kevin martin - Better than huey duey or luey

[tholdren]

play him more

[tholdren]

martin leading the bench with a plus 12

[TheGreatYacht]

Led them in scoring last game, and led them in +/- today...

Should get plenty of time these last games when Pop starts resting the vets

[TMTTRIO]

He needs a lot of Manu's minutes. Love Manu but he's still not 100% going into the playoffs.

[Mnky]

Been hyping this signing since the beginning. Much better scorer than the people he replaces, which is all that matters when he's replacing people who don't defend well.

[ElNono]

He will get Kyle's minutes if he doesn't pick up his game, IMO

[gameFACE]

Draw dem fouls.

[ace3g]

Tom Orsborn Tom_orsborn
Pop called Kevin Martin a "movement kind of player...He doesn't hold (the ball). He gets it. He learned a lot playing for Rick Adelman."

[apalisoc_9]

Tom Orsborn Tom_orsborn
Pop called Kevin Martin a "movement kind of player...He doesn't hold (the ball). He gets it. He learned a lot playing for Rick Adelman."

That's a great way to describe Martin offensive game. Hes a brilliant offensive player. He knows how to find ways off ball to score.

[SAGirl]

He will get Kyle's minutes if he doesn't pick up his game, IMO

I think the rest of the season we continue to see Kyle just because development. These games don't matter much for seeding, so its fine. Probably two things:
(1) Development. Needs to play to learn how to play. We underestimate all the time the fact he was a PG and now he's not. He actually looks best as a 4, just doesn't have the strength right now to play it full time. I really think he's learning how to play this position with Pop.
(2) More development and probably with a sight to the future.

Playoffs is another matter and another monster. He probably doesn't play unless its a matchup thing and they need him. That's actually another reason to play him right now. In the chance that you need him, he needs to play now. It actually doesn't hurt that he plays in the perimeter right now as a 3, bc if we use him as a 4 in the playoffs the whole point is that he can switch and guard in the perimeter, something our other bigs can't do. There is a method to Pop's madness.

[Spurtacular]

Spurs still reeling from allowing their best outside threat to go in the preseason. Sad.

[ElNono]

I think the rest of the season we continue to see Kyle just because development. These games don't matter much for seeding, so its fine. Probably two things:
(1) Development. Needs to play to learn how to play. We underestimate all the time the fact he was a PG and now he's not. He actually looks best as a 4, just doesn't have the strength right now to play it full time. I really think he's learning how to play this position with Pop.
(2) More development and probably with a sight to the future.

Playoffs is another matter and another monster. He probably doesn't play unless its a matchup thing and they need him. That's actually another reason to play him right now. In the chance that you need him, he needs to play now. It actually doesn't hurt that he plays in the perimeter right now as a 3, bc if we use him as a 4 in the playoffs the whole point is that he can switch and guard in the perimeter, something our other bigs can't do. There is a method to Pop's madness.

Actually, we're getting to the point in the season where you've done your reps, and now you're trying to put everything together going towards the playoffs. Working on execution for 48 mins, defense, Pop actually yelling at players for making mistakes, etc.
In that sense, "development" time should start being left to the time where there's blowouts (like tonight). Now KMart just joined the team, so if Pop is really looking at using him as part of a 3 guard lineup off the bench, he needs to catch up and "development" is going to have to take a backseat to that, IMO.

I think Kyle is a good prospect, but his time won't be this season.

[SAGirl]

Actually, we're getting to the point in the season where you've done your reps, and now you're trying to put everything together going towards the playoffs. Working on execution for 48 mins, defense, Pop actually yelling at players for making mistakes, etc.
In that sense, "development" time should start being left to the time where there's blowouts (like tonight). Now KMart just joined the team, so if Pop is really looking at using him as part of a 3 guard lineup off the bench, he needs to catch up and "development" is going to have to take a backseat to that, IMO.

I think Kyle is a good prospect, but his time won't be this season.

You could be right and you know Pop and the Spurs for longer than I do.
But, I do I think Pop likes him though, and I don't think he's some secret weapon or anything, but he's carved up a role. You could say the same for someone else who is in a shooting funk, bench him, but they will only get out of it by playing and he might have a role to play....And precisely bc he's young he needs as much experience as you can get him and you know garbage time is not the same.... you keep forgetting he's played a lot lately in games.

We actually came out of the RR with the team and style that was going to make it and with a terrific record. Kmart was a late addition, but Kyle had earned his keep by then. I think Pop will play whoever he thinks he needs and that may be Kmart, but it's not a sure thing. Actually, Kyle could possibly see more playing time in certain situations than Dwest as you saw against GSW.

Edit: I guess what I am saying is that I admit if he's not more aggressive, he could loose his spot in the bench... but what I think is that ultimately even if that were to happen, he could still have a role and in that case he frankly needs to play. He's not Bonner who you are going to dust off in the WCF to help you against GSW. A guy that young practically a baby in the Spurs needs his reps if you need him there and I think Pop thinks he might be needed.

[skulls138]

KA seems like he holds back, in a good way.

[Brazil]

Is chinook ok btw ?

10 mpg... Positive advanced metrics, per of 15... 3 points better than with previous team... Usage 5 points lower

he needs the ball in his hand, not gonna be a good fit, sucks off the ball

[ElNono]

You could be right and you know Pop and the Spurs for longer than I do.
But, I do I think Pop likes him though, and I don't think he's some secret weapon or anything, but he's carved up a role. You could say the same for someone else who is in a shooting funk, bench him, but they will only get out of it by playing and he might have a role to play....And precisely bc he's young he needs as much experience as you can get him and you know garbage time is not the same.... you keep forgetting he's played a lot lately in games.

We actually came out of the RR with the team and style that was going to make it and with a terrific record. Kmart was a late addition, but Kyle had earned his keep by then. I think Pop will play whoever he thinks he needs and that may be Kmart, but it's not a sure thing. Actually, Kyle could possibly see more playing time in certain situations than Dwest as you saw against GSW.

Edit: I guess what I am saying is that I admit if he's not more aggressive, he could loose his spot in the bench... but what I think is that ultimately even if that were to happen, he could still have a role and in that case he frankly needs to play. He's not Bonner who you are going to dust off in the WCF to help you against GSW. A guy that young practically a baby in the Spurs needs his reps if you need him there and I think Pop thinks he might be needed.

The Spurs think long term. It's perfectly fine if he's a "regular season rotation" guy this season. He wasn't last season. That's progress. Next season he might make the cut into "playoffs rotation" guy. Natural progression.

If he doesn't make the cut, it doesn't mean Pop doesn't trust him or the Spurs don't like him. It just means he might not be ready for that next step now. Nothing wrong with that. I would actually guess that due to the fact that the 1st round opponent will likely be weak, he'll get some burn, and that will probably dictate what happens next.

[SouthernFried]

I definetly like what I've seen from Keven Martin so far. And I think POP nailed it on the description. So, yeah...I'd like to see him get more minutes.

[apalisoc_9]

Is chinook ok btw ?

10 mpg... Positive advanced metrics, per of 15... 3 points better than with previous team... Usage 5 points lower

he needs the ball in his hand, not gonna be a good fit, sucks off the ball

Is the last part of your post sarcastic? Kmart has never been a stick on his hands kinda scorer..i mean hes had years where his teams wanted him to but his best assest has always been his ability to get himself open by understanding what is happening in the half court and making moves to free himself up.

Hes best offensive weapn has always been his ability to move and get himself open without the ball.

[Twisted_Dawg]

Tom Orsborn Tom_orsborn
Pop called Kevin Martin a "movement kind of player...He doesn't hold (the ball). He gets it. He learned a lot playing for Rick Adelman."

Dig at Parker?

[Chinook]

Is chinook ok btw ?

10 mpg...

10 MPG including garbage time. He's played 77 percent of his minutes in games where the Spurs pulled their guys early.

Positive advanced metrics, per of 15

He's behind Bonner in every advanced metric. Don't get me wrong, he's ahead of a lot of people too. But small sample size and playing mostly garbage time will do that for you. Look at Boban.

Usage 5 points lower

Sixth on the team still, with one of the guys ahead of him being Boban. And he's shooting the sixth most threes per 36, lower than any perimeter rotation player other than Parker (though I guess he's almost tied with Leonard). And from the eye test, he's only gotten off two good looks so far. His other two makes have been with heavy pressure, which is nice in the sense that it shows he can make contested shots but bad in the sense that those shots shouldn't have been contested. He's been run off the line quite a bit, which you don't expect against garbage-time players.

[tholdren]

Is chinook ok btw ?

10 mpg... Positive advanced metrics, per of 15... 3 points better than with previous team... Usage 5 points lower

he needs the ball in his hand, not gonna be a good fit, sucks off the ball

Chinook died when he stated plus minus was a legit stat to base performance of an individual, then talked himself in circle until he ended up arguing against his original claim. Never been the same since.

Rip Chinook

[GSH]

That's a great way to describe Martin offensive game. Hes a brilliant offensive player. He knows how to find ways off ball to score.

Is the last part of your post sarcastic? Kmart has never been a stick on his hands kinda scorer..i mean hes had years where his teams wanted him to but his best assest has always been his ability to get himself open by understanding what is happening in the half court and making moves to free himself up.

Hes best offensive weapn has always been his ability to move and get himself open without the ball.

How can you be the same guy who starts those lame-ass threads? K-Mart's ability to create his own shot is something the Spurs are sorely lacking. I agree that it is, and has been, his greatest asset. And it's an asset that is not easy to come by in the league.

He's also better at getting to the line than anyone else on the roster, even at his age. (I'm not counting Boban - that's something else entirely.) That his a huge asset in the playoffs. If the Spurs have a successful playoff run, I'd be willing to bet that Martin will come up big at least a couple of times.

[SAGirl]

The Spurs think long term. It's perfectly fine if he's a "regular season rotation" guy this season. He wasn't last season. That's progress. Next season he might make the cut into "playoffs rotation" guy. Natural progression.

If he doesn't make the cut, it doesn't mean Pop doesn't trust him or the Spurs don't like him. It just means he might not be ready for that next step now. Nothing wrong with that. I would actually guess that due to the fact that the 1st round opponent will likely be weak, he'll get some burn, and that will probably dictate what happens next.

Martin needs to be hidden on defense. He gets lost off the ball a lot + he's a guard.
Kyle is a forward, that allows him to help out our undersized bigs, boxes out other bigs, switches on to them, covers up mistakes, grabs contested rebounds + Pop is super strict with him on his defense, has to run back and quarterback our transition D, not always successfully but Martin is a worse option.

Then you consider that Kyle carved up a specific role that we are likely to need and that he's played all through these last couple of months defending perimeter 4s and you simply can't bench him unless he does that to himself like Simmons and he hasn't. Dwest ended up playing less minutes than him this past game bc he couldn't check Whiteside nor anyone else in the perimeter. He barely played against GSW. There are clear matches where we will need a good 10 minutes from Kyle and he's not Bonner. He's not going to come in ready to perform at his tender age if you haven't played him to get him ready for that.

Martin seems more like a floater, has to be ready to play with any line-up for any guard at any point. That may be the bench, instead of Anderson, but it may be any others too, including Danny, Manu and Mills.

[tholdren]

Martin needs to be hidden on defense. He gets lost off the ball a lot + he's a guard.
Kyle is a forward, that allows him to help out our undersized bigs, boxes out other bigs, switches on to them, covers up mistakes, grabs contested rebounds + Pop is super strict with him on his defense, has to run back and quarterback our transition D, not always successfully but Martin is a worse option.

Then you consider that Kyle carved up a specific role that we are likely to need and that he's played all through these last couple of months defending perimeter 4s and you simply can't bench him unless he does that to himself like Simmons and he hasn't. Dwest ended up playing less minutes than him this past game bc he couldn't check Whiteside nor anyone else in the perimeter. He barely played against GSW. There are clear matches where we will need a good 10 minutes from Kyle and he's not Bonner. He's not going to come in ready to perform at his tender age if you haven't played him to get him ready for that.

Martin seems more like a floater, has to be ready to play with any line-up for any guard at any point. That may be the bench, instead of Anderson, but it may be any others too, including Danny, Manu and Mills.

The difference between martin and anderson is that kevin is a great scorer. He's above average at one end of the floor. Kyle is not great at anything. He's barely average at either end of the floor.

[Dex]

Spurs still reeling from allowing their best outside threat to go in the preseason. Sad.

I'll take the consolation prize of Aldridge tbh.