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Sean Elliott went to Detroit? I thought he refused to do any broadcasts there.
You are underestimating what Manu brings to a team. Ginobili improves any team he is on, look at his records, you can't compare Sprewell with Manu, no way.
Sean Elliott went to Detroit? I thought he refused to do any broadcasts there.
Or Ray Allen, Luis Scola (got to the second round with the Rockets and took the champion Lakers to 7, tbh), Joe Johnson and a bunch of other players that have made it to the second round as the number one option of a team.So they'd be basically as good as Chris Paul and Steve Nash.
Ray Allen & Paul Pierce were in the conference Finals. The 2001 Bucks got jobbed by the refs against the Sixers & the 2002 Celtics were up 2-1 on the Nets.
So was Nash for that matter.
Are we talking about JUST stats or similarities in the style of play.
There wasn't much similarity b/w Bird & Manu just as much as there wasn't much similarity b/w Tony & Cassell.If you are going to talk about win-share & championship then that has more to do w/ their supporting cast than the players in a vacuum.
Yeah, Manu was better than Derozan but I brought up Derozan/Lowry b/c there are the only All-Star backcourt that I can compare to Tony/Manu as opposed to say Klay/Curry.
Sprewell on the other hand was once the best shooting guard in the league when he was in Golden State. His career w/ the Warriors might as well be labeled as the "lost tapes" b/c they were never on national TV & the Warriors were dwarfed by the Lakers along w/ not being a playoff team. The guy the Spurs faced in the 99 Finals was pretty in' good & he was playing in a ty half court offense that didn't suit his game. Once Ewing got injured in the ECF clincher, Van Gundy put the ball in his hands & he went beast mode in the Finals against the best defensive team of that era.
Again, Sprewell in Golden State was a more undercontrol/higher Bball IQ/less freakish athlete version of Russell Westbrook. Manu can't be compared to Clyde b/c you are talking about a guy who took a team to TWO Finals; I would roll w/ Penny than guys like Clyde who had the longevity & sustained success.
Jeff Hornacek is a good comparison for Manu's career as a 3rd wheel but he was NEVER as good as wing-man Manu circa 2005 or as the #1 option circa 2011. Jason Terry is probably the Jeff Hornacek of his era.
Which is why they shouldn't be lumped w/ Chris Fall....that would be Joe Johnson.
I was just answering to that guy that named those two toghether.
There is a good reason why Pop tried numerous times to acquire Sprewell. He was crazy kind of like Stephen Jackson but he was a fierce compe or like Manu.
- http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...emains-a-rumor
- http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37349
Manu was drafted in 1999. That year the Bulls had the number 1 pick and selected Elton Brand. I think it's fair to say Manu >>> Brand. Do you imagine Manu playing in a big market like Chicago in the leastern conference with guys like Hinrinch, Ben Gordon, Deng, Nocioni, Sefolosha and Tyson Chandler? I think he could have made some noise.
Last edited by DAF86; 01-13-2016 at 02:22 PM.
I always wondered about it as well. There was one year where Manu was ranked 9th in MVP race. Imagine a healthy Manu in his prime for a minimum of 5 years. If not MVP he would be 1st team for sure.
There hasn't been a player like Manu..... ever at the SG position.
LOL @ Sprewell comparison.
Difficult to say, tbh. In their early years both players really benefited from all of the attention that TD got. You never know how their development would have panned out had they not been in a situation with a superstar and less pressure to produce consistently.
I'd say that Manu was a more polished player upon entering the league than Tony though, so he probably would have figured out his game anywhere. He just wouldn't have been nearly as efficient, and his career would have been much shorter. Not sure who to compare that to...
Tony was really raw when he came into the league and was not at all ready be a #1 option. Also, can't forget that Chip England had a lot to do with Tony's ascension to all-star status when he helped Tony develop that mid-range J.
Having said all of this, you put prime Manu on any team as a #1, and that team will be tough to handle. Prime Manu could do it all except for post up and would have almost certainly had more ASGs as a #1. Prime Tony as a #1 would have probably been a multiple all star, too, but not as effective as Manu.
Just for the good memories...
Yup. Its not a bad thing imho, not every star is a #1 on a legitimate championship team.So they'd be basically as good as Chris Paul and Steve Nash.
Lol- still awesome.
Props.
Prime Ginobili in Chi-town, or New York... #worshipped.
Did you guys watch Sprewell in Golden State?He wasn't bad in the 99 Finals against the Spurs either. There are a bunch of HOFers who can't say they were the best player on a Finals team or even made it to the Finals.
Muphuckas who never ACTUALLY watched him playing in Golden State acting like he was Michael Finley or some shyt just like folks who claim Manu was a role player b/c they never saw him pre-2011.
2nd year Spree:
Spree dueling w/ MVP Iverson better than Kobe in the Finals:
Spree making it rain:
Spree in the 99 Finals:
Spree destroying Pierce/Joe Johnson:
Spree outdueling Ray Allen:
Spree shutting down Vince:
Past prime Spree outplaying the same Kobe in the 2004 WCF:
Past prime Spree destroying Doug Christie:
Last edited by Kawhitstorm; 01-13-2016 at 09:18 PM.
You have a contemporary player in Wade who was Manu on steroids but he couldn't get past the 1st rd in the East. You also have guys like T-Mac/Vince who couldn't put a team on their back like Tim/Shaq/LeBron come playoff time so as good as Manu was it would be hard to argue he could carry a team.
Maybe if he played w/ a couple borderline All-Stars like Rose during his MVP season then he could probably get them to the ECF or maybe the 2nd rd in the West kind of like Ray Allen in 2005.
You don't need all-stars, just a good assambled team. Heck, get the Golden Generation Argie team and Manu could have put on work in the NBA as a lead guy.
As i said before, put him on the pistons team and he wins the chip.
Manu has always been a team player, you put him on a TEAM and he puts it over the top. Best example is Argentina´s Team, not great grat players, but enough with Manu as the leader.
Porker would have been out of the league by year 3. He'd have a Jonny Flynn type of career.
You also have to remember that Pop held the reigns tight on both manu and Tony early on... I don't think it's crazy to think manu could have had 5-7 years at 35 min per game and stay relatively healthy. I do believe he would have at some point learned when to dial it down..
bottom line:
this is forum amazes me with how much manu is under rated. I suffered through the 80s and 90's waiting for that player that would do the things manu does. You can't explain it... I actually think bird is the best comparison other than the trash talking. Manu gives everyone on the team significantly more confidence and fears nothing.
Spree was was a great Player and fairly under rated, but bball iq, efficiency and intangibles plus wining pedigree it's not close IMHO
Rip Hamilton wasn't even better than Klay Thompson so that isn't saying much, thb. Bradley Beal is basically the modern day version of Rip.
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