True enough. Riley/Spoelstra would be the model, but would president Pop have any more stomach for a fairly extensive re-tooling than coach Pop? Also, we are so accustomed to the Holts being such hands-off owners, would the events of the last 9 months, taken in aggregate, prompt ownership to break with past history and step in after years of passivity?
Interesting that when they cut Jaren, I think it was the most money they ever ate at that point in time.
This was before the stadium was built, when they were crying about only having 11 suites in the alamodome.
They were so poor they had to ask Sean to defer salary just to have the cash on hand to build the practice facility.
That's how badly Jaren Sr had worn out his welcome.
Is there anyone currently that strikes you that way. Even the days of SJAX wearing out his second welcome are really from a time I wasn't into the Spurs all that much.
No one strikes me that way in this current crew.
I thought Boris, had he not been traded, was heading in that direction. We love the personality but he had let himself go, grown complacent (and he was prone to struggling with his own weight and aggression as a player to begin with), and he was playing less. The way he was headed was out of the league and that's what he eventually got. Unbelievable bc without him Spurs don't get past OKC 2014 (and some would say against the Heat neither)
I forgot that the Cavs still had Zizi after they Fed Ex'd half the team cross country
Thats an interesting alternative trade. Mills is already redundant with Murray in the starting role and Parker as the backup PG and Forbes (though, he is better than Bryn) and his contract is bad one that goes for 3 more years so I would be all for trying to include him in any deal. I do worry that the Spurs might get sentimental with Hill during the last year of that contract and opt to keep him for $19,000,000 when they could cut him if he under performs and pay only $1,000,000. I forgot about Pau but he is really on a one year deal after this season, though he would and is a super over-priced backup center next season, despite how well he's played overall.
Trade Scenario 1:
Cavs Get: Kawhi Leonard, Patty Mills,
Spurs Get: Kevin Love, Cedi Osman, Ante Zizic, Nets Pick ( Five-thirty-eight has Brooklyn projected as finishing 3rd, so it could be even better, for what its worth)
Trade Scenario 2:
Cavs Get: Kawhi Leonard, Patty Mills
Spurs Get: George Hill, Cedi Osman, Ante Zizic, Nets Pick
based on rough numbers crunching; I think both deals wouldn't actually save the Spurs money next season when factoring the salary of the Net pick, but probably by not much more than a couple of million.
In both deals the long term savings would be big though; the 4 players we would receive in the first deal (including the draft pick) would cost almost $36 million in '19-20, which would've been around what Kawhi would be scheduled to make under the super-max. In deal number two, if the Spurs cut Hill before the '19-20 season along with stretching and waiving Pau they could have a a lot amount of cap space if they were to go that route.
Not really, no one comes to mind. Normally gaining a lot of weight or being injured seem to be major factors in Pop being 'through' with a player, like Jaren, Mahinmi, or Diaw.
But it didn't hurt Parker and hasn't hurt Mills.
Gotta agree with this. It's like making a list of girls you'll try and date after your wife divorces you. Concentrate on the relationship at hand.
(Not that I don't appreciate OP's excellent work. Just not in the mood to consider such a future...yet...)
I found a site that lets you read insider articles, google for insider2text. I tried a couple of recent articles and it actually seems to work.
3 depending on the filler
I'd go with option 1 (if the Cavs put both options on the table). I wouldn't want hill taking minutes from DJ or White.
If I'm trading Kawhi I'm trying to get a young guy already in the league and picks... something like to Phoenix with Jackson and their 1st coming back...maybe the Lakers for Ingram, kuzma, and a couple 1sts... maybe Boston for Tatum and either brown or a 1st... something along those lines..
I don't think that the Laker's have enough assets tbh; Ingram, Randle, Hart and Kuzma and future 1sts, that are likely to be in the 20's, probably isn't going to get PATFO very interested.
If Boston then it would have to be Brown, Tatum, Memphis 2019 1st ( only top 8 protected with a decent chance of being a lottery pick), Clippers 2019 1st ( lottery protected in 2019 and 2020 so it may not convey but if they were to make the playoffs then the pick would convey and would probably be in the teens and give the Spurs 3 1st round picks) and maybe a 2019 Boston pick for good measure.
Phoenix has some good assets but I doubt he would commit beyond next season meaning that they wouldn't give up but only so much.
It just depends on how much patfo values different guys. We can say the Lakers don't have the assets but, if patfo is really enamored with Ingram then they might have enough. I covered a range of different teams because I don't know who we like. Personally, I like Tatum better than Ingram because he's a better 3 point guy and doesn't need the ball in his hands as much so he fits better with DJ. That said, patfo might like ingram's length, handle, and aggressiveness attacking the basket better.... I'm just saying I like this guy or that one but they are looking at a bigger picture.
too early to think about trading the franchise player...
A Kawhi trade is only one part of the OP. The Spurs have a draft pick no matter what happens with Kawhi
Spurs need wings and bigs. But the truth is, I hope that SA uses their pick (assuming it’s the only one they have) to move Mills contract or Pau’s.
I don't consider them comparable contracts. Patty will have nearly twice as much money guaranteed to him after this season than Pau does. ($39 Million vs $23 Million). Trading a first and Mills for a decent expiring or a TE might make sense. But given that cap space may not be on the table for a long time, I'm not giving one up to get rid of Pau. Short of having a shot at a max guy, the pick is just more valuable, even as a stash.
The thread isn't about picking which option you prefer. And there's no way I'd say the things you've said about the Kawhi situation while also thinking that trading Aldridge for a mid-first is the best course of action anyway.
I would agree with that and it’s a reasonable take for sure. However, if the difference (assuming other moves like renouncing TP and Manu) in getting some decent cap space means a team is willing to take on Gasol vs Mills and you get a commitment from a FA you really like, I think it’s worth it.
A lot of things are pointing to Jaren Jackson being a great pick. Suns fans on RealGM were talking about Josh Jackson and their pick for Kawhi. Dunno if that's enough, but Murray, Jackson and Jackson is a great start for either a rebuild or a good set of role-players to fit around Aldrige, Gay and the other vets. White, Bertans and Milutinov aren't exactly terrible either for fourth, fifth and sixth "young guys".
Don' t know if they'd give up two top 3 picks for Kawhi without assurances that he would resign but they have't made the playoffs in nearly a decade and their rebuild doesn't seem to be going very good, other than Booker, so who knows.
Jackson has become my dream for winning the lottery as the 9th seed, or even getting the 2nd or 3rd. Good chance he's there at 3, with Ayton and Doncic being top two. Bulls won Rose when the odds were against them. As long as Patty keeps getting crunch time minutes and delivering his crucial four point swings, the dream for the lottery LIVES.
Him with Kawhi and Murray and Aldridge and Green ... Best ever defensive rating.
I don't know if they would either. I think their pick and someone like Chriss would make more sense. Maybe add in the Miami pick and them taking back more bad salary. I do like Josh, though, and I think him and a top-three pick is a better package than anything Boston can realistically put together. Again, though, Tatum could be Pop's wet dream for all I know.
I think the Suns make much more sense for either LMA or Love in a scenario where SA gets him in a Kawhi deal. Both guys have multiple years left on their deals, and Phoenix could add the 2018 Miami and MKE picks to an expiring and really come correct with an offer for both. Booker, Jackson and a top-three pick is a really strong young group to try to make a playoff push. Trade the other pieces for a PF and PG (could easily get Walker for a few of those assets), and try to make a real push.
I do see scenarios where PHX could keep Kawhi, though. Fast-growing area, much closer to LA, great medical staff. If Kawhi's more butt-hurt about the injury than the market, the Suns (especially after making some moves) are a nice choice. It also doesn't hurt that they can give him significantly more money, even if the supermax is off the table.
Either of these are solid, though Id have a slight preference for Hill, unless somehow Pau is the peice included instead of Patty and Love is part of the deal.
I’d also try to get greedy with CAVS since they are desperate to keep James. Like can we get a future first after 2020 when chances are they’ll be in decline (like BOS did with MEM), or Larry Nance?
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