke performances and Hibbert hiding behind the verticality rule to win.
This tbh. Can't believe how much he's dropped off in such a short amount of time. He looks awful.
It seems strange that so many in the media still have Hibbert as the obvious choice for DPOY, when lately he's looking like a poor man's Tiago Splitter
It's not really Hill's fault. He is a SG on offense, and a good one. Fine outside shooting, driving, FT's. But he's not a PG, has no vision and struggles passing the half court. It was hard to believe the Pacers choosed him as their starting PG. Bird and Vogel should have noticed that.
i agree. I think a player like Jameer Nelson would have been a much better get than Evan Turner. Nelson is a much better P&R player and is posting 7 APG to 2.4 T.Os per game.
Turner can't shoot or defend and needs the ball to be effective.
The Suns made Bird look like a clown by acquiring Scola (who is in decline) for a 1st round this season (currently 26th) Plumlee (a 2012 1st rounder) and Gerald Green.
For all of the work to improve their bench its still pretty damn bad not to mention their offense is a joke.
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