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okc is going to lose both durant and westbrick
westbrick will probably leave for a bigger city like the lakers, yeh he will miss out on that extra 1yr max offer okc can give, but he make it back selling hipster bull in LA
2010 playoffs, and regularly in the NT... There's no reason why Pop wouldn't play him as much earlier in his career, other than I think he felt his career would be much shorter if he pushed him as much. Manu was much more of a contact guy than Harden, but Harden is the better shooter... Gino is 10x the compe or Harden is though, which I think is what Thread refers to as "winner" vs "loser"...
okc is going to lose both durant and westbrick
westbrick will probably leave for a bigger city like the lakers, yeh he will miss out on that extra 1yr max offer okc can give, but he make it back selling hipster bull in LA
LMAO,,,,,
Lots of people here and on sites like Grantland all were strongly against the Harden trade. Doubtful anyone predicted MVP caliber ... The Manu comparison is apt because that was the type of impact he had for OKC.
DMC got one part right Harden probably would have seeked a bigger role if he stayed ...but by all reports if offered full max he would have never left. They chose to not pay lux tax and let their 3rd best player walk for spare parts. All this we knew ...should have kept Harden traded perk and then if they couldn't stomach luxury cap after one more season trade Ibaka or Harden.
Last edited by Killakobe81; 07-13-2015 at 08:11 AM.
They had Scott Brooks as coach. Team build around KD and Russell was championship contender with or without Harden.
He wouldn't have walked, he was a restricted free agent. He just wanted to get paid...
Not when Russ is jacking up shots in the 4th and Durant won't call for the ball.
But again look at their situation at the time. They had two guys from top 5 od the league, they needed defensive big - Ibaka and they chose big guy Perkins, who was cheaper than Harden and replacement at C. Then Harden become MVP, Lamb is scrub and bust, and Porking became useless peace of meat with 6 personal to give.
He wouldn't have gotten paid. He showed in the 1st game of the Finals that he couldn't handle big moments. He showed it again this year. OKC made their decision then, I believe.
Another great point. And their final offer to get him a extension before the trade I think was only what 7-10 million off. I know that is millions. But again they could have got rid of PErk to offset. And if they worried about Ibaka they could have figured that out after ... Harden was the first puzzle to solve and they failed miserably. Even if DMC is right a lot of the criticism is based on what JHarden has done post trade plenty of analytics guys projected growth from Harden. Many traditionalists thought his work in pnr was a better fit for OKC ...so it's not all revisionist history. I dont think it would be THAT hard to pull up the Harden trade thread to prove where people stood on the matter. IIRC, many Spur fans were grateful he was moved ...
One more thing DMC got right is Harden is being overrated a bit here. Not ready to write him off as a choker and he had a great season last year. I was even worried that my prediction they could not win a le with him as the #1 was looking crazy ...but we shall see. I like James always have since HS I just dont see him leading a le team ...but I wasnt sure Steph could either and I liked him even more ...maybe he can in the new NBA. Either way epic fail by OKC and it only looks worse over time.But plenty argued it BEFORE the breakout
Simmons from October 11 Pre trade2012
Simmons again from from October 30 Post trade
In the first article Simmons expresses what many said here again a lot of people saw breakout rising star potential in Harden and the dynasty word is use by Simmons freely.
Post trade Simmons correctly laments what it means for OKC's future but wrongly predicts Lakers would win West. So many wrong on that I was one of the ones who rightly predicted we would not win the West.
Last edited by Killakobe81; 07-13-2015 at 08:30 AM.
OKC chose refusing to go in the tax for one season while they created space to absorb the big 3 without paying the tax. Even if you argue Ibaka as the more valuable piece because of the rim protection and position flex he offers they still got pennies on the dollar. the next season westbrook gets hurt (they didnt know this of course) but if they hold off and keep HArden even just to the trade deadline his value skyrockets in a #2 role and they get more for him or they could have seen what he truly brings offensively.
there is no logical scenario where making that trade AT THAT time made sense.
I remeber I was like WTF they are doing. Maybe they were so sure they would win it, so they let Harden go, because he wasnt giving them any discount. Maybe they saw something in Lamb. Maybe Westbrook or Durant refused to share the ball often. All gueses. Now they look like total idiots.
He wouldve never gotten hurt though if they dont make that trade because then the rockets are in the lottery and not in the playoffs and Beverly never injures him, probably meaning the Spurs never get to play the Heat, 6 never happens, and then 5 never happens
When are people going to realize that OKC is a collection of talented (Durant and Westbrook) also-rans? Overpaying Kanter to such a ridiculous contract is a "sign" of desperation. Their day in the sun is over. Durant still has to prove he's over the foot injury, Ibaka needs to come back from his injury, Westbrook has to learn to go back to playing 2nd fiddle and everyone has to adapt to a new system and coach.
This team will be fortunate to get a top 4 seed. I'd put the Spurs, Warriors, Clippers, Memphis and perhaps Houston in front of them in the West. Contenders? Please. Only Jalen Rose could come up with such non-sense.
You came back from Amy breaking Duncan's hole so bad that Battier broke it again. Sure, you promptly let the Clippers break your ass as soon as you left the gate for your repeat, but, you did return to get your 2nd 5th in the bitter aftermath of your 1st 5th.
Anything is possible.
He closed out the Clips, just like Dallas. No one showed up in the GS series. Game 1 they were only in it because of Harden. So,again you are proven incorrect.
We lost that series in Game 6 with Harden riding the pine. He did a great job of padding stats in a formality of a Game 7, though.
Scoring points does or does not contribute to a win? 31/7/8/ 3 steals.
Josh Smith was more clutch than Harden
Back to Kanter who the thread is actually about. Just how bad was he on defense? I got this from NBA.COM:
After he arrived, the Thunder allowed 110.4 points per 100 possessions (a rate which would have ranked last in the league) with Kanter on the floor and 103.3 (a rate which would have ranked 16th) with him on the bench. Even in Kanter’s 238 minutes on the floor with Serge Ibaka (before Ibaka was lost to a knee injury), OKC allowed 109.2 points per 100 possessions.
Wow. Even with Ibaka there they were one of the worst defenses in the league with Kanter on the court.
In game 6. You didn't answer the question. Scoring, assisting, and getting steals don't contribute to a win?Josh Smith was more clutch than Harden
Well, at least Smith was willing. Harden wanted no part of it.Josh Smith was more clutch than Harden
That is what people fail to realize. Presti evaluated the talent to get these picks. Got Ibaka in the 20's. Got Jackson in the 20's. And both players have been very good players in this league. I judge a gm by how he drafts, not so much by whom he can't sign. Bennet and Co. just didn't want to pay 18mil to Perkins to retain Harden. Very bad move on their part. For what Presti has been given, he has build a very good team in OKC (A finals appearance for them, 1st in nearly 20 years).
Reinsdorf on the Bulls ate 17mil and Amensty Boozer to get Gasol and bring over Mirotic. Sometimes you need to eat your losses to retain future gains.
I forgot where I read it, I'd have to find it, but his defensive metrics are among the worst in modern NBA history among bigs IIRC..
Having Ibaka will help, but Westbrook doesn't play defense anymore, and I'm not sure how well Durant will be able to move defensively with his foot injury..
They will have the best offense in the NBA, but that defense will probably be bottom 10..
The new Phoenix Suns of this decade.
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