Lakers: Kobe Bryant rips Russell and Randle after 6th straight loss

[Thread]

It's actually not true. Fatigue has much to do with injuries. Not all injuries, but a significant group of injuries.

Must have been in that 2 minutes window you fellow grieve over from '13 when Duncan was shinin' pine.

[midnightpulp]

tee, hee.

Look at ya! Jacket pressed. Tie impeccable. Hair slicked back. Looking like a million bucks today.

(of course I'm referring to AZ on the wrong side of 49 points)

[313]

tee, hee.

Smh

[Thread]

Look at ya! Jacket pressed. Tie impeccable. Hair slicked back. Looking like a million bucks today.

(of course I'm referring to AZ on the wrong side of 49 points)

Oh, yeah. It's all good today. If they have a remote that is handy I might stop by and break their balls. Then run like . Sometimes they'll have a remote at a local Best Buy. Can ya imagine it? A 60 year old man running just as fast as he can in Bermuda shorts and a 4X t-shirt yelling "O & 48!!!" after the football team got beat by Carolina?

[Thread]

Thread is wrong here. Point to Splits.

Are you ready to come in from the Cornfield now?

[Killakobe81]

If teams play like the way you mentioned, 2011 Mavs would have never won the le. They weren't expected to win.

Neither were the 03 Spurs, or even the 07 Spurs, or the 06 Heat.

All were contenders, not fringe playoff teams ... so how does that apply? Are you saying they were not favorites? If so I agree. But those teams were all legit, even strong contenders. Im sur ethe Clips fans feel good they beat the Spurs last year. I am also sure Rox fans enjoyed beating the Clips in the moment ... but at the end of the day what does that mean? .

I dont get why you have issue with this ...this in no way helps justify the Lakers and their mismanagement. I think we are tanking by accident or cir stance not by design. we are still in a very dark place. I'm just saying I would rather have a shot at Simmons then another first round loss to the Spurs ...as a fan. If you dont get that ...not sure what to tell ya.

[ambchang]

All were contenders, not fringe playoff teams ... so how does that apply? Are you saying they were not favorites? If so I agree. But those teams were all legit, even strong contenders. Im sur ethe Clips fans feel good they beat the Spurs last year. I am also sure Rox fans enjoyed beating the Clips in the moment ... but at the end of the day what does that mean? .

You are looking at this retrospectively. The Clippers last year had as much of a chance as the Mavs had in 11, or the Spurs in 07. Darkhorses.

I dont get why you have issue with this ...this in no way helps justify the Lakers and their mismanagement. I think we are tanking by accident or cir stance not by design. we are still in a very dark place. I'm just saying I would rather have a shot at Simmons then another first round loss to the Spurs ...as a fan. If you dont get that ...not sure what to tell ya.

Yeah, of course, I agree with that too. I just disagree with the logic that somehow, the Lakers are in a better place than Houston or the Clippers.

There are a few superstar players who will be successful no matter the cir stances. Their talents are so obvious so early that teams will just build their entire systems around them. Shaq was one, Duncan was one, Hakeem, Kareem, Bird, Magic, Lebron. But then there are those who were developed into them, Kawhi being the latest example, I am not sure Curry will be as successful as he is if he was thrown into a toxic soup like the Kings or the Suns, Unibrow is not being used properly and is really wasting his youth there, Wiggins is another example of a talent where you always have to wonder what if.

Much of their successes have to do with player development, and I am not sure if Simmons belongs to the earlier or the later group, and for a fan to hang their hats on:
1) The Lakers actually getting the #1 pick
2) Lakers management not being stupid enough to trade away the pick or draft another person
3) Simmons actually developing under a coach like Scott

and say they are in a better situation than Clippers or Rockets is baloney.

[Splits]

I expect players to play to win dumbass, as a fan I have every right to want to avoid the mediocrity treadmill.It's not like this is some new concept Simmons used to talk about being just good enough to make playoffs but never getting a lottery pick ...who wants that? What do the Clippers have to show for Lob city , besides beating you guys in round one?

This is just so devoid of logic I don't even know how to respond. So you "as a fan" know how to better run an organization than a GM? You were against the 2013 push for the playoffs the Lakers made in 2013, would have preferred a lottery pick instead? You would rather not have the chance to make history, or at the very least upset a team in the playoffs? This is loser talk. You're only taking this re ed stance since your team sucks donkey s and you're rationalizing. You've had back-to-back lottery picks and you're working on a 3rd straight with no end to the nightmare in sight. Philly, same . Cleveland same before Bron came back. It's just stupid.

[Killakobe81]

You are looking at this retrospectively. The Clippers last year had as much of a chance as the Mavs had in 11, or the Spurs in 07. Darkhorses.



Yeah, of course, I agree with that too. I just disagree with the logic that somehow, the Lakers are in a better place than Houston or the Clippers.

There are a few superstar players who will be successful no matter the cir stances. Their talents are so obvious so early that teams will just build their entire systems around them. Shaq was one, Duncan was one, Hakeem, Kareem, Bird, Magic, Lebron. But then there are those who were developed into them, Kawhi being the latest example, I am not sure Curry will be as successful as he is if he was thrown into a toxic soup like the Kings or the Suns, Unibrow is not being used properly and is really wasting his youth there, Wiggins is another example of a talent where you always have to wonder what if.

Much of their successes have to do with player development, and I am not sure if Simmons belongs to the earlier or the later group, and for a fan to hang their hats on:
1) The Lakers actually getting the #1 pick
2) Lakers management not being stupid enough to trade away the pick or draft another person
3) Simmons actually developing under a coach like Scott

and say they are in a better situation than Clippers or Rockets is baloney.

1. Some smart points so I agree with some of the premise. However no needs to look at this retrospectively beside clips and rox fans who else thought the Clips/rox were legit contenders? I as sure as did not and have argued that for more than 3 years. I wont lie I did have Clips as my "darkhorse" the last two years (i gave up on 'em after last season) but darkhorse is different than I cant see a scenario of this team winning a le which I have said would be the case for the Rox with McHale as coach and Dwight as a leader of that squad. Seriously though Amb, did you really , truly in your heart of hearts think that Da Clipshow or the Rox led by those two knuckleheads had legit shots at a le? You are talking about teams led by Dirk and Timmy coached by RC & Pop how does that even correlate?

2. I never said we are in a better situation holistically ...what I am saying is I would rather take a shot (slim) at a superstar than to have unrealistic hopes at a le as a fan. Both organizations (clips/rox) are in better shape then we are right now ...who is saying otherwise? They both have at least two proven stars ... while we have none.

3. I have my doubts about Simmons and Ingram, but it does not matter right now we have no established star. But I am also glad we swung and missed on Dwight, Melo, Aldridge, Monroe (LOL) etc. because I KNEw we were not close and we would be the Rox or Clips ... at best. I did not know we would suck this bad and losing sucks ass. But rather this than to be spinning my wheels making lots of regular season noise to only go home empty handed when it matters.

[Killakobe81]

This is just so devoid of logic I don't even know how to respond. So you "as a fan" know how to better run an organization than a GM? You were against the 2013 push for the playoffs the Lakers made in 2013, would have preferred a lottery pick instead? You would rather not have the chance to make history, or at the very least upset a team in the playoffs? This is loser talk. You're only taking this re ed stance since your team sucks donkey s and you're rationalizing. You've had back-to-back lottery picks and you're working on a 3rd straight with no end to the nightmare in sight. Philly, same . Cleveland same before Bron came back. It's just stupid.

Why dont you buy a clue? I never said I know more than anyone. I am telling you what me the biggest Laker fan would want. I did not want Dwight or Kobe at max. You can find my stance on both here if you look for it ...I wont do you the favor. I also was against LMA, Melo and Monroe at the max too. I knew we would suck (not this bad) but would rather gamble on youth than to overpay near stars or over 30 ones max dollars. Lottery is no sure thing it's a crap shoot and I dont see a Lebron or even Anthony davis in the lot from the past 3 drafts but that is better than paying max to Greg Monroe or Melo imho.

Yes the shaq signing was the key to the 3peat as Duncan was the key to 5. But without the homeruns the spurs and Lakers hit on Tony, Manu and Kobe neither team still wins . That is my hope for the draft is to find a Paker or Manu and develop them expecting a tim or Kobe is foolish but you still need those other guys to win.

[ambchang]

1. Some smart points so I agree with some of the premise. However no needs to look at this retrospectively beside clips and rox fans who else thought the Clips/rox were legit contenders? I as sure as did not and have argued that for more than 3 years. I wont lie I did have Clips as my "darkhorse" the last two years (i gave up on 'em after last season) but darkhorse is different than I cant see a scenario of this team winning a le which I have said would be the case for the Rox with McHale as coach and Dwight as a leader of that squad.
Seriously though Amb,did you really , truly in your heart of hearts think that Da Clipshow or the Rox led by those two knuckleheads had legit shots at a le? You are talking about teams led by Dirk and Timmy coached by RC & Pop how does that even correlate?

I thought the Clippers had a chance last year, not so much the Rockets because they were so poorly constructed.
Let's say this, I thought the Clippers had a better chance last year than I thought the Mavs had a chance in 2011, or the Heat in 2006.

2. I never said we are in a better situation holistically ...what I am saying is I would rather take a shot at superstar than to have unrealistic hopes at a le as a fan. Both organizations (clips/rox) are in better shape then we are right now ...who is saying otherwise? They both have at least two proven stars while we have none.

I don't think the Clippers hopes were unrealistic. This year, so far, other than GSW and the Spurs, I can't see anyone with a realistic chance yet, but you can never count out injuries, a hot streak, favourable matchups, or teams just gelling under the right conditions. Who knows what the Cavs, Thunder, or Clippers have in the second half of the year and the playoffs. That's why we play the games.

3. I have my doubts about simmons and Ingram but it does not matter right now we have no established star. But I am so glad we swung and missed on Dwight, Melo, aldridge, Monroe (LOL) etc. because I KNEw we were not close and we would be the Rox or Clips at best. I did not know we would suck this bad and losing sucks. But rather this than to be spinning my wheels making lots of regular season noise to only go home empty handed when it matters.

You would have to get multiple players of those free agents you mentioned to even be in the same strata as the Rox or Clips. The Lakers are horrible this year, much worse than I thought. I was thinking high 20s low 30s, they are now on track for about 18 wins, which is just an abomination. It's embarrassing, really.

[Killakobe81]

I thought the Clippers had a chance last year, not so much the Rockets because they were so poorly constructed.
Let's say this, I thought the Clippers had a better chance last year than I thought the Mavs had a chance in 2011, or the Heat in 2006.



I don't think the Clippers hopes were unrealistic. This year, so far, other than GSW and the Spurs, I can't see anyone with a realistic chance yet, but you can never count out injuries, a hot streak, favourable matchups, or teams just gelling under the right conditions. Who knows what the Cavs, Thunder, or Clippers have in the second half of the year and the playoffs. That's why we play the games.



You would have to get multiple players of those free agents you mentioned to even be in the same strata as the Rox or Clips. The Lakers are horrible this year, much worse than I thought. I was thinking high 20s low 30s, they are now on track for about 18 wins, which is just an abomination. It's embarrassing, really.

Well then not sure what to tell ya ... because CLips have no shot. Neither does OKC tbh. I am even starting to wonder about Cleveland. Sure there are upsets in sports but the NBA is the most predictable of the 4 major sports (NHL is a close 2nd). Sure tha Mavs heat and Larry Brown Pistons were minor upsets but go back the last 30 years plus and find me a whole lot more ... there is the first round upsets like what happened to the Spurs and Sonics but none of those upset teams like the grizz, nuggs or last year's CLips won .

For example, I loved Fisher's 0.3 but in the end that team was hugely disappointing. That shot didnt win and outside of this forum and in the Fisher household .. really means nada because we did not win the le. Horry's shot vs Sacto? That means something still and always will.

[Splits]

Why dont you buy a clue? I never said I know more than anyone. I am telling you what me the biggest Laker fan would want. I did not want Dwight or Kobe at max. You can find my stance on both here if you look for it ...I wont do you the favor. I also was against LMA, Melo and Monroe at the max too. I knew we would suck (not this bad) but would rather gamble on youth than to overpay near stars or over 30 ones max dollars. Lottery is no sure thing it's a crap shoot and I dont see a Lebron or even Anthony davis in the lot from the past 3 drafts but that is better than paying max to Greg Monroe or Melo imho.

Yes the shaq signing was the key to the 3peat as Duncan was the key to 5. But without the homeruns the spurs and Lakers hit on Tony, Manu and Kobe neither team still wins . That is my hope for the draft is to find a Paker or Manu and develop them expecting a tim or Kobe is foolish but you still need those other guys to win.

I'm not sure what the you're talking about with all of your "I wouldn't pay XXX max money" recycled crap. You've basically been arguing in this thread that unless your team is a pre-season top-3, that you should try to miss the playoffs in order to get a high draft pick. That's dumb. That's a loser mentality, even from a fan's perspective, since you should want to see progress and development and learning experiences for your younger players. There is very little to be learned from being the laughing stock of the league, getting your ass pounded night in and night out, and trying to lose. There's never been a team in the history of the sport that went from basement to champion in one season. Building a winner is a process, it takes time. But you somehow think that doesn't apply to your Lakers.

Also, neither Parker or Manu were lottery picks. Kawhi wasn't either. Kobe barely was.

[Killakobe81]

I'm not sure what the you're talking about with all of your "I wouldn't pay XXX max money" recycled crap. You've basically been arguing in this thread that unless your team is a pre-season top-3, that you should try to miss the playoffs in order to get a high draft pick. That's dumb. That's a loser mentality, even from a fan's perspective, since you should want to see progress and development and learning experiences for your younger players. There is very little to be learned from being the laughing stock of the league, getting your ass pounded night in and night out, and trying to lose. There's never been a team in the history of the sport that went from basement to champion in one season. Building a winner is a process, it takes time. But you somehow think that doesn't apply to your Lakers.

Also, neither Parker or Manu were lottery picks. Kawhi wasn't either. Kobe barely was.

Yes. But Duncan was. Lebron, Shaq David, Durant, Paul and Blake. You hope for a LeBron type ...but if you get a Paul or Blake that is fine too. I still dont get your argument. So let's say this EXACT same team minus hibbert (who we would not have traded for) gets a yes from one of Melo, Aldridge or Dwight is that team a legit contender? Nope. In fact, if it we did, we wouldn't be sittiing on 9 wins and there is a high chance that the pick goes to the sixers and if we made the playoffs we are getting swept ... who wants that?

The Rox and CLips are not teams I would want to trade places with because they will not win . IF I could trade places with Boston (just threw up in my mouth) I would. smart young coach, and a young team with lots of draft picks ..or Minny who may not have the coach but has some nice young pieces.

I agree that building a winner is a process and I saw us do it in the 90's. Before Shaq came we were led by Eddie Jones and Vick Van Exel ... and I enjoyed those teams that werent going to win because they were led by young talent not old broke down vets like Kobe and Hibbert. That is what we need the young supporting cast and hopefully a good developmental coach. We wont get there by signing 30 year old past their prime stars. That makes sense for the Spurs right now ... not the Lakers.

[Splits]

I still dont get your argument.

My argument is that your take, to which I originally responded, is extremely lazy and stupid:

if you aint winning les or a true contender the playoffs are overrated. IF the Lakers were going to make the playoffs, like the Dubs/spurs then it's worthwhile... if we are going in like the Clips ..then why bother? they have as much a chance of winning the le as we do.

Your "mediocrity treadmill" is also known as improving over time. If you somehow think an NBA team can go from lottery to championship without taking their lumps and building a cohesive unit through ups and downs, then I don't know what to tell you.

[Killakobe81]

My argument is that your take, to which I originally responded, is extremely lazy and stupid:



Your "mediocrity treadmill" is also known as improving over time. If you somehow think an NBA team can go from lottery to championship without taking their lumps and building a cohesive unit through ups and downs, then I don't know what to tell you.

How are the Clips and Rox improving? Please do tell? Rox and Clips both had to admit to the mistake of signing and letting go Josh Smith. JOSH SMITH! A bust with the Pistons ...but yet they are improving? How about Chicago? Are they improving? or the Bucks? do you know who is improving? The Knicks. Why? Porzingis has been a surprise. That is why you get in to the lottery. If the Pelicans had Porzingis to pair with Davis instead of the trip to the playoffs last year where would they be this year? How about Boston with Porzingis and that great young coach and improved defense? Or better yet ...Towns?!

[Splits]

How are the Clips and Rox improving? Please do tell? Rox and Clips both had to admit to the mistake of signing and letting go Josh Smith. JOSH SMITH! A bust with the Pistons ...but yet they are improving? How about Chicago? Are they improving? or the Bucks? do you know who is improving? The Knicks. Why? Porzingis has been a surprise. That is why you get in to the lottery. If the Pelicans had Porzingis to pair with Davis instead of the trip to the playoffs last year where would they be this year? How about Boston with Porzingis and that great young coach and improved defense? Or better yet ...Towns?!

Strawman.

By your logic, the Dubs should have tanked last year since they were a 1st round exit the year prior and a 2nd round exit the year before that. Obviously declining! Why were they trying to make the playoffs instead of tanking?!?

[Killakobe81]

Strawman.

By your logic, the Dubs should have tanked last year since they were a 1st round exit the year prior and a 2nd round exit the year before that. Obviously declining! Why were they trying to make the playoffs instead of tanking?!?

the Dubs are young and ascending the Clips are not. I would not suggest a young team on the rise and improving that they tank. But you know why they won because they refused to trade Klay for Love. they stayed with their development plan gambled on the young guys improving and they did. Curry improved. Barnes improved. That is what you want. Clips did not improve and they got older, not younger.

Still waiting for you to show me the improvement either team has made even with the Clips recent tear I would say so far both teams have disappointed. They shot their wad and have no les and only one WCF to show for the past 3 years. and those teams are at the high end of mediocrity. LAkers are far worse than that but most teams like Toronto Atlanta built around mediocre vets aint winning either.

I'll give you another example . The blazers traded Batum, let Matthews and Aldridge walk ...maybe not by choice. But I would rather have that young team than either the Rox or Clips. They did not tank though everyone though they were they gambled on young talent over re-signing guys that were past their prime. Smart move by tlong's squad.

[Splits]

the Dubs are young and ascending the Clips are not. I would not suggest a young team on the rise and improving that they tank. But you know why they won because they refused to trade Klay for Love. they stayed with their development plan gambled on the young guys improving and they did. Curry improved. Barnes improved. That is what you want. Clips did not improve and they got older, not younger.

Still waiting for you to show me the improvement either team has made even with the Clips recent tear I would say so far both teams have disappointed. They shot their wad and have no les and only one WCF to show for the past 3 years. and those teams are at the high end of mediocrity. LAkers are far worse than that but most teams like Toronto Atlanta built around mediocre vets aint winning either.

I'll give you another example . The blazers traded Batum, let Matthews and Aldridge walk ...maybe not by choice. But I would rather have that young team than either the Rox or Clips. They did not tank though everyone though they were they gambled on young talent over re-signing guys that were past their prime. Smart move by tlong's squad.

I never mentioned the Clippers or the Rockets, that strawman you built all by your lonesome. What I did was quote you as basically saying if you're not a pre-season top-3 then the playoffs are meaningless and the team should just tank for the lottery. I'm sure GSW is thankful they didn't listen to your sage advice last year, coming off of a 2nd round exit, then a first round exit in the "overrated" playoffs in the two previous seasons.

[Killakobe81]

I never mentioned the Clippers or the Rockets, that strawman you built all by your lonesome. What I did was quote you as basically saying if you're not a pre-season top-3 then the playoffs are meaningless and the team should just tank for the lottery. I'm sure GSW is thankful they didn't listen to your sage advice last year, coming off of a 2nd round exit, then a first round exit in the "overrated" playoffs in the two previous seasons.

My advice is not for Goldenstate i like them but they aint my team you keep forgetting im talking Lakers. What Lakers should do is not what every team should do but Simmons and others have argued against being stuck in mediocrity not sure why you dont get that ...but whatever now we have games to watch so you and your strawman bull arguments.We disagree lets move on

[Splits]

My advice is not for Goldenstate i like them but they aint my team you keep forgetting im talking Lakers. What Lakers should do is not what every team should do but Simmons and others have argued against being stuck in mediocrity not sure why you dont get that ...but whatever now we have games to watch so you and your strawman bull arguments.We disagree lets move on

I had one argument: your blanket "playoffs are overrated" is a lazy and stupid statement and I think I proved my point given all your strawmen. So yeah, let's move on.

9-37

[ambchang]

Well then not sure what to tell ya ... because CLips have no shot. Neither does OKC tbh. I am even starting to wonder about Cleveland. Sure there are upsets in sports but the NBA is the most predictable of the 4 major sports (NHL is a close 2nd). Sure tha Mavs heat and Larry Brown Pistons were minor upsets but go back the last 30 years plus and find me a whole lot more ... there is the first round upsets like what happened to the Spurs and Sonics but none of those upset teams like the grizz, nuggs or last year's CLips won .

For example, I loved Fisher's 0.3 but in the end that team was hugely disappointing. That shot didnt win and outside of this forum and in the Fisher household .. really means nada because we did not win the le. Horry's shot vs Sacto? That means something still and always will.

Well then not sure what to tell ya ... because CLips have no shot. Neither does OKC tbh. I am even starting to wonder about Cleveland. Sure there are upsets in sports but the NBA is the most predictable of the 4 major sports (NHL is a close 2nd). Sure tha Mavs heat and Larry Brown Pistons were minor upsets but go back the last 30 years plus and find me a whole lot more ... there is the first round upsets like what happened to the Spurs and Sonics but none of those upset teams like the grizz, nuggs or last year's CLips won .

For example, I loved Fisher's 0.3 but in the end that team was hugely disappointing. That shot didnt win and outside of this forum and in the Fisher household .. really means nada because we did not win the le. Horry's shot vs Sacto? That means something still and always will.

What are you talking about? Fishers .4 is still being played regularly as an example epf clutch shots. It was unbelievable.

Clippers this year doesn't have much chance but I'd give OKC a better shot than Cleveland right now.

There are surprises every decade.

11 Mavs
06 heat
04 Pistons
07 Spurs
94 rockets
88 Pistons
Every team in the 70s.

[LakerHater]

KoMe is a got!
He sits out 4 periods to "Give the young guys a chance"!

[Killakobe81]

KoMe is a got!
He sits out 4 periods to "Give the young guys a chance"!

I had one argument: your blanket "playoffs are overrated" is a lazy and stupid statement and I think I proved my point given all your strawmen. So yeah, let's move on.

9-37

Where did i say that in this thread?

[Splits]

Where did i say that in this thread?

if you aint winning les or a true contender the playoffs are overrated.