During that 88 series, Stockton absolutely dominated Magic, despite having tier teammatesthis is nonsense. Big game James is a career 20ppg playoff performer with the lakers. Unlike Byron Scott, James turned it up in the post season. Now you guys want to try and make Stockton seem like he's better than Magic by talking bs about James Worthy having a sub par career? I swear you can't make up some of the I've heard online concerning basketball discussion.
If you can make ing Bobby Hansen and Mark Eaton score more than 10 pt, then you are pretty good
Stockton was vastly better than Nash. As good at least on offense, far far far better defender (I love how people forget this) and more successful in terms of winning and playoffs. Kidd and Thomas should be higher, Paul lower and Biliups not even on the list. Curry is the flavor of the day, probably won't end up that high. You've also no presence of any player before 1980.
Parker's about right though.
absolutely like for every Spurs run including 2014 tbh... Tim was a ing beast tbh even at 38 y/o... how lucky we are, easy all time great top 5
To clarify, I mean sub par by his potential and what he ultimately became. Worthy deferred in the half court offense til about the 88 Finals. That's about the time he finally became a number one option. Nobody said his career was not impressive. I'm saying Stockton would've woke him up sooner. James knew to get out on the break with Magic. Any other time, he was in cruise control.
Isiah finished his career as 3rd all time leader in assists(but has since been passed by a few guys). He retired after only 12 seaons with an achilles tear late in his last season. Being great is not only doing great things with the ball, but knowing a mismatch on your team and allowing your teammates to exploit it(Joe Dumars 89 finals). Jordan wasn't a great 3 point shooter either. I dont know his % but I can guarantee you that it's VERY low. Guys like Isiah and Jordan didn't shoot manny 3's. Isiah came up during a time in which the 3 point shot was still new to the nba. The NBA first got the 3 point line in 1980, Isiah was drafted in 81. Same with Bernard King. These guys simply didn't shoot a lot of 3 pointers so that argument you're making is ridiculous. As for being a turnover machine, I didn't even have to google stats to know that's bull . Have watched both players during their time in the NBA. but I did google stats anyway and guess what I found? hmmm, Thomas only averaged 1.4 more turnovers per game than parker, but 3.4 assists more per game. Add in that Thomas played in an era in which you didn't know if were going to be clotheslined, sabbed, or shot driving into the lane and all of those things were just regular fouls. You were aware that Jordan was a ty 3 point shooter aren't you? Do you know what Jordan's score was during the 1990 3 point shoot out?
U are aware that Cousey and robertson aren't on that list right?Stockton was vastly better than Nash. As good at least on offense, far far far better defender (I love how people forget this) and more successful in terms of winning and playoffs. Kidd and Thomas should be higher, Paul lower and Biliups not even on the list. Curry is the flavor of the day, probably won't end up that high. You've also no presence of any player before 1980.
Parker's about right though.
Wasn't really that hard to dominate Magic. his defense was trash. sorta like another point guard we all know
That was my point about no one before 1980. No list is complete without them
Once again, I provide stats to back up my point; you provide nothing, but I'm the one who's biased? You're an idiot.
tp doesn't even crack the top 5 amongst his own contemporaries.
you take kidd, nash, cp3, westbrook, and curry over him. easily.
You said you would wait until someone could tell you one thing Parker did better than Isaiah. So I gave you like 5 different things to which you started making excuses..."but the 3-point line had just come into the league, but Isaiah only averaged 1.4 more turnovers a game (which is a lot by the way), but Jordan wasn't a good 3-point shooter either" (lol, and..?!?), etc, etc. Then you start saying Isaiah had more assists, I agree. But I'm not the one claiming Parker did everything better than Isaiah like you are but the other way around.Isiah finished his career as 3rd all time leader in assists(but has since been passed by a few guys). He retired after only 12 seaons with an achilles tear late in his last season. Being great is not only doing great things with the ball, but knowing a mismatch on your team and allowing your teammates to exploit it(Joe Dumars 89 finals). Jordan wasn't a great 3 point shooter either. I dont know his % but I can guarantee you that it's VERY low. Guys like Isiah and Jordan didn't shoot manny 3's. Isiah came up during a time in which the 3 point shot was still new to the nba. The NBA first got the 3 point line in 1980, Isiah was drafted in 81. Same with Bernard King. These guys simply didn't shoot a lot of 3 pointers so that argument you're making is ridiculous. As for being a turnover machine, I didn't even have to google stats to know that's bull . Have watched both players during their time in the NBA. but I did google stats anyway and guess what I found? hmmm, Thomas only averaged 1.4 more turnovers per game than parker, but 3.4 assists more per game. Add in that Thomas played in an era in which you didn't know if were going to be clotheslined, sabbed, or shot driving into the lane and all of those things were just regular fouls. You were aware that Jordan was a ty 3 point shooter aren't you? Do you know what Jordan's score was during the 1990 3 point shoot out?
Parker has twice as many rings as your entire list combined...and infinitely more FMVPs.
derek fisher has more rings than parker.
You are clearly biased (username says it all) when you claim that a 38 year old, on a minutes restriction, playing a reduced role was better than an all-star, MVP candidate at his very peak (in 2013).
Parker was a playmaker (7.7 APG), scorer (20.6 PPG) and was defensively solid as well. His game will always look poor (within advanced metrics) since he doesn't average high assists, doesn't shot well/consistently from outside and isn't a great gambler on defense (like Manu).
In '07 Parker was second in PPG (18.6), first in APG (5.5), second in steals (1.1), second in MPG (32.5), made the all-star team and won Finals MVP. He did all that complimenting the best player in franchise history, but was the "third best player" because TD 21 and advanced metrics say so.
Your opinion isn't the end all be all regardless of "metrics." I love Parker, Duncan and Ginobili equally and all three have outperformed one another at different points (be it RS or playoffs) which is great because the won a tremendous amount together.
Last edited by J_Paco; 10-07-2016 at 12:22 AM.
pointing out that a starting point guard averaged 5.5 assists and using it as a compliment
number of assists that season:
1. Steve Nash • PHO 884 2. Deron Williams • UTA 745 3. Jason Kidd • NJN 736 4. Andre Miller • TOT 625 5. T.J. Ford • TOR 595 6. Chris Paul • NOK 569 7. Raymond Felton • CHA 545 8. Baron Davis • GSW 509 9. Chauncey Billups • DET 502 10. Kirk Hinrich • CHI 500 11. Jamaal Tinsley • IND 494 12. LeBron James • CLE 470 13. Allen Iverson* • TOT 468 14. Tracy McGrady • HOU 458 15. Rafer Alston • HOU 444 16. Gilbert Arenas • WAS 443 17. Earl Watson • SEA 437 18. Andre Iguodala • PHI 432 19. Jason Terry • DAL 422 20. Tony Parker • SAS 420
5.5 assists
The offense was never reliant on him creating (at that time) offense for other players, but when given more responsibility and opportunity Parker has proved to be a solid passer.pointing out that a starting point guard averaged 5.5 assists and using it as a compliment
number of assists that season:
1. Steve Nash • PHO 884 2. Deron Williams • UTA 745 3. Jason Kidd • NJN 736 4. Andre Miller • TOT 625 5. T.J. Ford • TOR 595 6. Chris Paul • NOK 569 7. Raymond Felton • CHA 545 8. Baron Davis • GSW 509 9. Chauncey Billups • DET 502 10. Kirk Hinrich • CHI 500 11. Jamaal Tinsley • IND 494 12. LeBron James • CLE 470 13. Allen Iverson* • TOT 468 14. Tracy McGrady • HOU 458 15. Rafer Alston • HOU 444 16. Gilbert Arenas • WAS 443 17. Earl Watson • SEA 437 18. Andre Iguodala • PHI 432 19. Jason Terry • DAL 422 20. Tony Parker • SAS 420
5.5 assists
Also:
Kyrie Irving APG Career: 5.5 '14-'15: 4.7
Anyway, none of this back-and-forth matters since Parker is headed to the HOF and is at the very least the greatest PG in franchise history.
kyrie is trash.
you all of sudden not propping up parker for averaging so little assists
He wasn't asked to create offense, you know since Duncan was still the best player in the NBA, for his teammates, jack ass. Why is that so hard for you to grasp?kyrie is trash.
you all of sudden not propping up parker for averaging so little assists
As he was given more responsibility his APG increased to more "respectable" rates. He was never going to be like a Deron Williams, Jason Kidd or Steve Nash being the only playmaker/facilitator on the floor. He shared that responsibility with the equally adapt Ginobili (3.4) and Duncan (3.5) that season and throughout most of his (prime and) career.
tp averages 5.9 assists for his career.
and tony averages even less in the playoffs! 5.2 apg in the playoffs
In the playoffs, 06-14 (apparently parkers best years)-
Parker 2173 fga.. 531ts
Duncan 1952 fga . 543ts
Manu 1421 fga.. 574ts
Tony fans talking about him leading the team in scoring when he took +10% more shots than the next closest player
As a PG
Tony fans talking up his 3pt % as if it were relevant
Tony is a great player, best spurs PG and somewhere in the top 20-25 at his position for me. It's difficult to rate him there because he was more scorer than point and playing in San Antonio all of the big 3 sacrificed personal stats. By the traditional standard Parker was a mediocre PG, but as a scorer / slasher he is top 5 easy.
Having 25% more rings than another player is one thing. Having 200% more rings than a group of 5 players is another.
Tell Duncan to make his move earlier if you want to see more Parker assists. In the early days he almost always guaranteed an assist forfeit because of how long he held the ball before he went into his move. He was the anti-Malone in that way, but it worked.and tony averages even less in the playoffs! 5.2 apg in the playoffs
He's played 15 years with a high caliber SG (for most of that time) and the greatest PF/C everlr never being asked to be the sole playmaker until 3 or 4 years ago.
It isn't hard to understand unless you're very stupid or dense as .
I'm not propping up his low assists - that was the worse part of his game with outside shooting - just stating that he consistently led the team in that category.
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