Reply With Quote
They gave Harris 16mill per, so there is no reason why Fournier couldn't get 12 mill w/ the increasing cap considering guys like Reggie Jackson/Bledsoe getting the max. Dragic/Brandon Knight also got overpaid.
You really like a guy that can penetrate, don't you?
They gave Harris 16mill per, so there is no reason why Fournier couldn't get 12 mill w/ the increasing cap considering guys like Reggie Jackson/Bledsoe getting the max. Dragic/Brandon Knight also got overpaid.
You really like guys that can shoot their loads on your face, don't you?
Young quality RFAs almost always get matched. That right there should've clicked and caused you to not make this thread. But in your zeal to pretend you have actual basketball analysis to contribute, you posted anyways.
I thought harrisbhas been a much bigger.part of their team than evan
...idc. If possible though, it would be nice. It looks like he a huge part of their offense now though.
Chinook, do you think this is the year we draft a PG and "groom" him to be Parker's successor? or is that not likely because were gonna draft too low, or is McCallum that guy... you seem to have a better grasp on these sorts of things
We have not even considered why this guy would even come here to play behind Kawhi and Danny, when he's already starting for the Magic and an important guy for them. I didn't really know about this guy, bc I don't watch the Magic, but for sure he's a guy they like. No way is he at 23 years old going to come here to be in our bench. That is ridiculous from his perspective.
A breakdown with film of his strengths: http://www.nba.com/magic/news/film-r...iers-strengths
Good scoring in transition
Good spot up shooter from 3,
Currently guarding the other team's best player
Good driving to the basket and finishing at 53% on those plays
It doesn't mention his passing at all, but maybe they don't value that.. and Payton does a lot for them setting up what they want to do.
A guy like that sounds like a trade for Danny Green TBH, not Anderson, which would not happen bc family, chemistry, fit, character, etc.
Where the Spurs are drafting, first round picks are so far from a sure thing that I have no aversion to trading them away if PATFO wants an asset that badly. They haven't drafted inside of 20 since 1997 after all (Kawhi was a trade). Can't expect these guys to all turn into serviceable players like Tiago, Hill and Joseph and even if they do, whatever asset you get today while the window is open is worth what you're giving up. It's not a situation like the Nets where you're a marginal playoff team and giving up first rounders five years out when you could be (and are) awful.
I agree with you on the flipping of assets, but the Spurs have kept up their long standing run because they don't throw away the picks without it being a really, really worth reason, which I am not sure we even need.
Like I said above, Anderson is not this guy's equivalent, even in projection, and they have Payton who's been a terrific passer and PG who can't shoot kind of same as Anderson but better.
Anderson is really not a trade chip that would entice many teams at this point. He's got to develop to be worth something to someone.
The one guy you could flip for him is Danny Green, which won't happen bc Danny is part of the fabric of the team at this point, and from the Magic's perspective, Fournier is a lot more versatile than our Danny, can do many more things better, and he's 23. Fournier also doesn't have the benefit of playing with Kawhi, meaning he does take the toughest assignments on D on a nightly basis.
I haven't seen him though, so he could be overhyped, but he's definitely not a guy that would come from the bench or that you would trade for Anderson that is for sure.
It may be that when Manu does retire, at that point the team will make a move, but that is getting ahead of ourselves.
I was really on the George Lucas de Paula bandwagon during the draft. So yes, I think it's time to draft a new PG. McCallum will probably be re-signed, though, because the Spurs are actually likely to be over the cap next season even with the explosion.
appreciated bro
If we're talking about trading for him, then Fournier's opinion doesn't really matter. He'd be an RFA in July, and the Spurs would have right of first refusal. Unless he goes back overseas, he'd be a Spurs for at least another year, and you can argue that two years of Fournier is better than three years of Anderson.
That makes no sense. You don't trade a better player if you don't have to. Either Fournier or Green off the bench would be better than Anderson. That's a three-man wing rotation you could run with for six more years. Plus, Green makes $10 Million a year. The Magic would have to trade more salary to the Spurs to make the numbers work. From the Spurs' perspective, it's a non-starter because they aren't going to take back a crap ballast contract for their starting two-guard. From the Magic's perspective, they aren't going to add the value it takes to get Green, and if they are trading Fournier away so they don't have to pay him, they aren't going to use assets just to pay Green seven figures a year.A guy like that sounds like a trade for Danny Green
Fournier is a SG. Simmons is more of a SF. So yes, I am sure the Spurs will way their option once Manu decides to hang up his shoes. Who knows, he might play another year, especially if Duncan decides to give it a go one more year, and especially if the Spurs win the le this year.
Not sure why they'd want Kyle when they have Harris and a tweener Gordon...
Why in the would they want Anderson? Skiles is a defensive coach & Gordon is a much better defender than Kyle who will probably be playing behind Hezongia and Harris. He's playing wack ass Dewayne Dedmon over Andrew Nicholson b/c Nicholson is a mediocre defender just like Kyle.
PATFO could try offering Kyle for Ben McLemore b/c the King obviously have no clue what they are doing & Vlade would have a natural affinity to Kyle's game
They could do a sign-and-trade thus the Magic won't have to give up an additional asset.That makes no sense. You don't trade a better player if you don't have to. Either Fournier or Green off the bench would be better than Anderson. That's a three-man wing rotation you could run with for six more years. Plus, Green makes $10 Million a year. The Magic would have to trade more salary to the Spurs to make the numbers work. From the Spurs' perspective, it's a non-starter because they aren't going to take back a crap ballast contract for their starting two-guard. From the Magic's perspective, they aren't going to add the value it takes to get Green, and if they are trading Fournier away so they don't have to pay him, they aren't going to use assets just to pay Green seven figures a year.
The best target would be Schroder in the summer 2017. Patty is going to be a free agent & Tony would be entering the final year of his contract. Manu/Tim would have definitely retired by then so it would be a major transition year. PATFO could lure Schroder by offering him a starting job & moving Tony to the bench who will probably be current Kobe status in 2017-18. If the Hawks choose Schroder (RFA) over Teague (UFA) then just go after Teague. I'm pretty sure Bud is going to give Pop first dibs.
Other options are Langston Galloway & Jordan Clarkson but they are going to be RFAs this upcoming summer thus Patty is still going to be on the roster nor does anyone know if Manu/Tim will retire. Conley will also be an unrestricted free-agent but he is going to demand the max thus PATFO are priced out unless there is a sign-and-trade for Porker
I take into account the fact that Pop would not trade for a guy to get him into a situation that he doesn't like. It's part of the survey of whether he fits with your group's chemistry and makeup.
Danny on the bench next to Mills makes no sense without Manu TBH. If Manu retires and you get Fournier here, you still don't address the fact that Anderson is highly unlikely to net you Fournier even with a pick.
If you could end up with Danny/Fournier and Manu retires and Anderson is traded fine. My assessment is based on the assumption as I expressed above, that Anderson by himself or with a pick is unlikely to net you Fournier. You are more likely to have to give up Green for example, which I don't think it makes sense in a trade for the Magic, but he has a lot more trade value, and you could get a third team involved to get the Magic someone they like. If you end up with Fournier Anderson and give up Green, then maybe that is a trade that is worth it fir the Spurs TBH. Fournier would still be starting and have a prominent role and you still have Anderson to develop.
It's not that Anderson would be a starter for the Magic. It's that he's cheap depth for longer, and that's what the Magic would want if they don't want to pay Fournier.
I'm talking about a trade THIS season, not next off-season. Anyway, you misunderstood my point about the Magic. If they won't want to pay Fournier (meaning that they want to trade him), they aren't going to want to pay Green.They could do a sign-and-trade thus the Magic won't have to give up an additional asset.
I'm not even sure he can get minutes b/c they already have enough wing players & they could also get someone better than Kyle for Fournier. If I'm Sam Presti I'm offering Steven Adams for Fournier: OKC needs a 2-way wingplayer & Orlando needs a defensive minded starting center. Hopefully, that trade doesn't happen
What if money isn't the issue but Fournier simply doesn't want to play in Orlando? That's the reason they traded Affalo. There is a good possibility that Hezongia might take his starting spot thus would be unwilling to be a backup ala Reggie Jackson.
Last edited by Kawhitstorm; 11-11-2015 at 03:22 PM.
If Fournier makes it clear he's going to be a straight cancer, that's one thing. If he's like, "I'd rather be a starter", I don't think Pop would blink at all. Even Manu talks about how he wanted to start his whole career (but that he and Pop agreed it was the best for the team and for his game if he come of the bench). Fournier would be with his countrymen and would fill the most glamorous bench role in the league, knowing that he'll still get 30 MPG and be on a contender who has the best coach and culture in the league. I don't know his personality at all, but I doubt he really balks at that.
You're two-guard is not supposed to be your play-maker. If Patty is the PG, he's going to have to adjust, and he seems like he can do that. Green isn't going to run an offense, but he can pick up his assist rate if he has good players around him, which is what he's been doing lately. You also overlook that being part of a three-wing rotation means Green would play a ton of minutes either next of Fournier or next to Parker. No reason at all he couldn't work, especially since the Spurs could just add a big PG like de Paula in the draft to slot between Mills and Green.Danny on the bench next to Mills makes no sense without Manu TBH.
And as I've said, I'm fine keeping Anderson if the Spurs have to pay more than that. My stance was that the team would have to trade for Fournier this year if they want him; they won't be able to sign him in the summer. Anderson is a cheap contract who has positive value. That's why he's in the deal. It doesn't make sense for the Spurs to trade a solid rotation player for another solid rotation player. It doesn't help them fill the holes in next year's roster.If you could end up with Danny/Fournier and Manu retires and Anderson is traded fine. My assessment is based on the assumption as I expressed above, that Anderson by himself or with a pick is unlikely to net you Fournier.
You have no one on your bench to be the "Manu". Anderson is nice, but he's not your two-guard if you can help it. And Kawhi, Fournier and Anderson make a poorly balanced three-man wing rotation. The point of this thread seemed to me asking how the Spurs could get a sixth starter to replace Manu. Trading one of the five to get that sixth guy makes no sense.If you end up with Fournier Anderson and give up Green, then maybe that is a trade that is worth it fir the Spurs TBH. Fournier would still be starting and have a prominent role and you still have Anderson to develop.
You seem to admit that Green is better than Fournier (or else the Spurs couldn't get Evan by trading Danny). So a Green for Fournier swap would downgrade the Spurs' talent, cost more money and not fill the obvious whole the OP was trying to fill. I don't see why you'd be interested in the Spurs making that trade at all, unless there are ulterior, CoA-related motives here
You can rest easy. OKC won't trade Adams -- especially not for a guard they have to pay next year. And the Magic aren't interested in getting a center when they have a pretty good one that they just paid. Defensive PF? Definitely. But not a center.I'm not even sure he can get minutes b/c they already have enough wing players & they could also get someone better than Kyle for Fournier. If I'm Sam Presti I'm offering Steven Adams for Fournier: OKC needs a 2-way wingplayer & Orlando needs a defensive minded starting center. Hopefully, that trade doesn't happen
I don't that has anything to do with it. Plus, they'd know Fournier would want out by this point. If the Magic are willing to match an offer sheet for Fournier, he'll be there for the foreseeable future.What if money isn't the issue but Fournier simply doesn't want to play in Orlando? That's the reason they traded Affalo. There is a good possibility that Hezongia might take his starting spot thus would be unwilling to be a backup ala Reggie Jackson.
The only likely straight up trade involving Kyle that could net a rotation player is Ben McLemore. He can be groomed into a decent 2-way player & his shooting can mitigate the loss of Marco if the PATFO could pry him away from that asylum house before Vlade is fired. Fournier for Kyle just doesn't make any sense for Orlando as they already have other young players who could take Fournier's minutes if he's traded.
I wouldn't mind inquiring about Andrew Nicholson in the summer as Bonner's replacement since Skiles has completely given up on him; Borrego should have the goods on him but then Boylen did recommend Ayres
The Magic do definitely need a defensive minded center. Vuc can play both PF or C but he's more suited to play PF ala Pau. Gordon is being groomed into a defensive minded small ball PF ala Draymond/Josh Smith. They made a mistake in re-signing Harris but he will most likely be moved once Hezonja & Gordon develop into legit rotation players. Right now they are depending on Dewayne Dedmon as their enforcer in the paint
OKC can get a handshake agreement w/ Fournier that he's going to re-sign before making the deal & he's going to be a RFA so they can match any offers. They might actually lose Waiters since he wants to be a starter ala Reggie Jackson so Fournier would be an insurance. They have to play Kanter w/ Ibaka as much as possible & McGary can eat the left over minutes w/ Collison playing spot minutes when they need defensive stops.
Last edited by Kawhitstorm; 11-11-2015 at 04:07 PM.
I agree with a lot of what you said Chinook.
Bottom line for me is that even as much as I like Anderson, he is not this guy's equivalent and he will not be able to net you this guy even with a first round pick (which you personally would not attach for Fournier).
I have already mentioned Danny, bc he's a more interesting piece and a number of other teams would really be interested in that trade. It is a lateral move, but Fournier theoretically brings more to the team at that point bc of his dribble/drive game, which the team will need without Ginobili and a rapidly declining Tony. To his dribble drive game, you add that he can dish assists, defends respectably, and can shoot the 3, and he's a better fit for a team that lacks Manu, and has a rapidly declining Tony than Green at that point. In that case, a Green/Fournier trade would make sense to me. Still, I have reservations bc I just don't know this guy, and I am going by reports on him, it's not like I have scouted him. In no way am I nonchalant about parting with Danny though.
That scenario also has the reservation that you would at that point really need Anderson to come through, and Pop has not let us see enough of him to really be comfortable with that, even for those of us that are fans of his game. That is also why I said Green/Fournier would not make sense. I recognize like you do, that it patches a hole, but it creates another. In that case, you now need Anderson to really come through for you, plus you need another wing.
Bottom line: I don't see us getting Fournier. We don't have an attractive young piece that would be his equivalent or near a range of equivalency to generate interest, and the pieces we do have, we can't easily spare to acquire him without creating other holes and further disrupt the chemistry and makeup of the team.
Like virtually every prominent or even semi-prominent restricted free agent, Fournier's not going anywhere. He's playing a significant role for them and though they may seem overloaded on the wings, Harris is starting at PF and Hezonja is playing spot minutes.
If/when Gordon and Hezonja become the caliber of players they project to be, they can sort out their SG-PF situation then. For now, it's not difficult to divide the minutes among the five (Oladipo being the fifth, of course).
If all goes according to plan, down the line, they should have the makings for a package for a disgruntled star.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions