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  1. #251
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    And another predictable response...

    NRA Board Member: Slain Pastor Is to Blame for Deaths in Charleston Shooting

    We saw this coming, yet it is still shocking: Less than 24 hours after Dylann Storm Roof murdered nine people—including South Carolina state senator Clementa Pinckney—inside a Charleston church, NRA board member Charles Cotton blamed the deaths on… South Carolina state senator Clementa Pinckney.
    Writing on TexasCHLForum.com, a forum at which he is an administrator, Cotton stated, "[Pinckney] voted against concealed-carry. Eight of his church members who might be alive if he had expressly allowed members to carry handguns in church are dead. Innocent people died because of his position on a political issue."

    Since we're dealing in hypotheticals, Mr. Cotton, what if the late Pastor Pinckney wasn't a character from a lazily-written action film? What if he, as most human beings might when suddenly thrown into a disorienting maelstrom of random violence, had missed after pulling out his concealed handgun? And what if he'd hit another innocent church-goer?
    Or what if he'd dropped the gun while fumbling for it amid all the chaos? What if a kid or someone in shock from the mayhem had picked it up and tried to be a hero? What if someone walking by had heard the gunfire inside the church and stopped by with their Glock? How would the good guys have known whether this new guy was a good guy or a bad guy?
    How many bullets do we need to fire into a hail of bullets before we say enough?

    http://www.esquire.com/news-politics...ooting-pastor/


  2. #252
    Veteran vy65's Avatar
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    Neh, just a sidebar on a crazy comment that you didn't think through before posting, Ripper.
    Is calling me the ripper supposed to be an insult? because it doesn't come off that way at all

  3. #253
    Veteran vy65's Avatar
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    The problem with legal rape is you can't really do it in a vacuum. Is it assault to knock her out first? Or is assault allowable as a precursor to sexual assault?
    I mean, they usually give a +1 if you've started your move to the basket, even though you're not technically in a shooting motion, right?

  4. #254
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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  5. #255
    Veteran vy65's Avatar
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    Uh it helps deter people from becoming criminals.

    Like you, Ripper.
    Congrats on just now figuring out my point.



    I'm specifically looking at the South Carolina policy that allows private sales of guns to happen without background checks.

    Cracking down on that bull policy would be a solid start here.
    Maybe so, maybe no. Some measure of control might help in other cir stances - but this fool pretty clearly was gonna kill him some nigs regardless of how stringent or lax SC's gun control laws are.

  6. #256
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    white Christian supremacists LYING about persecution of Christians

    white gun fellators LYING about guns NOT killing people.

    Repugs groveling to both groups AND ignoring that BLACKs were killed because they were BLACK, not because they were Christians

    Absolutely no such sicko crap on the non-Repug side of the country.

  7. #257
    Grab 'em by the pussy Splits's Avatar
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  8. #258
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    That is an answer. You can have strict, effective gun control and not outlaw guns, as has been successfully done in Australia. This kid walked into a gun store and out with a .45. A real background check would have prevented that from happening.
    Australia does not have effective gun control. Since they implemented it, assaults have increased by 40%, sexual assaults have increased by 20%, and armed robberies have increased by 20%. In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms have increased by 300%. A University of Melbourne study found that gun control has had no significant effect on the national rate of gun homicides. Australia is no safer than they were before gun control.

  9. #259
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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  10. #260
    Grab 'em by the pussy Splits's Avatar
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    Australia does not have effective gun control. Since they implemented it, assaults have increased by 40%, sexual assaults have increased by 20%, and armed robberies have increased by 20%. In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms have increased by 300%. A University of Melbourne study found that gun control has had no significant effect on the national rate of gun homicides. Australia is no safer than they were before gun control.
    Abstract

    Background: After a 1996 firearm massacre in Tasmania in which 35 people died, Australian governments united to remove semi-automatic and pump-action shotguns and rifles from civilian possession, as a key component of gun law reforms.

    Objective: To determine whether Australia’s 1996 major gun law reforms were associated with changes in rates of mass firearm homicides, total firearm deaths, firearm homicides and firearm suicides, and whether there were any apparent method subs ution effects for total homicides and suicides.

    Design: Observational study using official statistics. Negative binomial regression analysis of changes in firearm death rates and comparison of trends in pre–post gun law reform firearm-related mass killings.

    Setting: Australia, 1979–2003.

    Main outcome measures: Changes in trends of total firearm death rates, mass fatal shooting incidents, rates of firearm homicide, suicide and unintentional firearm deaths, and of total homicides and suicides per 100 000 population.

    Results: In the 18 years before the gun law reforms, there were 13 mass shootings in Australia, and none in the 10.5 years afterwards. Declines in firearm-related deaths before the law reforms accelerated after the reforms for total firearm deaths (p = 0.04), firearm suicides (p = 0.007) and firearm homicides (p = 0.15), but not for the smallest category of unintentional firearm deaths, which increased. No evidence of subs ution effect for suicides or homicides was observed. The rates per 100 000 of total firearm deaths, firearm homicides and firearm suicides all at least doubled their existing rates of decline after the revised gun laws.

    Conclusions: Australia’s 1996 gun law reforms were followed by more than a decade free of fatal mass shootings, and accelerated declines in firearm deaths, particularly suicides. Total homicide rates followed the same pattern. Removing large numbers of rapid-firing firearms from civilians may be an effective way of reducing mass shootings, firearm homicides and firearm suicides.

    http://injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/12/6/365.full

  11. #261
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    The 1996-97 National Firearms Agreement (NFA) in Australia introduced strict gun laws, primarily as a reaction to the mass shooting in Port Arthur, Tasmania in 1996, where 35 people were killed. Despite the fact that several researchers using the same data have examined the impact of the NFA on firearm deaths, a consensus does not appear to have been reached. In this paper, we re-analyze the same data on firearm deaths used in previous research, using tests for unknown structural breaks as a means to identifying impacts of the NFA. The results of these tests suggest that the NFA did not have any large effects on reducing firearm homicide or suicide rates.

  12. #262
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    we ain't Australia

  13. #263
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    we ain't Australia
    Exactly, so lib s should stop pointing to Australia and their failed gun control laws to justify their agenda.

  14. #264
    Grab 'em by the pussy Splits's Avatar
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    we ain't Australia
    That's right, we're PROUD of our mass shootings!

    USA! USA!

  15. #265
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Exactly, so lib s should stop pointing to Australia and their failed gun control laws to justify their agenda.
    pointing at Australia supports you less than you think, first of all because it's cherry-picking: the comparison with Europe is hardly so favorable.

    also, similar policies will vary in their effects from country to country for political, social and cultural reasons. what didn't work in Australia might have beneficial effects here. what works in Europe might not work here.

  16. #266
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    That's right, we're PROUD of our mass shootings!

    USA! USA!
    Blake didn't answer this earlier & maybe you can because you have a similar opinion, but in a state like GA with these laws, are these shooting more common than in other states with stricter gun laws?

    Also, even in GA with these gun laws, do these types of shootings outweigh other crimes/murders by non-guns? Just trying to assess whether the problem is gun law or racisim.

  17. #267
    Deandre Jordan Sucks m>s's Avatar
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    No, shootings are most common in places with the strictest gun control like Chicago and New York

  18. #268
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
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    Oh he did legally buy a gun? Guess that changes nothing from the gun nuts, they'll obfuscate and come up with another excuse.
    You can't legally buy a gun as a felon. And if he did in fact buy it from a gun store South Carolina dealers are required to do background checks so either the gun dealer committed a crime, the background check failed to show his felony (), or his father bought the gun and gifted to him.

    http://smartgunlaws.org/background-c...outh-carolina/

  19. #269
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
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    pointing at Australia supports you less than you think, first of all because it's cherry-picking: the comparison with Europe is hardly so favorable.

    also, similar policies will vary in their effects from country to country for political, social and cultural reasons. what didn't work in Australia might have beneficial effects here. what works in Europe might not work here.
    I agree with this

    Does Australia have a similar urban black population? Considering 54% of US murders are committed by 12% of the population that is a pretty significant difference when comparing statistics between Australia and the US.

  20. #270
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    "I am Irish. For many years in my native land the Rev. Ian Paisley spouted bigoted hatred about Catholics in Northern Ireland, but then claimed innocence when some militant sectarian group massacred Catholics. Speech was not murder, he said. He would never condone killing, he said. Then he went right back to feeding the at udes that spawned the killing. Few were fooled.

    We should not be fooled in America today.

    In this country the "mainstream" right-wing has made an industry of demonizing African-Americans as "thugs" and criminals - just look at the divergence in tone between the recent coverage of Ferguson or Baltimore and the (mostly white) biker massacre in Waco, TX. For decades, white America has been told that black Americans are lazy leeches, dependent on hand-outs funded by your hard-earned taxes to bankroll their immoral lifestyles.


    The first black president was greeted by the right not only with diehard obstructionism but a chorus of color-coded abuse ("lazy," "food-stamp president" etc) and questions about his very American-ness: he was "not one of us," a foreigner adhering to a foreign religion who has no right to be president.


    The siren song of racial hate relentlessly put out by the "mainstream" right finds echo in the gunshots that rang out in Charleston.


    Rightists will, of course, deny the connection, the way Paisley did. But we are not fooled."

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/0...t?detail=email



  21. #271
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    Thanks to Charleston shootings Wall Street Journal declares ins utionalized racism over


    Sure, the WSJ editors admit, it might remind us of the 1963 bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham, Alabama. But everything is different now:

    Back then and before, the ins utions of government—police, courts, organized segregation—often worked to protect perpetrators of racially motivated violence, rather than their victims.

    The universal condemnation of the murders at the Emanuel AME Church and Dylann Roof’s quick capture by the combined efforts of local, state and federal police is a world away from what President Obama recalled as “a dark part of our history.” Today the system and philosophy of ins utionalized racism identified by Dr. King no longer exists.

    The government condemns the murder of nine black people at a Bible study, therefore ins utionalized racism no longer exists. Problem solved! Racism is in the past, at least as anything other than some weird individual thing.


    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/0...28Daily+Kos%29

    Murdoch toilet paper rag speaks.



  22. #272
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    dumb as sand, and twice as tone deaf, JimmyRicky s up

    Rick Perry Says Obama Administration Always Overreacts To ‘Accidents’ Like Charleston Shooting

    http://thinkprogress.org/election/20...ston-shooting/


  23. #273
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    Frequent Fox guest: Whites might shoot up more black churches if Obama keeps calling them racist




    http://www.rawstory.com/2015/06/freq...e+Raw+Story%29

  24. #274
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
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    "I am Irish. For many years in my native land the Rev. Ian Paisley spouted bigoted hatred about Catholics in Northern Ireland, but then claimed innocence when some militant sectarian group massacred Catholics. Speech was not murder, he said. He would never condone killing, he said. Then he went right back to feeding the at udes that spawned the killing. Few were fooled.

    We should not be fooled in America today.

    In this country the "mainstream" right-wing has made an industry of demonizing African-Americans as "thugs" and criminals - just look at the divergence in tone between the recent coverage of Ferguson or Baltimore and the (mostly white) biker massacre in Waco, TX. For decades, white America has been told that black Americans are lazy leeches, dependent on hand-outs funded by your hard-earned taxes to bankroll their immoral lifestyles.


    The first black president was greeted by the right not only with diehard obstructionism but a chorus of color-coded abuse ("lazy," "food-stamp president" etc) and questions about his very American-ness: he was "not one of us," a foreigner adhering to a foreign religion who has no right to be president.


    The siren song of racial hate relentlessly put out by the "mainstream" right finds echo in the gunshots that rang out in Charleston.


    Rightists will, of course, deny the connection, the way Paisley did. But we are not fooled."

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/0...t?detail=email


    http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249487

  25. #275
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
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    Thanks to Charleston shootings Wall Street Journal declares ins utionalized racism over


    Sure, the WSJ editors admit, it might remind us of the 1963 bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham, Alabama. But everything is different now:

    Back then and before, the ins utions of government—police, courts, organized segregation—often worked to protect perpetrators of racially motivated violence, rather than their victims.

    The universal condemnation of the murders at the Emanuel AME Church and Dylann Roof’s quick capture by the combined efforts of local, state and federal police is a world away from what President Obama recalled as “a dark part of our history.” Today the system and philosophy of ins utionalized racism identified by Dr. King no longer exists.

    The government condemns the murder of nine black people at a Bible study, therefore ins utionalized racism no longer exists. Problem solved! Racism is in the past, at least as anything other than some weird individual thing.


    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/0...28Daily+Kos%29

    Murdoch toilet paper rag speaks.


    http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=249487

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