LVSL Game 2: SA v PHI

[MaNu4Tres]

Thanks for the update guys.

Not sure what's up with Murray. Didn't he train with Kawhi in the offseason? Disappointing.

He's been disappointing, but its been only been 4 games and 6 weeks since the season ended. He has 3 months to train after this SL is over with. Then is when he'll be traveling to San Diego to train with Kawhi.

If he's not ready by October, Forbes will be ready it seems. Spurs will be fine, either way.

[ceperez]

Murray is Working on His passing game, he didn't play naturally so it's not that a dissappointement. He ´ll be Better du ring the season.

Hmmmm... if he wants to become Parker 2.0 (a guard who makes his living in the paint) then he needs to do something about that high dribble.

[duncan2k5]

The coaches didn't mistreat him. Murray put undue pressure upon himself by saying stuff like the following:

“I’m a born leader,” he said. “It’s not like it’s something new to me. Of course it’s new to me to lead guys at the professional level. But I feel like I’m a great leader, being vocal on both ends and making sure everybody is on the same page.”

Maybe he should take things easy by getting his game in order first before claiming a leadership role.

Last year regardless of play, he never knew if he was even gonna play the next game... Now he can barely get minutes to play through mistakes in summer league, while others get to...I'd say thats not good treatment

[duncan2k5]

It is crazy... Spurs marketing department are hyping up Murray. Murray is even the 'team captain' (he's the player who is selected to talk to the refs at the beginning of the game). He also plays the point running the offense.

Yet, he's stinking up the joint. Forbes and Bertans are both older than Murray and are deferring to this loser. The gig is up. The only reason Murray played well against some NBA teams was that the opposing team wasn't familiar with his play. One you figure it out, like many SL teams have, then he's practically worthless on the court other than being able to rebound the ball.

Figuring stuff out goes both ways...he plays more, he learns then too...pat Beverly stripped him numerous times one half, never did it again the rest of the series....give players the chance to learn their opponents

[SAGirl]

I've been completely busy during SL (both tournaments):

It sounds like from the postings here:

1) White has played well.
2) Forbes has played well.
3) Bertans has been up and down.
4) Murray has been a massive disappointment.
5) No one else has emerged as a surprise.

Is this basically right? Thanks

1. White has played well considering he's a rookie. He has a good feel for the game, good playmaker and unselfish. Has good court vision. He's been off shooting at times, streaky, but he finds other ways to score cutting etc. Bc he's a rookie my standard is lower. I think he'll be alright after a period of adjustment but he probably will need to shoot well.

2. Forbes has been aggressive and scoring in a variety of ways. He could always shoot but has done more ballhandling and scoring off the dribble. He struggled against the size and sheer athleticism of the Utah guards: Exum and Mitc so keep things in perspective. Like Mills IMO he will struggle in those situations when guarded by tall/athletic guards and there isn't much he can do to stop them defensively. He's been the most consistent Spur though and has carried them offensively. He's eating up average guards.

3. Davis has been streaky with his shooting. He's had to find ways to impact the game when he's not open from 3 and his game is really off the ball ideally. He had one Utah game of straight up chucking every time he was passed to, but now he's putting the ball on the floor more if he's not open and trying to make plays. He has played about half the time as a 3 with average results. He can make good passes at times but will also attempt risky, low rewards bounce passes which has made him TO prone. His ballhandling is good for a big but for a wing it is limited to straight line driving. If he's guarded by wings he's having a tougher time. Defensively he's had issues. He's been a good team defender but individually gets burned. His rebounding is subpar for a forward and he looks easily bounced around in the paint with bigs getting offensive boards with him around. However when he's hitting his shots it makes everyone's life easier and you forget the other things. I didn't think he was getting involved offensively enough but off the ball players depend on others a lot. Hardy doesn't necessarily call plays for him either. I believe the focus is on the guards.

4. Murray can't shoot and has not shown any progress offensively. He's been ghastly inefficient even when he's getting into the paint. He's not attempting jumpshots. He can get past his guy and find the open teammate but he has a lot to work on for himself. He should avoid the heroballing for now bc he's not good enough to be forcing shots. He hasn't played off the ball much which emphasises his limited skill set and he's been on minutes restrictions. Unnecessarily fancy dribbling or carelessness leads to him getting stripped.

5. No one else stands out. Cory Jefferson could be a training camp invite, he can grab rebounds but is selfish and nothing special. Blossomgame has been average. He's made his open 3s and some plays off the dribble but doesn't have a good touch in the paint. Nothing great or too much as to be impressive or stand out. Cady and LJC look basically the same as they have been.

[sasaint]

1. White has played well considering he's a rookie. He has a good feel for the game, good playmaker and unselfish. Has good court vision. He's been off shooting at times, streaky, but he finds other ways to score cutting etc. Bc he's a rookie my standard is lower. I think he'll be alright after a period of adjustment but he probably will need to shoot well.

2. Forbes has been aggressive and scoring in a variety of ways. He could always shoot but has done more ballhandling and scoring off the dribble. He struggled against the size and sheer athleticism of the Utah guards: Exum and Mitc so keep things in perspective. Like Mills IMO he will struggle in those situations when guarded by tall/athletic guards and there isn't much he can do to stop them defensively. He's been the most consistent Spur though and has carried them offensively. He's eating up average guards.

3. Davis has been streaky with his shooting. He's had to find ways to impact the game when he's not open from 3 and his game is really off the ball ideally. He had one Utah game of straight up chucking every time he was passed to, but now he's putting the ball on the floor more if he's not open and trying to make plays. He has played about half the time as a 3 with average results. He can make good passes at times but will also attempt risky, low rewards bounce passes which has made him TO prone. His ballhandling is good for a big but for a wing it is limited to straight line driving. If he's guarded by wings he's having a tougher time. Defensively he's had issues. He's been a good team defender but individually gets burned. His rebounding is subpar for a forward and he looks easily bounced around in the paint with bigs getting offensive boards with him around. However when he's hitting his shots it makes everyone's life easier and you forget the other things. I didn't think he was getting involved offensively enough but off the ball players depend on others a lot. Hardy doesn't necessarily call plays for him either. I believe the focus is on the guards.

4. Murray can't shoot and has not shown any progress offensively. He's been ghastly inefficient even when he's getting into the paint. He's not attempting jumpshots. He can get past his guy and find the open teammate but he has a lot to work on for himself. He should avoid the heroballing for now bc he's not good enough to be forcing shots. He hasn't played off the ball much which emphasises his limited skill set and he's been on minutes restrictions. Unnecessarily fancy dribbling or carelessness leads to him getting stripped.

5. No one else stands out. Cory Jefferson could be a training camp invite, he can grab rebounds but is selfish and nothing special. Blossomgame has been average. He's made his open 3s and some plays off the dribble but doesn't have a good touch in the paint. Nothing great or too much as to be impressive or stand out. Cady and LJC look basically the same as they have been.

I really appreciate your taking the time to share your analysis. Great job. Only thing I would like to add is that off the dribble White has gotten himself in trouble a few times because he lacks the quickness to take some defenders one-on-one. But once in trouble, he has also shown the ability to hit some very tough shots. For a rookie playing SL he has shown nice flashes but I am not convinced he can do the same things in the big-time.

[SAGirl]

I really appreciate your taking the time to share your analysis. Great job. Only thing I would like to add is that off the dribble White has gotten himself in trouble a few times because he lacks the quickness to take some defenders one-on-one. But once in trouble, he has also shown the ability to hit some very tough shots. For a rookie playing SL he has shown nice flashes but I am not convinced he can do the same things in the big-time.

Would agree with that assessment on White.

[BillMc]

1. White has played well considering he's a rookie. He has a good feel for the game, good playmaker and unselfish. Has good court vision. He's been off shooting at times, streaky, but he finds other ways to score cutting etc. Bc he's a rookie my standard is lower. I think he'll be alright after a period of adjustment but he probably will need to shoot well.

2. Forbes has been aggressive and scoring in a variety of ways. He could always shoot but has done more ballhandling and scoring off the dribble. He struggled against the size and sheer athleticism of the Utah guards: Exum and Mitc so keep things in perspective. Like Mills IMO he will struggle in those situations when guarded by tall/athletic guards and there isn't much he can do to stop them defensively. He's been the most consistent Spur though and has carried them offensively. He's eating up average guards.

3. Davis has been streaky with his shooting. He's had to find ways to impact the game when he's not open from 3 and his game is really off the ball ideally. He had one Utah game of straight up chucking every time he was passed to, but now he's putting the ball on the floor more if he's not open and trying to make plays. He has played about half the time as a 3 with average results. He can make good passes at times but will also attempt risky, low rewards bounce passes which has made him TO prone. His ballhandling is good for a big but for a wing it is limited to straight line driving. If he's guarded by wings he's having a tougher time. Defensively he's had issues. He's been a good team defender but individually gets burned. His rebounding is subpar for a forward and he looks easily bounced around in the paint with bigs getting offensive boards with him around. However when he's hitting his shots it makes everyone's life easier and you forget the other things. I didn't think he was getting involved offensively enough but off the ball players depend on others a lot. Hardy doesn't necessarily call plays for him either. I believe the focus is on the guards.

4. Murray can't shoot and has not shown any progress offensively. He's been ghastly inefficient even when he's getting into the paint. He's not attempting jumpshots. He can get past his guy and find the open teammate but he has a lot to work on for himself. He should avoid the heroballing for now bc he's not good enough to be forcing shots. He hasn't played off the ball much which emphasises his limited skill set and he's been on minutes restrictions. Unnecessarily fancy dribbling or carelessness leads to him getting stripped.

5. No one else stands out. Cory Jefferson could be a training camp invite, he can grab rebounds but is selfish and nothing special. Blossomgame has been average. He's made his open 3s and some plays off the dribble but doesn't have a good touch in the paint. Nothing great or too much as to be impressive or stand out. Cady and LJC look basically the same as they have been.

Many thanks for the detailed and well thought-out analysis!!

The fact that Murray, Bertans, Cady and LJC don't show much improvement is cause for alarm. Spurs only real hope is improvement from within from their young guys.

[SAGirl]

Many thanks for the detailed and well thought-out analysis!!

The fact that Murray, Bertans, Cady and LJC don't show much improvement is cause for alarm. Spurs only real hope is improvement from within from their young guys.

No problem. Don't be discouraged by Davis evaluation. We already know he can play in the NBA. Here he's been placed in different situations and asked to do more off the dribble as a 3 which is unusual and he has been ok, not great. It doesn't mean he will be asked to play differently in the NBA IMO, more just him working on weaknesses.