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Tim in his prime would have ripped up any of those guys.
You do know that Tim ACTUALLY played in April right? Pop was trying to give him reps before the postseason started so let's see how he fared:
Split Value G GS MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS FG% 3P% FT% TS% USG% ORtg DRtg +/- MP PTS TRB AST Month October 2 2 55 7 15 0 0 9 9 3 14 1 2 3 3 4 23 .467 1.000 .607 17.3 115 93 +16.0 27.5 11.5 7.0 0.5 November 15 15 418 59 112 0 1 25 35 34 139 50 12 26 30 43 143 .527 .000 .714 .561 17.3 108 91 +15.3 27.8 9.5 9.3 3.3 December
11 11 273 37 73 0 0 12 18 16 72 34 8 11 21 21 86 .507 .667 .531 17.0 102 94 +21.5 24.8 7.8
6.5 3.1
January 9 9 214 32 66 0 1 12 16 11 54 25 11 9 9 20 76 .485 .000 .750 .520 17.2 111 96 +21.5 23.8 8.4 6.0 2.8 February
7 7 152 18 49 0 0 9 12 11 48 17 3 9 9 15 45 .367 .750 .415 19.3 93 100 +4.5 21.7 6.4 6.9 2.4 March 12 11 285 44 81 0 0 16 26 28 88 28 10 13 11 17 104 .543 .615 .563 16.9 117 98 +15.7 23.7 8.7 7.3 2.3 April
5 5 140 18 45 0 0 9 15 12 32 8 1 7 7 5 45 .400 .600 .436
19.6 92
107 -9.4
28.0 9.0 6.4 1.6
Split Value G GS MP FG FGA 3P 3PA FT FTA ORB TRB AST STL BLK TOV PF PTS FG% 3P% FT% TS% USG% ORtg DRtg +/- MP PTS TRB AST Month October 3 3 94 15 32 0 2 4 4 4 23 6 3 10 6 7 34 .469 .000 1.000 .504 19.3 95 90 -2.6 31.3 11.3 7.7 2.0 November 12 12 343 70 171 0 5 31 42 27 131 29 8 18 13 21 171 .409 .000 .738 .451 25.9 97 95 -3.9 28.6 14.3 10.9 2.4 December
14 14 468 101 203 4 10 60 75 39 157 48 7 37 32 35 266 .498 .400 .800 .564 24.8 113 99 +5.2
33.4 19.0 11.2 3.4 January 15 15 486 107 213 5 9 42 51 33 173 60 6 26 39 24 261 .502 .556 .824 .554 25.0 109 102 +2.9 32.4 17.4 11.5 4.0 February
11 11 374 76 161 8 18 43 50 19 124 66 8 16 24 24 203
.472 .444 .860 .555 24.4 114 105 -0.4 34.0 18.5 11.3 6.0 March 12 12 366 66 154 4 17 35 46 24 129 69 7 24 40 26 171 .429 .235 .761 .491 25.5 97 103 -5.7 30.5 14.3 10.8 5.8 April 5 5 160 32 61 3 8 14 21 9 56 16 3 15 10 11 81 .525 .375 .667 .577 23.2 112
104 -12.5 32.1 16.2 11.2 3.2
When Pau had his FULL compliment of teammates in December (Bulls beat the Spurs during that span) he was ACTUALLY better than PRE-injury Tim:
-Tim: +8 net rtg
-Pau: +14 net rtg
Pau struggled when Butler/Rose/Noah were out w/ injuries & he had to carry the offense (check out his assist numbers) while having to also manning the paint ala Tim in 2014-15 when the Spurs were wrecked w/ injuries. He held up in February but he wore down in March then bounced back when Butler/Rose returned back to the lineup to finish the season.
**Ignore the boxscore +/- b/c the Bulls were a lotto team**
Last edited by Kawhitstorm; 07-12-2016 at 03:40 PM.
Tim in his prime would have ripped up any of those guys.
Agree but that's not what the OP is saying.
I don't think there should be much doubt at all that Pau will be an upgrade over last year's Duncan...especially the post-knee injury Duncan we saw down the stretch of the season and in the playoffs.
Our starting lineup is almost certainly going to be better than it was last year. Aldridge will have another year under his belt. Pau should be an upgrade over Duncan. Green can't possibly be any worse than he was last yearI'm actually very excited to see them play.
Our bench is where the question marks come into play. Is Patty going to have a bounce back season? How will Manu look at 39 years old? Is KA ready to take a step forward and become a consistent contributor off the bench? Are guys like Bertans or LJC going to be worth a damn in their first NBA seasons? How will Dedmon fit in? could either go really well, or really poorly. Could see us having one of the best benches in the league or one of the worst ones
The Cavs bench was pretty mediocre until they made the Frye trade.Our bench is where the question marks come into play. Is Patty going to have a bounce back season? How will Manu look at 39 years old? Is KA ready to take a step forward and become a consistent contributor off the bench? Are guys like Bertans or LJC going to be worth a damn in their first NBA seasons? How will Dedmon fit in? could either go really well, or really poorly. Could see us having one of the best benches in the league or one of the worst ones
Mozgov/Shumpert/Sideshow Bob were horrific in the regular season, Delly had regressed & Jefferson was their best backup wing.
Maybe Patty can have a contract year season & Fat Head will have a breakout season. I've a feeling someone like Carlos Boozer is going to end up being the backup PF since he was PATFO fall back plan if D-Worst didn't sign:
Already brown nosing:
jesus noThe Cavs bench was pretty mediocre until they made the Frye trade.
Mozgov/Shumpert/Sideshow Bob were horrific in the regular season, Delly had regressed & Jefferson was their best backup wing.
Maybe Patty can have a contract year season & Fat Head will have a breakout season. I've a feeling someone like Carlos Boozer is going to end up being the backup PF since he was PATFO fall back plan if D-Worst didn't sign:
Already brown nosing:
Boozer would be an ok option for a 4th big man.
Out of all the free agent big men who fall into the "vet" category, Brandon Bass would be the PERFECT 4th big but he opted out of a 3 mill guaranteed deal so he's looking to get paid. So, it's basically Boozer/D-Lee/Big Baby.
No, he wouldn't. Bass can't space to three and isn't much of a passer either.Out of all the free agent big men who fall into the "vet" category, Brandon Bass would be the PERFECT 4th big but he opted out of a 3 mill guaranteed deal so he's looking to get paid. So, it's basically Boozer/D-Lee/Big Baby.
And I don't think anyone thinks Duncan's struggles were because of a particular opponent, though they were magnified/exacerbated by it. His struggles were because his one decent knee was shot. End of story.
Posting raw totals is antiquated and silly though. Raw totals are largely based on cir stance. Gasol's role will now be similar to Duncan's and as such, his numbers will decline significantly. It won't necessarily mean he's any worse than last season though.
Except Pau was better when Tim had one good knee (see December)
Posting raw totals is antiquated and silly though.
Raw totals?
Move the wool covering your eyes b/c the list INCLUDES ORtg/DRtg/TS%/USG%...etc
No reading comprehension whatsoever. I said Duncan's struggles were because his one previously decent knee was shot, not "he was better than Gasol in the first half of the season".Except Pau was better when Tim had one good knee (see December)
Raw totals?
Move the wool covering your eyes b/c the list INCLUDES ORtg/DRtg/TS%/USG%...etc
Buddy, you were in the other post arguing that Tim was a better finisher than Pau even AFTER his knee was shot: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...=1#post8665693
Ah, now it's move the goal post time and refer to another thread.Buddy, you were in the other post arguing that Tim was a better finisher than Pau even AFTER his knee was shot: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...=1#post8665693
Buddy, I never said that. I said the numbers don't support this notion that Gasol is in a different league as a finisher.
This post was inspired by your claim that there wasn't enough sample size in the playoffs & that it had to do w/ him facing Ibaka/Adams.)
Look at their April numbers & get back at me.Buddy, I never said that. I said the numbers don't support this notion that Gasol is in a different league as a finisher.Tim was cooked even after Pop rested him then tried to get him going before the playoffs started.
The playoffs are a small sample size and I said it was magnified/exacerbated by him facing Ibaka/Adams. But again, that's another matter altogether.This post was inspired by your claim that there wasn't enough sample size in the playoffs & that it had to do w/ him facing Ibaka/Adams.
Look at their April numbers & get back at me.
This originated when you claimed I said he was better than at Gasol at any point last season, which is made up. Then you tried to change the subject because you came off looking like a damn fool.
Who needs an entire season's worth of evidence, when you can isolate one month?
I posted their stats from the ENTIRE season & you STILL want more.
I suggest you look at the month of December when Pau had his full compliment of teammates & Tim actually had a good knee.Who needs an entire season's worth of evidence, when you can isolate one month?
Here's the genesis of this . . .
What I said had nothing to do with Gasol and I've never claimed in this or any thread that Gasol, all around, wasn't better from start to finish last season.
You either inexplicably completely misunderstood what was said or are flat out making things up.
Gasol had a TS of 56% in December when he didn't have to play 1-on-5, meanwhile Tim w/ on good knee had a TS% of 53% w/ a majority of his shots coming at the rim. If Pau was playing w/ LMA/Kawhi instead of Noah/Taj/Snell then he would have been shooting 60%.
Again, what does this have to do with what I said?
Here, I'll put it in bold and all caps this time, so maybe you'll comprehend it: GASOL WAS THE BETTER ALL AROUND PLAYER FROM START TO FINISH LAST SEASON, BUT BY PERCENTAGE, HE DIDN'T FINISH BETTER AT THE RIM.
You make some valid points as to why and I agree that he'll probably finish better next season, but that doesn't change the fact that he didn't last season.
The Cavs bench was pretty mediocre until they made the Frye trade.
Mozgov/Shumpert/Sideshow Bob were horrific in the regular season, Delly had regressed & Jefferson was their best backup wing.
Maybe Patty can have a contract year season & Fat Head will have a breakout season. I've a feeling someone like Carlos Boozer is going to end up being the backup PF since he was PATFO fall back plan if D-Worst didn't sign:
Already brown nosing:
2015 tweet abou boozer
Except Gasol was a better finisher at the rim when Butler/Rose were healthy & he was getting dump offs at the rim like Tim in December. A majority of Gasol's shot at the rim (0-3) were from post-ups which he converted at a respectable rate while Tim was HORRIFIC on post-ups aka when he had a defender on his shoulder.
Basically, if Gasol was getting the same looks as Tim then his shooting percentage would be pretty similar to what he put up in December.
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