Mountaintop Monastery of Dejounte Murray

[MaNu4Tres]

When Green and Gay are in the rotation, there's not enough room for Mills and Murray. Spurs shouldn't play Manu at SF, Murray at SG to give Mills time over Gay or Bertans.

Give me Bertans shooting and versatile defense over Mills shooting and scarecrow defense.

Pau, Bertans, Gay, Manu, Murray >>

Pau, Gay, Manu, Murray, Mills.

[dabom]

Murray isn't better than Mills at this moment. Or this year. So stop thinking these lineups are any better with Murray instead of Mills, got.

[Seventyniner]

I'm not proposing or saying he should start yet ( I think that's coming eventually depending how much more he progresses). What I'm implying or saying is that he should be playing over Patty with the 2nd unit and having stints with LA/Kawhi lineups. On both sides of the court overall, he's more impactful than any point guard on the roster.

The only way the Spurs have a chance to reach a higher ceiling than years past is to throw Murray in the fire and give him a permanent role with hopes he keeps progressing by May and June. That's the only way Spurs have a chance to win. If Spurs continue to roll out TP and Patty as the main fixtures at the PG spot, it will be another predictable 2nd round exit. And some fans are fine with that because Tony and Patty give the Spurs a floor that gives the Spurs a 1st round win (yay).

Just like last year?

[dabom]

Just like last year?

[duncan2k5]

Im quite aware its not 1 on 1. Ive only been watching the game for 26 years. Murray is not a net negstive.

Some more Murray stats.

On the floor in 675 mins: Spurs are a +9.5 PP/100.

Off the floor in 1149 mins: Spurs are a +0.2 PP/100. https://t.co/qxJjfFXLTC

And no he doesnt effect spacing depending where he is in the action on offense. For example, when Murray is the post entry passer on thr strong side of the floor, Murray usually cuts baseline strongside and rubs off LA or Kawhi in the post ..if the defender doesnt follow him all the way through, its usually a lay up for DeJounte..unless the defender follows him all the way to weakside corner 3 area. If the defender half asses or turns attention to strongside at anytime, Dejounte is pretty great at cutting to the basket.. Murray is also really effective responding to recovering defenses from the triple threat position off the catch and getting to the line. Mills is pretty easy to defend when he puts the ball on the floor in any cir stance responding to recovering defenses.

Sure, Mills in a vacuum provides good spacing, but most of the time with 2nd unit he's handling the ball in PnRs ( leads the team in PnR ball handling possessions). So he's not providing any spacing in this dynamic. Also, there's other ways Murray remains highly effective on offense where he creates gravity for the Spurs offensive arsenal ( elite offensive rebounding/crashing glass from weakside/ creating more possessions, getting out in transition and putting pressure on the defense sucking them into the paint in transition as he finds open 3 point shooters -- something he's becoming great at, great at cutting off ball when his defender isn't respecting him, great at getting to the line -- 5x better than Patty in this cir stance).

Start looking deeper into the game, and you can see why he's been the most impactful player the Spurs have right now at the PG position ( not saying much because the PG position has been thr biggest weakness on the team in years -- Mills & TP have been net negatives for years now ).

These idiots seem to think anyone who can't shoot isn't a good NBA player... If the Greek Freak was on the Spurs, they would have wanted him benched

[Maddog]

According to nba.com, Dejounte Murray is the leader in defensive rating of the entire NBA at 94.3:

http://stats.nba.com/players/advanced/?sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&CF=MIN*GE*15:GP*GE*5&Season=2017-18&SeasonType=Regular%20Season

He is also the leader in net rating of the Spurs at +9.5:

http://stats.nba.com/players/advance...mID=1610612759

Some of that is probably due to him playing a lot against 2nd and 3rd string quality players. But it's still impressive. And recently it seems like the moment he enters the game, the Spurs immediately go on a run.

He's not playing 1 on 1 though - his terrible shooting affects the spacing for everyone. Patty or Danny for example, even when not shooting well, have more gravity and everyone gets more room to operate. For as long as defenses treat Murray like Tony Allen he's not going to be a net positive player and thus will only get spot minutes. Neither defense nor rebounding are problems for the Spurs this season.

When he learns to shoot and to be more in control though, he'll be awesome. It's easy to see why they like him so much. It's just going to take time. He's already shown improvement from last season and it'll be a gradual process, not an instant leap.

He's also averaging 9.4 rebounds per 36 minutes!

[TD 21]

Watching him play, Murray has gotten appreciatively better since the start of this season. I feel like he’s even tightening his handle, which is one of my biggest gripes with him (dribbles too damn big). His nose for defense is great, his rebounding is unbelievable for a pg, and his reads on offense are improving (he had a sweet pass to LA in traffic today). The shot will come over the next few seasons.

The reality is that, while it feels like we have a logjam at guard now, next year could see the Spurs without Manu and Green. It’s good that the Murrays and Forbes of the world are taking nice strides this year, with White (and hopefully Paul) in the wings.

There's probably even less chance of Green being gone than their was Mills because unlike him, who'd have been collateral damage had Paul opted out and signed, there's no comparable on the wing who they're thought to have a chance to sign.

Ginobili is probably retiring, with the 2nd year likely serving as a de facto retirement gift.

Unless there's not enough external interest in Forbes to fetch and offer sheet and he's either content or has to settle for being a likely non rotation player, he's probably gone.

The back court succession plan is likely as follows: Murray inherits Ginobili's role until Parker retires, at which point Murray inherits Parker's role and White inherits Murray's role.

Murray played very well today. He made an impact even without scoring. I think the issue is that even without Murray getting many minutes, SA is still a top 3 defensive team. Pop is searching for offense which Murray does not provide at all.

So even with TP/Mills and other guys that provide very little defense compared to Murray, SA is still an elite defensive team (and that is with Kawhi not playing anywhere close to his defensive potential).

Until Murray starts to do more on offense he will struggle to get minutes. Mills, even with his terrible defense and mediocre offense (to this point) he has more gravity on offense still. Pop is searching for offense and offense is very clearly the issue with this team.

He's not playing 1 on 1 though - his terrible shooting affects the spacing for everyone. Patty or Danny for example, even when not shooting well, have more gravity and everyone gets more room to operate. For as long as defenses treat Murray like Tony Allen he's not going to be a net positive player and thus will only get spot minutes. Neither defense nor rebounding are problems for the Spurs this season.

When he learns to shoot and to be more in control though, he'll be awesome. It's easy to see why they like him so much. It's just going to take time. He's already shown improvement from last season and it'll be a gradual process, not an instant leap.

[tholdren]

He's also averaging 9.4 rebounds per 36 minutes!

Holy ! Hes a pg and had 0 assists. Youre a re

[duncan2k5]

Holy ! Hes a pg and had 0 assists. Youre a re

Every single point guard on our roster has had zero assist games before... Difference is that Murray is much younger and more experienced than them... Plus has a higher ceiling

[dbestpro]

With Pop loving small ball, Murray becomes an important player because of his rebounding ability. Mills is a luxury three point shooter that can be replaced by Forbes. I like Mills but he is a trade asset.

[SAGirl]

He had an opportunity to make a difference but between foul trouble and trouble scoring with him in the game it wasn’t his night.

[tholdren]

He had an opportunity to make a difference but between foul trouble and trouble scoring with him in the game it wasn’t his night.

Kyle gone be jealous

[spursistan]

Goddamn ..

Even if Murray is unlikely to become a franchise/Top 10 PG, Spurs did absolutely nail the 2016 draft.

Easily their best pick since Parker (outside Kawhi, ofc) in this century..When all is said and done Dejounte will be at least a Top 7 player from that draft..

[MaNu4Tres]

Yeah, we've been talking about having Murray play the two forever now. Glad to see people are finally catching up to the idea.

Not really.

[MaNu4Tres]

Best option and most impactful point guard the Spurs have at the PG position. And it really isn't close. Been saying it for months now.

Just glad Pop made the permanent move.

Now if Pop can find a way to not play the Patty - Tony lineup. Get healthy Kawhi and Rudy.

[sasaint]

Not really.

Depends. Which will he likely develop (if at all) - NBA outside shot (both midrange and three) or NBA handles/vision?

[sasaint]

Best option and most impactful point guard the Spurs have at the PG position. And it really isn't close. Been saying it for months now.

Just glad Pop made the permanent move.

Now if Pop can find a way to not play the Patty - Tony lineup. Get healthy Kawhi and Rudy.

Pop will always play midget ball as long as those guys are on the team.

[MaNu4Tres]

Depends. Which will he likely develop (if at all) - NBA outside shot (both midrange and three) or NBA handles/vision?

Point guards come in all shapes, sizes and skill sets. This is 2018, not 1992. DeJounte is the Spurs labeled PG and plans are for him to be the PG moving forward for years to come, unless Spurs can get a star elite PG -- which isn't going to happen.

It was 4 months into his sop re season, at 21 years old, for him to replace Tony Parker.

[apalisoc_9]

Man, kinda impressed with how murray has developed despite his extremely inconsistent playing time and role.

[sasaint]

Point guards come in all shapes, sizes and skill sets. This is 2018, not 1992. DeJounte is the Spurs labeled PG and plans are for him to be the PG moving forward for years to come, unless Spurs can get a star elite PG -- which isn't going to happen.

It was 4 months into his sop re season, at 21 years old, for him to replace Tony Parker.

I like how he is progressing within his game. He will need to develop a decent outside shot in any case. I don't recall how many seasons it took Tony to develop a good outside shot, but he became a serious threat. That enabled him to be all the more effective in his drives to the hoop. I hope Dijon develops along those same lines.

[DAF86]

Goddamn ..

Even if Murray is unlikely to become a franchise/Top 10 PG, Spurs did absolutely nail the 2016 draft.

Easily their best pick since Parker (outside Kawhi, ofc) in this century..When all is said and done Dejounte will be at least a Top 7 player from that draft..

Wasn't Brogdon picked after Murray?

[Ice009]

Any news on whether or not he's playing next game?

[Chinook]

Not really.

What kind of ass-hurt is this, bro?

[DAF86]

Yeah, we've been talking about having Murray play the two forever now. Glad to see people are finally catching up to the idea.

That's a terrible idea.

[Chinook]

That's a terrible idea.

Other than Forbes, Murray has the highest net rating when paired with Mills, so it still hasn't been a terrible idea.