And for the record I love his natural talent. I saw him play as a kid in the Olympics (pre dream team) the guy was like a 7 foot Lebron (as a pure athlete) though not as bulky.
Yeah he did make the playoffs 5 years prior in his prime. And to insinuate Hakeem needed 3 point shooters to even make the playoffs or win a ring when he was putting up 31, 11, and 4 against Magic, Kareem, and Worthy and then going up against Bird/McHale/Parish in his second year in the league is laughable.
Coincidentally, Hakeem made the finals in 86 with a ty squad and no three point shooters.
Though your Kirby looks comfortable in the bag.
lol 94 it was a one man team. Don't act like he had more help than in 86.
Good morning, slope!
. He didn't make the playoffs 4 years prior. I guess the use of approximation in language is something you are. It familiar with. Next thin you know, I will be accused of being off by a couple of days because you know, the 91 and 94 playoffs didn't start on exact days.
And no, I am not insinuating Hakeem's can't make the playoffs without three pointers, I am insinuating Hakeem can't make the playoffs with a crap team, like every single player who ever played in the game.
You are throwing the entire 86 squad to prop up Hakeem? Good for you. Apparently throwing Rudy t, also known as the only coach who ever got the rockets a championship, under the bus is not enough for you.
The rockets were an up and coming team before the NBA got scared that it will kill their Lakers golden goose and suspended all those athletes who matches up with LA for drug use. They were also slightly. Slow average in 3p% and above average in 3pm that year. So no they did HAVE 3p shooting.
94 rockets were a 6th seed? Why do I know more about rockets history off the top of my head than you do? You should have your rockets fan privileges revoked.
LOL...it's an honest mistake I'm guessing. Take it easy...
And no, I am not insinuating Hakeem's can't make the playoffs without three pointers, I am insinuating Hakeem can't make the playoffs with a crap team, like every single player who ever played in the game.
You are throwing the entire 86 squad to prop up Hakeem? Good for you. Apparently throwing Rudy t, also known as the only coach who ever got the rockets a championship, under the bus is not enough for you.
The rockets were an up and coming team before the NBA got scared that it will kill their Lakers golden goose and suspended all those athletes who matches up with LA for drug use. They were also slightly. Slow average in 3p% and above average in 3pm that year. So no they did HAVE 3p shooting.
94 rockets were a 6th seed? Why do I know more about rockets history off the top of my head than you do? You should have your rockets fan privileges revoked.
Let him answer the question. It's akin to me saying the Spurs won in 02. It's not acceptable.LOL...it's an honest mistake I'm guessing. Take it easy...
Your logic offends re ed people. Hakeem made the playoffs every year of his prime, except for 1 ( when he was hurt) , being that most of his career was playing with ty teams, one example (88-89) when the next best players on that team were Thorpe, Sleepy Floyd, and Mike Woodson
And no, I am not insinuating Hakeem's can't make the playoffs without three pointers, I am insinuating Hakeem can't make the playoffs with a crap team, like every single player who ever played in the game.
The 86 squad was destroyed by drugs and injuries, the second best player in that finals series wasn't Sampson, it was Rodney McCrayYou are throwing the entire 86 squad to prop up Hakeem? Good for you. Apparently throwing Rudy t, also known as the only coach who ever got the rockets a championship, under the bus is not enough for you.
The rockets were an up and coming team before the NBA got scared that it will kill their Lakers golden goose and suspended all those athletes who matches up with LA for drug use. They were also slightly. Slow average in 3p% and above average in 3pm that year. So no they did HAVE 3p shooting.
94 rockets were a 6th seed? Why do I know more about rockets history off the top of my head than you do? You should have your rockets fan privileges revoked.
His advanced stats were out of this world. The problem though, is that he played out of position his entire career. Robinson was a PF, even a SF, not a C. But in those days, you are a center when you are 7 feet tall.
Robinson playing a role similar to Garnett, or even Karl Malone would be unstoppable. Having him go pick and roll, shoot 18 footers, pass out of the high post, do cuts and alley-oops would have him destroy the entire league. Larry Brown knew how to use him, but then he left. Jerry Tarkanian, Lucas, and Bob Hill didn't know how to use him, and were all way below average NBA coaches (wit that 2 out of the 3 couldn't even land an NBA head coaching job after all those 50 win seasons with the Spurs, and Lucas just sucked).
Robinson was a superb athlete who didn't really have a natural feel for the low post game, he still played like a top 25 player of all time playing out of position his entire career. That's how good he was.
Imagine sticking Garnett or Karl Malone at center, they wouldn't have the same level of success they did throughout their career, either.
Tarkanian coached maybe 20 games bro.
I'd say we can agree on this, you seem to be offended.
The Rockets probably would have made the playoffs in 91 if Hakeem played a full 82 as an 8th seed, but he still played almost 60 games that season, and the team generally stunk. The West was generally weak in that era as well, basically what is opposite to what we have now.Hakeem made the playoffs every year of his prime, except for 1 ( when he was hurt) , being that most of his career was playing with ty teams, one example (88-89) when the next best players on that team were Thorpe, Sleepy Floyd, and Mike Woodson
And you are trashing on Thorpe? Really, Otis Thorpe? The guy wasn't the next Kareem, but he was a solid 17/10 guy who does a bunch of dirty work in the middle. Solid defensive player. He was as good as, if not better than Elliott, who happened to be the best teammate Robinson had during his entire prime. And yet players who played with Hakeem but was better than Thorpe included Drexler (past his prime, but still better), Sampson (only for a short period of time). Others on the same tier include Rodney McCray, Lewis Lloyd, and to an extent, Mitc Wiggins (too bad he got hooked on the stuff). The 86 Rockets team was a team of long, athletic wings flanking the twin towers. Lacks a bit of playmaking, but that was a dynamic team that matches up perfectly with the Lakers. Well, too bad Stern had ideas of propping up the Lakers and suspended all those matchup nightmares the Lakers had. I find it hard to believe that none of the hard-partyers on the Lakers ever got caught, while a number of Rockets and Roy Tarpley from the Mavs (who also happen to match up well against the Lakers) were caught.
You comparing 86 3pt shooting to 95 3 pt shooter shows that:The 86 squad was destroyed by drugs and injuries, the second best player in that finals series wasn't Sampson, it was Rodney McCray
a) My first sentence of this post was correct
b) You didn't even take into account the shorter 3 pt line
c) You had no appreciation of the way the league used the three point line over the years.
For point c, the league use in 3 pters EXPLODED after the b2b championship winning system implemented by Rudy T. That system wouldn't have worked without Hakeem, but Rudy T introduced an element that was widely underused in the league up to that point, and it was the use of 3 pt shooters around a dominant inside.
You can compare 3 pt shooting, especially on a team basis, across different eras of basketball. The league, on average, shot 28% from 3 in 86. The league shot an average of 33% from 3 in 94, and 36% in 95. That transformation continued. Despite the league ending the shorter three point line, the league still shot 36% from 3 last year, and 3pta exploded during that time. You would never see players shoot 8 3pa/gm in the 80s. In fact, 14 of the 20 3pa/gm shooting seasons were after 2000, with 5 of the remaining 6 with the shorter three point line. The only exception was Michael Adams, who played with the run and gun Westhead Nuggets who got the green light to shooter whatever he liked, because the team sucked.
In terms of Ralph Sampson, I really hoped you watched that series. Sampson struggled because he was the focus of defense for the Celtics. The Celtics was a great internal defensive team with McHale, Parish and Walton. Even the great Hakeem "struggled" with 48% shooting for the series. Kudos to Hakeem for still being clearly the best player on the Rockets, but to dismiss and say that McCray was the 2nd best player based purely on points scored and FG% is, as you would put it, re ed. Sampson put up impressive passing and rebounding in that series, but he ultimately choked. That is no surprise, but he was a HUGE part of why the Rockets made the finals in the first place.
Because he sucked as a pro coach. The only thing he was right on was the Spurs PG situation sucked so much that it was not even worth coaching.
/thread
i wasn't exactly an avid NBA watcher during the 80's and 90's so i'm not going to pretend i know the answer to this question. they both have monstrous numbers, hakeem had more team success in his prime, robinson won when tim came around.
my main observation is that people take the 95 WCF and run with it as if one playoff series is the determining factor when ranking players.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/...S.html#SEA-HOU
Thunder fans can now legitimately say Kemp > Hakeem.
One series, sonics swept the rockets AND Hakeem got waxed by kemp.
As long as Duncan>Kobe, the universe is in perfect harmony. Let us proceed Dale, I'll carry your hand if you want me to.
To me the determining factor was Olajuwon winning it all twice as the best player on the team while DRob got owned by Utah.
Kobe: 5
the tired old bag Duncan: 5
& his own failings. There is a time to put the good book aside---pick up the hammer, take up the tong. Duncan did it for him. Now, that man is "tired" and was carried by his "Duncan"...Leonard.
You should probably find the nearest cliff and attempt your best Peter Pan.
Duncan:
5 rings
3 FMVPS
2 MVPS
Kobe:
5 Rings
2 FMVPs
1 MVP
Boiled down:
Duncan>Kobe
I know it's painful to see all those tiebreakers going Timmy's way, but it is what it is Dale. You must have had flashbacks of American choppers leaving Vietnam for good when you saw Duncan surpass Kobe last June 14, 2014. If you survived Vietnam, you will surely get over Duncan>Kobe pretty quickly. Now, let us proceed.
Fine. You take that. Me? I'm dancin' with who brung me.
Kobe: 5
the tired old bag Duncan: 5
Rockets won twice. Spurs lost to Utah.
Name me one single center who ever won a le with a starting point guard who made a single three pointer in his entire playoff career.
Not saying Robinson > Hakeem, but Robinson was put in an environment to fail, much like Hakeem in the late 80s early 90s.
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