Is Gasol Empty Calories?

[jehawk81]

I see you just started watching the NBA. You should go to reddit. More your type of basketball knowledge...

You fit right in tbh

[Seventyniner]

There won't be the opportunity to be a " massive" upgrade. Gasol won't all of a sudden shoot 70% from the field. Passing, they're about the same. Gasoll has a leg up on mid-range jumpers but that's not a great shot and he'll make low 40% of those. It's all about efficiency and he's about as efficient as TD -- the volume won't be there to be a massive upgrade.

Completely disagree with that last sentence, at least if we're comparing Pau to post-injury Tim. From February to April, Tim's TS% was 0.493 (dismal for a big man, of the 44 bigs that played 20 MPG, Andre Drummon had the 3rd worst TS% at 0.499), while Pau's was 0.529 for the season (10th worst of those 44 bigs, but almost a standard deviation above Tim's post-injury 0.493).

The volume should also change; Pau's USG% was just under 25% in Chicago while Tim was just under 18%. I would expect Kawhi and LMA to have USG around 25 (25.8, 25.9 respectively last season) while Pau should be around 21-22, with the backcourt having a dropoff.

3% in TS and 3-4% in USG, okay. Perhaps I'm exaggerating some when calling Pau a "massive" upgrade. But it's a very clear upgrade and one that, in my opinion, will more than offset the hit the Spurs will take on defense.

But I think it's the synergistic effects that are the most important. Tim didn't have any gravity after his injury, his man would just camp at the rim. Both LMA and Pau being midrange threats opens up the high-low much more.

[Chinook]

Completely disagree with that last sentence, at least if we're comparing Pau to post-injury Tim. From February to April, Tim's TS% was 0.493 (dismal for a big man, of the 44 bigs that played 20 MPG, Andre Drummon had the 3rd worst TS% at 0.499), while Pau's was 0.529 for the season (10th worst of those 44 bigs, but almost a standard deviation above Tim's post-injury 0.493).

The volume should also change; Pau's USG% was just under 25% in Chicago while Tim was just under 18%. I would expect Kawhi and LMA to have USG around 25 (25.8, 25.9 respectively last season) while Pau should be around 21-22, with the backcourt having a dropoff.

3% in TS and 3-4% in USG, okay. Perhaps I'm exaggerating some when calling Pau a "massive" upgrade. But it's a very clear upgrade and one that, in my opinion, will more than offset the hit the Spurs will take on defense.

But I think it's the synergistic effects that are the most important. Tim didn't have any gravity after his injury, his man would just camp at the rim. Both LMA and Pau being midrange threats opens up the high-low much more.

And Pau can play more minutes, which means he will have time without LMA where his usage can rise. I feel like even if Dedmon is not the starter that he'll play a huge chunk of his minutes with Aldridge. So Pau being the offensive focal point of the bench would be a massive upgrade over anything Tim was going to do to that end.

[spurs10]

That's a painful bit of reality. I hope for the Spurs' sake that you're wrong, but that's some realistic insight I think. I have no opinion of Dedmon at this point...he's never played meaningful minutes on a meaningful team to show me what he's got. Murray is not ready to impact an NBA roster past perhaps the 3rd string point guard who makes some impressive plays at times (right now that is...we'll see what his learning curve looks like). Gasol is an enigma...he has all the tools to be a huge addition, but then I find myself concerned about his skillset at this point in his career, and him infringing on LMA's mojo. Pop will really need to make people's roles clear this year if the Spurs are going to do well. This is Aldridge and Leonard's team at this point and everyone else needs to fill their roles to perfection and stay out of the way of the Big 2. The one positive with Gasol vs. Duncan is that LMA won't have the 'awe' factor with Gasol that he had at first playing alongside Tim so I'd guess he'll jump in and be the go-to guy and not worry so much about stepping on Gasol's toes. Again, Pop will need to define what Gasol's role is and not let him bring LaMarcus's game down by getting in the way.

I'm really happy that we have him. That defining of their roles will be something I'm sure Pop will be all over. The players themselves are sure to vigilant of how they work together.

[Brazil]

You've been called slurper too...

I'm guilty your honor...

[Kawhitstorm]

There won't be the opportunity to be a " massive" upgrade. Gasol won't all of a sudden shoot 70% from the field. Passing, they're about the same. Gasoll has a leg up on mid-range jumpers but that's not a great shot and he'll make low 40% of those. It's all about efficiency and he's about as efficient as TD -- the volume won't be there to be a massive upgrade.

The team is going to be somewhat like the '08-'09 Lakers when Bynum was on a minute restriction & Pau was playing a good chunk of his minutes at center in the playoffs.

LMA/Pau/Lee/Kyle/Dedmon should be able to emulate Bynum/Pau/Odom/Walton especially if Kyle/Dedmon become legit rotation players.

Kawhi/Danny/Porker/Patty are better than Kirby/Ariza/Fisher/Farmar.

I guess Bertans/Simmons/Murray would be Radmonovic/Sasha/Brown.

[dabom]

I'm guilty your honor...

[TD 21]

I elaborated on this to many writers and Spurs fans on twitter on how Gasol was "empty calories". I didn't want him and I elaborated why I preferred a Plumlee type ( which they got in Dedmon) and a guy like Harkless to match up with Golden State. The Spurs didn't need a player in the front court who's value is tied strictly to touches on the offensive end and the touches aren't even that valuable considering his age and where his game is at.

Most people expect Gasols numbers from last year to translate.. they simply won't. His numbers should go down to around 11-12 ppg and 6-8 rebounds at best. He'll likely opt in after the year is up because, from a numbers perspective and considering his age, he will have a "down" year ( even though his efficiency should remain relatively similar -- the volume in all phases from attempts to uncontested rebound opportunities won't be close to the same playing with Aldridge and Kawhi).

All in all, I can't really complain and I understand why they went after Gasol, but I would have preferred going a different route.

I should have clarified: I still would have signed him because I think he was the best talent and fit culturally (though he has a massive ego that gets ignored because he's white) and can help keep them elite in the short term. But I don't think he's quite as good as he might appear to be on the surface.

They definitely needed the athletic, rim roller/protector type, but they got that too, in Dedmon and they got it for a fraction of the cost of what Plumlee got (though Dedmon could be a year away from a similar contract).

Actually what worries me the most about him are the multiple reports I have read that he doesn't box out and just defends bc he's that tall and long but can't keep up with anybody. He could really underperfom. It's a scary proposition. The not boxing out explains why the team is rebounding better with him off the floor. He might be bench bound if he's making the team worse but he's got a PO. Spurs are stuck.

Per Vantage Sports, as of February, he was 2nd in the league with 71 missed block outs. He essentially relies entirely on his height (7'1'') and length (7'4'' wingspan) to rebound.

He's not Drew Gooden. He will be a solid playoff performer and will open up more space for LMA and also give him a spell on O. And teams won't be able to load up on Kawhi either. His passing will help the offense flow. I think Gasol, Mills, Leonard, LMA and Green will be a great lineup.

Despite never receiving nearly enough praise for it, Duncan was as good a passing center as there was in the league.

[Kawhitstorm]

Per Vantage Sports, as of February, he was 2nd in the league with 71 missed block outs. He essentially relies entirely on his height (7'1'') and length (7'4'' wingspan) to rebound.

He's also difficult to boxout on the other end since he reaches over guys even when they block him out. He used to piss me off when he would miss but ends up tipping the ball in without jumping while he has 3 guys surrounding him.

[Kawhitstorm]

And Pau can play more minutes, which means he will have time without LMA where his usage can rise. I feel like even if Dedmon is not the starter that he'll play a huge chunk of his minutes with Aldridge. So Pau being the offensive focal point of the bench would be a massive upgrade over anything Tim was going to do to that end.

Pau/Lee should be featured w/ the bench unit b/c they would get killed by starters.

[cd98]

I think Pau will make the Spurs a little better on offense, but a little worse on defense. I will be curious to see if he is a starter or plays starter minutes. The real deal will be who gets crunch time minutes out of our bigs. His playing time will probably fluctuate with matchups on a per team basis.

[gambit1990]

I see you just started watching the NBA. You should go to reddit. More your type of basketball knowledge...

i remember when sagirl tried talking down to me. i was watching the nba a decade before she started to.

[gambit1990]

I'd be more worried about the further regression of Parker (shouldn't be a starter), Ginobili having enough in the tank for one last long grind and Danny/Patty finding their touch from downtown.

#1 concern going forward. i called it a looong time ago when most people on here were stilling buying into him/calling him MVParker

[Prose]

I elaborated on this to many writers and Spurs fans on twitter on how Gasol was "empty calories". I didn't want him and I elaborated why I preferred a Plumlee type ( which they got in Dedmon) and a guy like Harkless to match up with Golden State. The Spurs didn't need a player in the front court who's value is tied strictly to touches on the offensive end and the touches aren't even that valuable considering his age and where his game is at.

Most people expect Gasols numbers from last year to translate.. they simply won't. His numbers should go down to around 11-12 ppg and 6-8 rebounds at best. He'll likely opt in after the year is up because, from a numbers perspective and considering his age, he will have a "down" year ( even though his efficiency should remain relatively similar -- the volume in all phases from attempts to uncontested rebound opportunities won't be close to the same playing with Aldridge and Kawhi).

All in all, I can't really complain and I understand why they went after Gasol, but I would have preferred going a different route.

[ViceCity86]

Pau Coca-Cola

[MaNu4Tres]

Maybe people have a better understanding of what TD21 and I meant in this thread.

Empty calories indeed.

[NameLess Scrub]

Is Pau Donuts with Coke?

Is Pau taffys with Kool Aid?

Love the thread le.

[SAGirl]

He's been bad. I am sure he's not going to be happy if he keeps getting benched.

[Cklbmk]

Gasol needs to be our 6th man.

Mills-Manu-Anderson-Lee-Gasol

needs to be a lineup I think.

they would have excellent passing and hopefully Gasol can abuse 2nd units.


Gasol needs the same role as Kanter, Jefferson, Okafor, Monroe, etc

[DPG21920]

Dude - it's so early. TP playing bad/hurt. No Danny. I mean come on.

[spursistan]

Seriously this terrible and useless signing. What would be we doing with his 20/9 against the Heat/Wizards of the worlds?

Spurs putting a ball and chain on their roster and financial flexibility..Now that Parker down, 15 millions would have been put better on guard..smh..

Hoping at least Pop wise up and cut his minutes for Dedmon..

[spursistan]

^ I hate LMA playing style, but at least he can still lockdown on D.. Gasol is going to be virtually unplayable against all contenders and mid-tier teams that have a physical edge.

[MaNu4Tres]

I elaborated on this to many writers and Spurs fans on twitter on how Gasol was "empty calories". I didn't want him and I elaborated why I preferred a Plumlee type ( which they got in Dedmon) and a guy like Harkless to match up with Golden State. The Spurs didn't need a player in the front court who's value is tied strictly to touches on the offensive end and the touches aren't even that valuable considering his age and where his game is at.

Most people expect Gasols numbers from last year to translate.. they simply won't. His numbers should go down to around 11-12 ppg and 6-8 rebounds at best. He'll likely opt in after the year is up because, from a numbers perspective and considering his age, he will have a "down" year ( even though his efficiency should remain relatively similar -- the volume in all phases from attempts to uncontested rebound opportunities won't be close to the same playing with Aldridge and Kawhi).

All in all, I can't really complain and I understand why they went after Gasol, but I would have preferred going a different route.

[SAGirl]

^ I hate LMA playing style, but at least he can still lockdown on D.. Gasol is going to be virtually unplayable against all contenders and mid-tier teams that has a physical edge.

I agree100%..
LMA is passing better though. 5 assists in this game and was huge down the stretch. Precisely the reason why if you must bench or trade one it has to be Gasol.

He is empty calories.

[apalisoc_9]

^ I hate LMA playing style, but at least he can still lockdown on D.. Gasol is going to be virtually unplayable against all contenders and mid-tier teams that has a physical edge.

Aldridge has never been a bad defender and if the post was utilized more by opponets, he would be our third best defender. He's a great post defender. He can move well and if he gets in shape he'd be even a better defender. Right now, we really only have 4 positive defenders...Leonard-Green-Dedmon-Aldridge...Lee and Manu are smart system defenders but will get exposed if teams decide to attack them.

The offense in many of the games this year have stagnated because we're forcing Pau and Tony offensively. Both probably pout and complain about touches.

Last year despite the slow starts, it was prettrty evident the only time the team would get explosive offensive spurts is when Kawhi (see 4th quarter) and Aldridge arent too worried about hurting Gasol and Porkers feeling ( see GSW game 1)...

Porker and Gasol really holding the team down. Both will have great games against the Sixers of the world though.