Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 37
  1. #1
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Post Count
    22,886
    Donald Trump has announced that he “won’t bother” with Thursday’s Republican debate — the last one before Monday’s Iowa caucuses. It’s certainly not the norm for a leading candidate to bail out on a party event just as primary season is about to begin. But Trump’s decision not to participate Thursday is especially weird because the debate is hosted by Fox News.

    In the school of thought that defines parties as networks of actors who have a common purpose, Fox News is easily included as part of the GOP — not just as a sympathetic news outlet, but as a member of the party coalition. So we have a situation where the Republican Party’s polling front-runner is openly feuding with its biggest media outlet. This is not how parties are supposed to work according to many political scientists.

    Trump, of course, has already sparred verbally with Fox anchor Megyn Kelly, who moderated the first Republican debate back in August. The incident was one of Trump’s early run-ins with the informal GOP establishment, including media figures such as Kelly and Erick Erickson, who decided to bar Trump from an event the next weekend. But those dust-ups passed quickly. This time, the conflict has intensified, with Trump remarking that Kelly is “not very good at what she does” and withdrawing from the debate.

    Pundits and political scientists have been debating for some time who controls presidential nominations, as well as what the 2016 race tells us about that question. The main argument has been whether Trump’s consistent success in the polls undercuts the theory that networked party elites can control the process, winnowing out undesirable candidates and promoting preferred ones.

    Now that Trump has been denounced by one major conservative media outlet, National Review, and continued a feud with another, what does this mean for party politics? One of the steadfast claims of the “Party Decides” school is that different types of actors in the coalition don’t really play distinct roles. The density of the networks between, say, official party organizations (like the Iowa Republican Party) and ideological interest groups (like the American Conservative Union) means that these groups share staff and funders, and their overall goals and functions within the party end up being pretty similar: to work toward common policy goals and nominate amenable candidates.
    mas http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...cid=538twitter

  2. #2
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Post Count
    6,202
    Fox News is probably part of the GOP establishment. In the first debate, they were hostile to Trump and the word after was that the moderators were trying to take him down. The establishment cannot control Trump and so they fear that he will win (but they prefer him to Cruz as Trump is seen as someone who will make a deal). But all that is part of his popularity - the base has seen that the establishment promises and doesn't do what they promise (beholden to big donors). My hope is that Trump (if elected) is beholden to no one and will do what is right for the US (not the big donors/establishment).

  3. #3
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Post Count
    97,536
    "Fox News is probably part of the GOP establishment."




  4. #4
    my unders, my frgn whites pgardn's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Post Count
    39,469
    Fox News is probably part of the GOP establishment. In the first debate, they were hostile to Trump and the word after was that the moderators were trying to take him down. The establishment cannot control Trump and so they fear that he will win (but they prefer him to Cruz as Trump is seen as someone who will make a deal). But all that is part of his popularity - the base has seen that the establishment promises and doesn't do what they promise (beholden to big donors). My hope is that Trump (if elected) is beholden to no one and will do what is right for the US (not the big donors/establishment).
    He will get rid of illegal immigrants without having the foggiest idea how much it will cost. He is playing antiestablishment by pretending he can solve problems that will cost tons of money. But I'd rather have him in than Cruz.

  5. #5
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
    My Team
    Sacramento Kings
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Post Count
    21,376
    He will get rid of illegal immigrants without having the foggiest idea how much it will cost. He is playing antiestablishment by pretending he can solve problems that will cost tons of money. But I'd rather have him in than Cruz.
    I enjoy the huge middle finger he's given to Republicans, Democrats, and the media.

  6. #6
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Post Count
    97,536
    He will get rid of illegal immigrants
    no, he won't do about immigrants, and MX won't pay for his fantasy border wall. He won't be Pres

  7. #7
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Post Count
    37,751
    Fox News is probably part of the GOP establishment.
    Yes, and Manu Ginobili is probably from south of the Equator.

  8. #8
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Post Count
    22,886
    Roger Ailes is on the GOP executive council permanently and is the founder/chairman of Fox News.

  9. #9
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Post Count
    20,699
    He will get rid of illegal immigrants without having the foggiest idea how much it will cost. He is playing antiestablishment by pretending he can solve problems that will cost tons of money. But I'd rather have him in than Cruz.
    A touchback policy doesn't have to be all that expensive & isn't even a new idea. For all his rhetoric for the base, that's all Trump is talking about.

    I kind of want Trump to become POTUS and propose comprehensive immigration reform with a touchback policy, similar to what McCain/Kennedy were talking about in '07, just to see Ann Coulter freak out and say "we've been betrayed".

  10. #10
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Post Count
    97,536
    Repugs have always, will always block a comprehensive immigration policy.

    broken immigration is one their major campaign, not governing, issues.

    They didn't do from 2001 - 2006, and haven't done from 2010 to now.

    Boner said no comprehensive, but (very slow) piecemeal reform of their campagning golden goose.

  11. #11
    my unders, my frgn whites pgardn's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Post Count
    39,469
    no, he won't do about immigrants, and MX won't pay for his fantasy border wall. He won't be Pres
    Ya tn me?

    I would have thought it was all possible...

  12. #12
    my unders, my frgn whites pgardn's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Post Count
    39,469
    A touchback policy doesn't have to be all that expensive & isn't even a new idea. For all his rhetoric for the base, that's all Trump is talking about.

    I kind of want Trump to become POTUS and propose comprehensive immigration reform with a touchback policy, similar to what McCain/Kennedy were talking about in '07, just to see Ann Coulter freak out and say "we've been betrayed".
    A wall and a roundup are expensive which is what he blathered about.

  13. #13
    Believe. mingus's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Post Count
    4,242
    Repugs have always, will always block a comprehensive immigration policy.

    broken immigration is one their major campaign, not governing, issues.

    They didn't do from 2001 - 2006, and haven't done from 2010 to now.

    Boner said no comprehensive, but (very slow) piecemeal reform of their campagning golden goose.
    Neither party has touched the immigration issue comprehensive or otherwise in any meaningful way because the business elite--those with the most influence over politicians--in this country greatly profits from illegal immigrants, who are inexpensive & exploitable as employees. They're a lot less "to deal with" than American workers. Essentially, it's a way for them to some extent to out-source their jobs with actually re-locating. This, along with NAFTA has dealt a big blow to American workers employment-wise & wage-wise. With the recession and the slow "recovery" have made the impacts more felt. They're both being driven by the "establishment" business elite on both sides of the aisle. I don't particularly think Trump is the answer. I mean, despite what he says he is, he's of that ilk, he's a Wall Sreet guy. Just like Obama's a Wall Street guy. Just like Hillary. The only one who, if you take a look at his track record, isn't a mouthpiece for them is Sanders. The problem I have with him is his prescriptions.

  14. #14
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Post Count
    97,536
    "Neither party has touched the immigration issue comprehensive"

    False. There was a pretty comprehensive bi-partisan Senate bill that Boner wouldn't allow in House committee, never mind aloow House vote.



  15. #15
    Veteran InRareForm's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Post Count
    8,644
    CNN : "Fox apologized, but it's too late"

    Lolz

  16. #16
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    44,141
    This was a brilliant move by Trump. He had nothing to gain and everything to lose by participating in this debate. Let the others field the tough questions. No answer is gonna please everyone. He is so far ahead in these first primaries that he could give a big you to the system and his backers will still love it.

  17. #17
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Post Count
    153,473
    It should be damn near impossible for the GOP to lose this election... if they don't manage to pull it off, they really have a lot of soul searching to do...

  18. #18
    俺はまんこが大好きなんだよ baseline bum's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    97,881
    It should be damn near impossible for the GOP to lose this election... if they don't manage to pull it off, they really have a lot of soul searching to do...
    It should be impossible when the top two candidate are (1) a guy who will get almost zero support from mexicans and (2) a far right lunatic? Clinton is a truly awful candidate but the Republicans have to nominate someone people hate less than her.

  19. #19
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Post Count
    97,536
    It should be damn near impossible for the GOP to lose this election... if they don't manage to pull it off, they really have a lot of soul searching to do...

    1. have you seen, heard the Repug candidates?

    2. Repugs have souls?

  20. #20
    Best Believe. Ball Buster's Avatar
    My Team
    Los Angeles Lakers
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Post Count
    828
    It's probably just me, but Rand Paul looks like a very good conservative candidate in this debate. Very poised and well thought out. Weird how his poll numbers are so low, behind tight-wads like Cruz and Rubio

  21. #21
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
    My Team
    Sacramento Kings
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Post Count
    21,376
    This was a brilliant move by Trump. He had nothing to gain and everything to lose by participating in this debate. Let the others field the tough questions. No answer is gonna please everyone. He is so far ahead in these first primaries that he could give a big you to the system and his backers will still love it.
    Been funny watching CNN praise Trump's move and on Huckabee and Santorum for attending.

  22. #22
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ TheSanityAnnex's Avatar
    My Team
    Sacramento Kings
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Post Count
    21,376
    Curious to see the ratings hit Fox took.

  23. #23
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Post Count
    153,473
    It should be impossible when the top two candidate are (1) a guy who will get almost zero support from mexicans and (2) a far right lunatic? Clinton is a truly awful candidate but the Republicans have to nominate someone people hate less than her.
    But that's their own damn fault. I mean, they dropped the ball terribly in the previous election, and they still haven't figured out?

    You have 8 years of wear and tear from Democrats, and on top of that shillary, which is unlikable as they come. There should really be no excuses to this up... but I agree, so far they're managing...

  24. #24
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Post Count
    22,886
    But that's their own damn fault. I mean, they dropped the ball terribly in the previous election, and they still haven't figured out?

    You have 8 years of wear and tear from Democrats, and on top of that shillary, which is unlikable as they come. There should really be no excuses to this up... but I agree, so far they're managing...
    You read like wishcasting. Polls are polls and Trump wins the nomination and not the election. 538 has a much bleaker picture for your party.

  25. #25
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Post Count
    153,473
    You read like wishcasting. Polls are polls and Trump wins the nomination and not the election. 538 has a much bleaker picture for your party.
    I don't have a party, tbh. I prefer pendulum swings, as a way to reduce power entrenchment. It's just a preference though, I'm fully aware it doesn't always happen.

    BTW, thanks for sharing the link, and I agree so far that they're looking like they're going to flunk it and it's going to be their own damn fault.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •