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  1. #76
    foaming at the nostrils raybies's Avatar
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    Nah. Marks will right the ship by then. This is the year they do a Lopez trade and really tank. Next summer, it's all free agents.
    Brooks should be cheap right? I wonder who'd want him. Saw the rumor a lil while ago.

  2. #77
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    1. They wouldn't be punting anything. They'd still be very compe ive, a top 4 seed in the East.
    That's punting as much as the Spurs trading LMA would be punting. You don't pass up the chance to become a contender just because you can be a non-contender without spending value.

    2. By waiting 3-7 months, they wouldn't be "punting years away". They'd just be waiting half a year.
    They'd be waiting that full season. The only thing that counts is whether you have him for the playoffs. And yes, they are punting years in the sense that they are punting years of prime play for Horford and LMA and years of being on cheap deals for LMA and Thomas. Or you can call it years in that they'll have to let more people go in order to be able to afford to sign LMA outright than they would if they traded for him. Right now, the Brooklyn pick may cost them more than $10 Million in cap space. There aren't a ton of scenarios where Boston doesn't have to pay for LMA one way or the other.

  3. #78
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    Definitely agree about KL he's or only selling piece. You hope Murray can be the next Leonard and I say that in the aspect that he develops well or even a CoJo. RC said he wanted him to be the next Kawhi and I think he meant developed into a star. But your right two years is a long way. By that time Murray could be a starter with a promising future and then you just need a two way big and that is preferably. Who knows, maybe Simmons somehow becomes an elite player and I think that means elite roleplayer. I guess you really don't have to trade him now and hope you will one to keep the gipper. Very Spursy to slow play this out at least pro long the image long enough to where you can begin to see with more clarity.
    People who have delusions of grandeur and think 99% of the league sucks, would scoff at a Knight, Len and Bender or Chriss package. But they're not interested in a total re-build and shouldn't be, with an elite player entering his prime, who'd inevitably want out sooner or later. The first 2 are 2 potential top 6 six rotation players, that are further along and likely better than what they'd probably get picking somewhere in the middle of the 1st round. They also both flashed potential to be better than they are 2 years ago before being put into awkward situations. The last 2 are obviously unknowns and they'd probably have to believe they have star potential or close to make this move.

    Get Knight and Len back on track, hope whichever of Bender or Chriss emerges as at least something close to a star and that most of Murray, Anderson, Bertans, Milutinov and the '17 1st, turn into legit rotation players and then they'd have something to sell to the next star free agent.

  4. #79
    Shhhh... I'll be gentle. TheDoctor's Avatar
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  5. #80
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    That's punting as much as the Spurs trading LMA would be punting.
    '

    That couldn't be more subjective. You're stretching things as you usually do and making it out to be a fact because it's your opinion. Celtics currently are a top 3 team in the East. That won't change next year w/out Aldridge if they decide to wait it out. And adding Aldridge isn't a slam dunk making them a for sure favorite over Cleveland either. It depends what they part with and we usually never find out the true potential until the season is over with. We can speculate on how much it will improve them after the deal, but we don't know the variables that the Celtics would lose.

    Just like trading LA this year isn't necessarily punting. It depends what the Spurs can bring in for him and what skill sets are added and how valuable those skillsets are around the rest of the team. There's more to the equation than sheer " well Spurs lose an All-Star and don't gain an All-Star so its a net loss and Spurs are punting."

  6. #81
    foaming at the nostrils raybies's Avatar
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    People who have delusions of grandeur and think 99% of the league sucks, would scoff at a Knight, Len and Bender or Chriss package. But they're not interested in a total re-build and shouldn't be, with an elite player entering his prime, who'd inevitably want out sooner or later. The first 2 are 2 potential top 6 six rotation players, that are further along and likely better than what they'd probably get picking somewhere in the middle of the 1st round. They also both flashed potential to be better than they are 2 years ago before being put into awkward situations. The last 2 are obviously unknowns and they'd probably have to believe they have star potential or close to make this move.

    Get Knight and Len back on track, hope whichever of Bender or Chriss emerges as at least something close to a star and that most of Murray, Anderson, Bertans, Milutinov and the '17 1st, turn into legit rotation players and then they'd have something to sell to the next star free agent.
    Just don't like Knight's contact. I guess it can be considered a good deal, but it's a four year deal. Ties up some money for some time, but I do like Len. He has steadily improved every year and should be starting.i think I'd go with Bender but Chriss has an Amare like game to him and he played with Murray. As if Murray being here had any draw to who we get but chemistry might be an added bonus.

  7. #82
    Veteran james evans's Avatar
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    If there is Spurs trade talk and Parker isn't involved, I'm not trying to hear it

  8. #83
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    Just don't like Knight's contact. I guess it can be considered a good deal, but it's a four year deal. Ties up some money for some time, but I do like Len. He has steadily improved every year and should be starting.i think I'd go with Bender but Chriss has an Amare like game to him and he played with Murray. As if Murray being here had any draw to who we get but chemistry might be an added bonus.
    Knight is easily movable and they'll only need significant cap space if/when a star wants to sign. Until then, it's about trying to fast track a team to get to that point.

    He's ideally a 3rd guard in a 3 guard rotation, but he's good enough to start and close close games and would fill an immediate need, particularly if Leonard is going to be the lead ball handler anyway.

    Len hasn't steadily improved, but still has starting potential.

    I don't know who I'd prefer between Bender and Chriss yet, but the latter seems farther along and has the makings of an ideal power forward in today's game and compliment to Len.

  9. #84
    Marcus Eliot Williams Austin_Toros's Avatar
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    MaNu4Tres - can you provide any insight into your thoughts why LMA might be traded? I'm not asking you to reveal your source, just curious for some more information.

  10. #85
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    That couldn't be more subjective. You're stretching things as you usually do and making it out to be a fact because it's your opinion.
    We can't all have cryptic sources giving us the 4-1-1 man.

    Celtics currently are a top 3 team in the East. That won't change next year w/out Aldridge if they decide to wait it out.
    But that doesn't may them a contender at all. They haven't made it out of the first round in years. They don't have a top-10 player on their roster. This is like where the Spurs can beat GS even though they aren't favorites. The Cavs have three players better than anyone the Celtics have, and even the Raptors are clearly better. Boston need top-end talent; the Spurs have top-end talent. They couldn't be any more night-and-day when it comes to where they are. So for them, closing the talent gap and becoming the clear second-best team with the ability to match up with GS and overtake Cleveland is huge, and doing that a year early is even bigger.

    Just like trading LA this year isn't necessarily punting. It depends what the Spurs can bring in for him and what skill sets are added and how valuable those skillsets are around the rest of the team. There's more to the equation than sheer " well Spurs lose an All-Star and don't gain an All-Star so its a net loss and Spurs are punting."
    Then toss out some deals for LMA and justify why they aren't steps back. It's not easy. TD21 is doing the best out of people here, and I imagine even he knows that it's at best a move with almost no margin of error. It's because as I said and you're getting around to saying; teams don't want to give up their core pieces in win-now trades, even if they aren't acquiring expiring players. They want to use rebuilding assets to add to their win-now core. If someone is a super efficient role-player who can get more production than LMA now, they likely are not on the market. And if they are, they are at best mid-tier options that aren't adding enough present value to warrant giving up future value.

  11. #86
    Veteran Spursfanfromafar's Avatar
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    Pointless blather. LMA is doing a good job as a secondary scorer and a frontcourt main option. He is not Duncan and no one is. There is no better pure PF than him as of now either on the league. The Spurs Achilles heel is the aged Tony Parker whose defense is pathetic and who should be a reserve now. If at all the Spurs make any changes they will do it after this season and I suspect they will move Parker for a younger replacement and will keep contending with the rest of the core.

  12. #87
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    Pointless blather. LMA is doing a good job as a secondary scorer and a frontcourt main option. He is not Duncan and no one is. There is no better pure PF than him as of now either on the league. The Spurs Achilles heel is the aged Tony Parker whose defense is pathetic and who should be a reserve now. If at all the Spurs make any changes they will do it after this season and I suspect they will move Parker for a younger replacement and will keep contending with the rest of the core.
    How about rebounds? no LMA is no Duncan, thats absolutely laughable because LMA isnt even a top 50 defensive rebounder and the Spurs are mediocre in that department. Trading him is out of the question but we sink or swim with him thats a fact.

  13. #88
    Veteran Mnky's Avatar
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    You're making Aldridge sound like he's a LeBron or a top tier star. On the court value isn't all the same for star players. Sure he has value, never questioned that, but scoring the way he scores (in selfish ways), doesn't command double teams. He also doesn't apply pressure at the rim -- which isn't beneficial to the players around him. He doesn't make his teammates better like other star players can. And on defense and in other faucets of the game he's about average. We just have a difference of opinion on how great he truly is. He's a great elite shooter from mid-range but he doesn't make his teammates better around him and isn't the force he should be in other faucets of the game. He's the Melo of power forwards except Melo is a more versatile scorer.
    Im not sure what you believe is a non selfish scorer. Someone who lets his teammate hold half the ball? LMA is an elite offensive weapon when he wants to be, and there are not many who can score like him. He makes his teammates better, and is one of the better passing bigs in the game. He DOES in factcause teams to double, and apply help defense. He's one of the best rebound forwards in the game, especially on the offensive side which I would put only Thompson ahead of in that regard. He plays above average defense and in most cases than not, cancels his player out or beats him. I'm not sure what more you would want from a star player tbh. He can't be a top 5 player. Luckyily enough, We do have one of those, but that's not the case for the majority of the nba seeing how there are only 5 of them. There is only one team in the nba with two top 5 players, and theyre the favorites to win it all. He's not a melo type of player. Not even close. He has never been on a team that wasn't winning, and carried the Blazers for many years, and carried the spurs against the Thunder. If anyone else had shown up in that series, the Spurs win.

    Outside of a top 10 player, who would you bring in that would be more beneficial to the spurs?

  14. #89
    VanillaPlayerFan BD24's Avatar
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    Ok, First off I'd like to apologize for another LMA trade thread, but I just had to get my thoughts out. I typically only write about things that sincerely interest me. So here is my science fiction like post about LMA and some thoughts and trade options.

    Thoughts:
    First off, watching Durant walk away for nothing should be a lesson to all decision makers. Sure on one hand you can keep it together for one last run and hope for the best, but if you fail, you risk losing a major piece for nothing. The effects of which can bring you down from a contender to a fringe playoff team like I believe OKC will ultimately become. This brings me to my first point. When you have a player that is homegrown and has those ties you can rest more peacefully at night because that's all they have known and you have a head start with relationships and favorable emotions. When we had Tim Duncan, we risked it all and banked on those relationships. And plus a guy like Duncan, you pretty much be crazy to trade. In our case, Duncan stayed and the rest was history. But Aldridge is different, he has no ties here. He signed as a free agent. He was not drafted by us. He has no fond memories of the past to fall back on when it hits the fan. Sure he talks up the organization but does it come off as insincere to anyone else but me around here. Does he really want to be here or is he here because nothing better was available. It's like being in a relationship because no-one better has arrived. You're not in love. In the end you either leave that person when you find someone else you love or you learn to love. I think the only way the latter happens is if we win the ship this year. But here's the problem. LMA's value is at it's highest right now because he has years on his deal and considering the current cap it's a bargain. So we risk a greater return for the lure of winning his affection. If we don't win, next year we'll have given teams with honest interest with assets the leverage needed to make a lesser bargain. You'd hope that a bidding war starts but then you have to take into account user preference. Where does LMA want to go. A class organization like the Spurs, can only salvage their image by appeasing his requests of location cause he's the one that has to resign. And I say salvage cause, how can a family org, that does things the right way, can't keep an FA, and that FA being the most important acquisition off the market in franchise history.

    So you have to think from PATFO's perspective, is the juice worth the squeeze. Is he a player you want to risk possibly years of rebuilding for. Do you want to pay for his next max contract when it could exceed 30 mil(?Cap #s please). Is he the character that you want in the locker room or did you sign him for the same reason he signed with you. Are LMA and PATFO cuddle buddies, just not wanting to be alone and feel like someone is there. Did we sign him to remain relevant and extend the contender window or did you sign him because you believed he modeled your culture. Most know we sacrificed a lot for LMA. The built not bought moniker died. The beautiful game died. Wasn't that what are signature was?

    You got to think about the future now. Right now San Antonio is a hot destination because of reputation. We are basically a living legend. The respect will never be higher imo. Pop is known as best coach in the game. The front office is seen with great regard to build contenders and a safe bet to succeed. And the organization is first class. Some believe that losing LMA would hurt our ability to sign FA's in the future but I disagree. Pop has at least four more years before he retires. He's coaching the next Olympic team for team USA. You have Kawhi as a centerpiece which is a legitimate MVP DPOY candidate but after that you have questions. Who will be the next Tony, Manu, Hill, or Kawhi. Is it Murray or Bertans? The time to build is now, because once Pop retires all bets are off. Then you hope we can hire the right minds. Will the same trust be there that is now when say an Ettore Messina is head coach and no experience is there. Is he the next Blatt. Man I hope we get Coach Bud back but I'm not gonna go on a tangent here. I'm sure we can get those C list players that can be B list players like say a Paul Millsap type. And we could probably unearth another Danny Green or Gary Neal, or maybe Jon Simmons. But we can safely assume we have a 3-4 year window before Pop is gone and how do you want to leave the franchise. Do you want to leave the franchise in rebuilding mode after a plan that was more short term than long term or do you want to already be on the rise with say a few pieces that are primed to enter their best stages of their career. Think about this cause this is what it is basically.

    Some mention the Spurs conservative ways as keeping LMA but I'm here to say maybe it's more conservative to sell high and not risk losing him for nothing. IMO it's safer to start now long term wise. But could we remain compe ive now. Imo we can. I actually think Pau is a better offensive player than LMA even at his age. He can post and he can pass. LMA skill set killed the beautiful game, but maybe with the right pieces you could see it come back. Maybe I need to let it go. I think if you get a big back and a young prospect and a first you do it. So now that brings me to some trade scenarios.


    In my mind there's only two places and that's Boston and Phoenix.

    Phoenix is the obvious one because that's what our comp was during our courtship. Maybe he really wanted to go there but he played it safe. In Phoenix or Boston he would be the first option. Maybe that's what he wants.

    In Phoenix the trade scenarios would center around

    Brandon Knight/ Tyson Chandler with a Middle filler like Pj Tucker a young big like Chriss or Bender and a first for LMA and pieces like Forbes and/or Anderson

    I do not like this deal at all because Tyson is on decline and both lock up money for a few years. Knight is not the playmaker you want out of a point guard. He's more a shooting guard.

    So this brings us to where all the rumors began and that's in Boston.

    In Boston a scenario might look like this

    Amir Johnson with a couple young players with upside for LMA and Anderson.

    Now Danny Ainge is one of the best at extracting players on good deals. He's not going to let us do him like we did Larry Legend. So with that being said, he's not going to want to part with that first round pick if we choose a certain player.

    Alex Kennedy AlexKennedyNBA
    Yesterday, Jaylen Brown said that he met with the Celtics, Bulls, Hawks, Timberwolves, Kings, Spurs and Rockets while at the NBA Combine.


    For some reason, we managed to meet with Jaylen Brown at the combine, but why? Every mock had him in the lottery so why did we meet him. What made us think we could acquire him. Perhaps this LMA story is farther along in the organization then we know. This would explain the leak from Boston's side to weaken the trade value so that way they wouldn't have to give the first and Brown. Well that's one theory imo. I'm having fun.

    Also with Amir on a one year deal you retain flexibility while acquiring a solid starter that would fit with your SL. With his salary off the books you could feasibly have some room to either resign your free agents or go after someone like a Serge Ibaka. And this kid Brown is very intellectual and can ball. He has potential to be a two way player. Pair that with Kawhi and you could have the best wing play in years to come.

    Edit: So would you take Amir Johnson, Jaylen Brown, and Jerebko with Brooklyn's first for LMA and Anderson for example?
    Jerebko is on a one year 5 million deal. More flexibility. Jackson wouldn't work.
    I would.
    SAgirl, is that you?

  15. #90
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    SAgirl, is that you?
    lol nooooooo... Trade ideas aren't my thing TBH... I am very bad with that.

    Props to raybies though.

  16. #91
    foaming at the nostrils raybies's Avatar
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    lol nooooooo... Trade ideas aren't my thing TBH... I am very bad with that.

    Props to raybies though.
    So at least two people think I'm your alternate. guess we have a similar style

  17. #92
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    So at least two people think I'm your alternate. guess we have a similar style


    I am like ElNono in that I already have too many post counts to my name (in my case for my barely over a year stay in the forum) to be able to shimmy alternates... I don't troll so I don't need them... If my takes bomb, they bomb lol I will bear it and survive.

  18. #93
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    It's time to make a move for Anthony Davis. Everyone but Kawhi is available.

  19. #94
    Veteran BG_Spurs_Fan's Avatar
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    I understand people going with the don't lose him for nothing talk, but even if he walks out in 2 years for nothing the team would have had 2 seasons worth of an all-star big. This IS value. You don't need to turn every player into picks and assets unless you're Morey or Hinkie.

    By the same logic the Spurs should have traded Duncan around 2009 when he was on the back end of his prime before he became a tosb just to get some value. Using the player in actual games is value too and in most cases it's better value than whatever assets you could squeeze.

  20. #95
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    I understand people going with the don't lose him for nothing talk, but even if he walks out in 2 years for nothing the team would have had 2 seasons worth of an all-star big. This IS value. You don't need to turn every player into picks and assets unless you're Morey or Hinkie.

    By the same logic the Spurs should have traded Duncan around 2009 when he was on the back end of his prime before he became a tosb just to get some value. Using the player in actual games is value too and in most cases it's better value than whatever assets you could squeeze.
    That was pretty much my point. The only value trades assets have is that they are supposed to turn into players who can get you wins. When you already have such a player, and you're in position where you can compete for a le, you have to discount any future return heavily. It's not likely that any one the Spurs trade for will be in LMA's league ever, but even if they are, it could take them so long to get there that it wasted the rest of the middle-aged roster's time.

  21. #96
    Veteran mo7888's Avatar
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    Any LMA trade with the teams being thrown around here (Suns Celts) is a step back and a punt on the season....there's no other logical way to look at it for this season. The only way they could trade him for someone and not step back would be if New Orleans decided to move AD because he makes a trade demand or something else like that involving a major talent near their prime.

  22. #97
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    Any LMA trade with the teams being thrown around here (Suns Celts) is a step back and a punt on the season....there's no other logical way to look at it for this season. The only way they could trade him for someone and not step back would be if New Orleans decided to move AD because he makes a trade demand or something else like that involving a major talent near their prime.
    marcus smart + Amir johnson + BKN 2017 pick = Better defenders for Warriors + stop gap at PF in Amir + home run swing in draft with BKN pick.

  23. #98
    Veteran mo7888's Avatar
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    That's an argument for making us better long term. It is a definite step back for this season. It's basically saying we are punting on this season in favor of a longer term approach.

  24. #99
    Veteran Spurs9's Avatar
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    Trade him for Melo

  25. #100
    Veteran dbreiden83080's Avatar
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    If you trade him you are giving up on the season. Spurs made win now moves by signing guys like Gasol. This would be 3 steps back..

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