To me Nash is clearly the top PG in the post-Jordan era. As debatable as they were, those two MVP awards put him in a completely different level. Kidd got to the finals twice while being the centerpiece of a team, but coming out of a horrible Eastern Conference. I don't think they would've made it out of the first round in the West those two years. Actually, Nash's Suns would've blown them out of the water, IMO. Indeed he managed to lead them to 54 victories (more than Kidd ever won leading the Nets) with a starting five completed by Bell, Marion, Diaw and Kurt Thomas / James Jones.
They are both #3 at their respective positions post-Jordan. 3- TP, 2- Nash, 1- J. Kidd. 3- Manu, 2- D-Wade, 1- Kobe. Does anyone think either crack the top 10 point guard/shooting guard lists of all-time? I think Manu & Tony are at best #9 or #10, but I def. think both are top 15 ever for their positions. Thoughts?
People still falling for Gino-Step's shtick.
1. Nash
2. Paul(durability and style of play is a concern, otherwise he would be #1)
3. Kidd(one of the most overrated players of my lifetime, though)
4. Parker
1. Kobe
2. Wade(although his quick decline may affect his legacy, depending how you value peak vs. longevity)
3. Ginobili
4. Carter
Nash played no defense and his team never had success in the playoffs.
You have to look at both sides of the court because if takes both to win.
Nash made it three times to the Western Conference Finals. That's significantly more success than advancing to the finals after beating a 50-wins' Detroit in the pre-Sheed era and a 49-wins' Boston in the freaking Antoine Walker era.
This is not competing against a clock. There are opponents involved.
And his defense (or lack thereof) was good enough to make the Suns a contender, a tougher contender than the Nets ever were.
Nash's defense isn't a major problem at the PG position, tbh..
Most teams use their wing players to defend great PGs nowadays, and opposing teams rarely have 3 perimeter players that can create their own shot to expose the mismatch on the switch, tbh..
Parker's inability to shoot 3s and Kidd's inability to score for himself at a high level are bigger flaws than Nash's defense IMO..
I couldn't disagree more with that statement
Dude this is a PG league
No, it isn'tDude this is a PG league
PG is the easiest position to shut down(unless you're a 6'9 Magic Johnson), as we have seen throughout history..
That doesn't really affect my statement, though..most of the time, a SG or SF will guard the PG, when it's necessary..
When the Suns played the Spurs they had to put Marion or someone else on Parker because Nash couldn't handle him. That created mismatches in other places. You can 't say it doesn't 't matter if a PG can't play defense. If they had won a championship, or gotten close , it might be different. Nash was overrated, should never have won a MVP. He had great numbers because of their pace and style. That style didn't win.
I guess Chauncey Billups isn't even in the discussion, even though he is the guy with the Finals MVP. But I guess defense "doesn't matter" at the PG position. Or rather it doesn't matter in fantasy basketball, it only matters in winning real championships.
Nash won plenty, and he was an Amare-Diaw suspension away from potentially winning a le
Marion guarded Parker for the same reasons Sefolosha did in 2012, and Lebron did in 2013 and 2014..an athletic wing player can shut down a PG, while the opposing PG generally can't do it..
The Spurs used Bowen on Nash a lot, or whenever it was critical. So do lots of other teams on lots of other elite PGs, like Thompson on CP3, Green on CP3.
You all are missing my point that players blew by Nash and he was a defensive liability. I can 't say that a guy who was way below average at half the game can be the best at his position in 25 years.
Yeah, but that's why the the thread is based on skill & talent. Who guarded CP3, Nash and Kidd. It wasn't Parker most of the time. We either had Bowen, Leonard or Green on those guys. Let's not act like that doesn't matter.
Parker defended Nash quite a bit.
Yeah, until he was getting torched and Pop put Bowen on him. Maybe my memory serves me wrong, though. I remember Bowen being most of the reason the Spurs held Nash somewhat in check. Plus, Tony had Timmy one of the GOAT defenders as second line of defense.
I think Nash is significantly better than Parker. You put Nash on the Spurs and I think the Spurs have 7-8 les.
I believe in terms of skill and talent Parker is ahead of Nash, Kidd and CP3. He is a more complete player and has no major flaws. His ability to get to the basket is the best of all 4. He has a consistent mid range jumper. He just shot over. 40% 3 pt on finals. He has become a good passer. He doesn't 't have the assist numbers the other 3 had , but the Spurs offense makes more passes and spreads the ball around. CP3 is mentally weak and melts down sometimes. Also he is below average defensive player. Parker has a good argument.
I'm with you on CP3. I think Parker is better than him. But IMO Nash > Parker at scoring (Nash couldn't finish at the rim like Parker, but he makes up for it with his shooting) and passing (obviously). Defensively, Nash was very average, but since most of the time both guys are guarding the other team's worst wing player (e.g. Nash guarding Bowen), I don't believe it's as much of a factor.
True true. Not every team has both a good PG and a SG, you could've always hid Nash on one of them... I still don't think Nash deserved that 2nd MVP though IMONo, it isn't
PG is the easiest position to shut down(unless you're a 6'9 Magic Johnson), as we have seen throughout history..
That doesn't really affect my statement, though..most of the time, a SG or SF will guard the PG, when it's necessary..
Check the ing scoreboard.
You earn your name during the season. You earn your fame in the playoffs.
Parker dumb s. Chris Paul, Steve Nash and Jason Kidd.
There's no way Parker is better than prime Nash dude won back to back MVPs, he was brilliant, I'd also take prime Kidd over Parker
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