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Dude is like ing wide open for "him" too.
Not gonna lie. I'm glad I exposed that mtfkr. Everyone else can see it now too.
everyone can see it but him.
Dude is like ing wide open for "him" too.
Does that one has an answer? bc I think ppl are still split on that TBHDamn this thread already has "Was Aldridge worth it?" potential
But there is more that goes into being open than just release time. There's also launch point and trajectory. The reason why Jimmer was so useless is because the release was slow and incredibly low. Bonner's wasn't slow, but the angle was so stupid that it was easy to run him off. Martin's angle and speed was fine, but his release point being off to the side meant he could only really shoot from one side of the floor.
Anderson certainly has enough time to get his shot off without worrying about it being disrupted, especially considering that his release has improved each year.
Exactly, he'll never, ever succeed at SF (too unathletic/slow) and the sooner Pop understands that the better. I've been saying for the better part of two seasons that he needs to be moved to PF full-time. Yes, he's at a size disadvantage (generously listed at 6'9", 230 lbs.) but his lack of explosiveness/quickness/athleticism would be less of a hindrance. Kyle would also be able to give the team some of things Boris could namely passing.
Last edited by J_Paco; 10-12-2016 at 12:16 AM.
Not sure I understood the point you make
Anderson put the ball on the floor on open 3s not because he is afraid but because he is not comfortable with his feet, with the distance of the defender, he rather has a defender close to him and shoot over him than shooting with no defender in front of him. There is a reason dude is "good" on Iso and shooting over his defender because this is the spacing he likes.
I have relatively speaking the same issue, my brain does not like empty space, I like having a dude close to me it helps me to position myself on the court. As I'm not tall, I am lousy basketball player.
That Anderson can shoot when a defender is close to him because he's taller with a high release point. Spacing is an optimization of many factors, not just two.
Then all he has to do is wait longer before shooting. But anyway, getting over that discomfort is definitely a mental issue. There is definitely something to be "too open", going by some comments during games. But that seems separate from issues with his release time.Anderson put the ball on the floor on open 3s not because he is afraid but because he is not comfortable with his feet, with the distance of the defender, he rather has a defender close to him and shoot over him than shooting with no defender in front of him. There is a reason dude is "good" on Iso and shooting over his defender because this is the spacing he likes.
I have relatively speaking the same issue, my brain does not like empty space, I like having a dude close to me it helps me to position myself on the court. As I'm not tall, I am lousy basketball player.
-pop didn't have to play butler much in the regular season because he knew what he could get out of the vet.
-simmons was an undrafted rookie.
-martin was on the team for what, less than a quarter of season
I disagree but won't convince you otherwise and I tire, same as everyone I guess. the bench can't rely on Manu for everything anymore in terms of creation. I think we even take for granted that he won't fall off this season. Not saying that he will, but he's 39. I wouldn't take him for granted. In the playoffs his usage dipped to 16% as did his efficiency. He was effective shooting the 3 but other things from his game disappeared. It's become hard for him at this point. Patty is a damn good shooter, but like all shooters the jumpshot comes and goes. He can be scorching one series then fall back down to earth the following, or do that in games. I think the bigs situation is just as important or more significant even than Kyle, bc it's hard to get anything going if the bigs are not decent and Dedmon at least hasn't been and him and Lee together is not good for others. In fact Pop kept Dedmon to a min. Bertans I have only seen as a 4 and he hasn't been great outside of a game that he made shots, and he has been very questionable on defense. I actually would like him to get in the rotation, and I am hopeful for him, but no way is he a reason to dump Kyle.
Except this all and good but and I think this is the consensus he will have to play PF and as a PF he won't be always the taller guy.
KA is good. Don't be ridiculous people.
Actually this is an interesting point Brazil!! lol
I will explain shortly, or try to. I will make Manutres head hurt again.
I once read that Dirk was relatively ordinary looking his first season, but he learned to shoot contested shots, and he actually waited for the opponent to guard him bc he could get the sense of where the contest was going to come from or whatever, then go to his moves (and bait opponents into the foul)
Again.... not saying Kyle is Dirk dang it. (I didn't say he was Kawhi either)... but there is something there concerning how comfortable a guy is shooting.
Regardless, as far as I am concerned, I am all for shooting within the offense, screening and all that jazz. Problem is that we didn't see it, and the whole shizz is not on him, I am talking about others screening too.
Watch just the first 20 seconds of this video, the first one is a 3 kyle made off the dribble from a screen by Kirk. Why the heck was he getting stuck in no man land in this game with no one to offer a goddamned screen. That shot he made there is makeable for him any freaking league, but what that shot isn't, is a shot over a hard close out by a 6'10 player.
PPl are this ridiculous, based off a preseason game, even forecasting full careers for guys. lol
maybe we're drawing our conclusions from the fact that:
He'll always be taller than Green, though. So he'll always need less time. Also, PFs would probably be slower at closing out, both because of their physical makeup and because of where they tend to be on the floor. Again, I think spacing is a lot more complicated that folks initially believe.
Last edited by Chinook; 10-11-2016 at 11:45 AM.
I saw an interview with one of the Spurs last week (forget which one) and he was talking about how Chip has been working to get him to lower his release point. The context sounded to me like they are trying to speed up his release by getting him to lower his release point.
I've never heard anyone talk about the mental aspect of spacing the way Brazil did - especially guys' brains not liking open space. But I think it's pretty plausible. Shooters in basketball, like football kickers, golfers (putting), baseball pitchers, are all incredibly influenced by the mental outlook. And it is more than just confidence and visualization, which is why it can be so hard for some guys to overcome. I know the brain's perception of open space is very much a right-brain/left-brain thing. So, yeah, I can believe that Kyle could be less comfortable shooting when he's too wide open.
/sigh I see your point. I acknowledge it, I understand it, I even agreed with it. Pop agreed with it, he said at least one of the spots he saw KA could play was the PF spot, but I am going with what we have.
At this point, I am limiting my own discourse to what I see in games Pop do, bc otherwise there is no end to this as it is. I think 2 things caused him to play as a wing:
1.) the biggest one, and maybe the most important reason and it trumps all others right now: they need him to. Sincerely and frankly. I wanted J.Simms to pan out, I really did. I thought if he did pan out it would allow KA to gravitate toward other spots that could be better for him like the 4 spot, but this is the situation:
For a stretch 4, strict stretch 4, they have a legit and good prospect in Bertans, who is as pure of a sniper as you can find.
For the wing players they have: crickets.... J.Simms ehhh I will leave that one for others to argue, but JSimms is not better than slowmo. Just is not and maybe that is where it ends for Pop. They need KA to play wing minutes. Really none of this would be a big problem if he was more willing with his freaking 3, although he's a versatile player who can do more than that, but passing up shots that are good for him has to stop. Now a shot over a hard close out I don't call a good shot, but just call a screen dude, then go to your shot and have more of a shooter mentality. Not everything was a hard close out (not everything was wide open either).
2.) it's such a small consideration in comparison to the first point that this one is silly. He may encounter strong and difficult matches at the PF spot that make it situational defensively for him at this point in his career and you can't have him in situational roles exclusively if you are the coach and want to make him a part of a permanent rotation.
the excuses being made for anderson...
He can easily play SF.
"Too wide open" A bad thing.
WTF?
That just means he sucks to me.
lol, he has no problem at getting clean shots, his stroke is good and he has little problem on D. This is as good of a prospect for a position as you can ask for. The rest is up to the system, experience and just having balls. If he can't make an open shot despite having the stroke to do it, then it doesn't matter what his position is.
I've heard announcers posit that someone could be too wide open on misses, though they might've just been joking. I think it has to do with timing as well. Players often to just practice shooting, but they also practice situational shooting, like getting shots off the catch from a PnR kick-out. Those plays have a certain rhythm, including the close-out. So when you don't have anyone running out on your, the timing is off. Thinking happens rather than just reacting.
That is a similar thing to what I wondered happened to Green last year. He went from getting passes for shots with certain timing to getting the less predictable timing of post kick-outs.
Diaw's ball-handling and passing skills were/are a huge asset for him, even playing as a big. But to be able to play big, he had to bulk up - a lot. I think Kyle, and the Spurs, could be a lot better off if they just lock in on making him a versatile 4 and not keep experimenting. He's got good length, and he's shown a knack (and a willingness) for rebounding. And I'm pretty sold on him being able to sneak out and knock down 3's at a respectable clip. I'm not joking when I say that he should go see whoever helped Draymond bulk up a few seasons ago. I know that not respectable Spurs fan would condone such a thing, but that's the state of the industry.
Kyle's not a point, nor a point-forward. And he just isn't quick enough to slash like a small forward.
I'm holding SAGirl personally accountable for this
Yes I like your comparaison with Dirk... Dirk is great Iso player, he obviously loves using his height to shoot over his defender, he does not have the quickest release ever and obviously don't mind having a guy close to him to work his step back or in post up situation. And you also right he actually "waited" his opponent a lot back in the days and still do it.Actually this is an interesting point Brazil!! lol
I will explain shortly, or try to. I will make Manutres head hurt again.
I once read that Dirk was relatively ordinary looking his first season, but he learned to shoot contested shots, and he actually waited for the opponent to guard him bc he could get the sense of where the contest was going to come from or whatever, then go to his moves (and bait opponents into the foul)
Again.... not saying Kyle is Dirk dang it. (I didn't say he was Kawhi either)... but there is something there concerning how comfortable a guy is shooting.
Regardless, as far as I am concerned, I am all for shooting within the offense, screening and all that jazz. Problem is that we didn't see it, and the whole shizz is not on him, I am talking about others screening too.
Watch just the first 20 seconds of this video, the first one is a 3 kyle made off the dribble from a screen by Kirk. Why the heck was he getting stuck in no man land in this game with no one to offer a goddamned screen. That shot he made there is makeable for him any freaking league, but what that shot isn't, is a shot over a hard close out by a 6'10 player.
Nevertheless Dirk is 7' PF shooting 3s like others shoot lay ups, he does not need the ball in his hands all the time to be efficient, can play off the ball too and is a HOFer so what Dirk did to exploit his unique skillset is not even indicative of how Kyle could evolve tbh.
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