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Didn’t simmons want more than that but when he couldn’t, he settled for Orlando contract?
Why have a taller stronger wing when you can have a quality midget? Straight up, I wouldn't have passed on Simmons. But then paying Mills double???
17-18 18-19 19-20 20-21 Mills $10.7 M $11.5 M $12.4 M $13.3M Simmons $6.3 M $6.0 M $5.7 M FA
Didn’t simmons want more than that but when he couldn’t, he settled for Orlando contract?
They always want the most at the beginning of the process, which makes PATFO even stupider for signing Mills at 12:01 AM.
Stop making threads, schoolshootertacular.
Smdh.
Simmons wasn’t too great in Orlando. Let’s stop acting like he was a top prospect or anything.
Does it make the Mills signing excusable? No
Dude was tearing sh** up against GS. When you have a wing player that can create his own shot and play D, you don't let that go so cheaply for a player who can't do either.
Mills advanced stats for 2017-18 reg season:
https://stats.nba.com/player/201988/
BY YEAR TEAM GP MIN OFFRTG DEFRTG NETRTG AST% AST/TO AST RATIO OREB% DREB% REB% TO RATIO EFG% TS% USG% PACE PIE
2017-18 SAS 5 33.0 100.2 111.8 -11.7 14.3 1.44 16.0 1.2 6.1 3.4 11.1 55.3 56.6 18.9 93.17 6.0
Simmons advanced stats for 2017-18 reg season:
https://stats.nba.com/player/203613/
BY YEAR TEAM GP MIN OFFRTG DEFRTG NETRTG AST% AST/TO AST RATIO OREB% DREB% REB% TO RATIO EFG% TS% USG% PACE PIE
2017-18 ORL 69 29.4 103.8 110.9 -7.2 13.1 1.17 14.4 3.3 9.8 6.5 12.3 51.1 55.5 22.0 100.34 7.7
Both were net negatives but Mills was more negative when on the court for the Spurs (-7.2) than Simmons for the Magic (-11.7). Surprisingly, Simmons was better on offense than Mills by rating, and Mills/Simmons were about equally bad on defense.
Mills and Simmons averaged basically the same assists per game (2.5/2.6), which is not great for Mills. And Mills got slightly more PT (33 vs 29 MPG)
Mills 3P% was only 37%, and Simmons jumped up to 33.%, so they were similar there (also bad for Mills).
Mills shot 43% from the field, while Simmons jumped up to almost 47%. Wow this is looking pretty badI'm gonna stop now
I don't know if it was ever discussed on ST but was it ever revealed why (like specifics) Simmons and Dedmon and even David Lee weren't re-signed last year? Was it mostly PATFO or did those players not want to return to the team?
As pointed out here Simmoms took next to nothing from Orlando so it's not like PATFO couldn't spare $6 mil a year. Which makes me think they either never wanted him back or he really didn't want to be here any more. And Dedmon not sure how much he's making but something tells me he probably wouldn't have even considered any offer from Spurs. He just didn't seem to care for Pop's style of leadership or possibly Pop himself.
And David Lee, well no one either wanted him or his injury was something he didn't want to rehab back from so he retired.
Simmons was pretty poor all year for the Magic. He is not a top 9 rotational player for a playoff team. That's that. Mills has proven he is, and was the equal second best player for the Spurs down the stretch including the Playoffs.
Um.... That's not how math works.
EDIT: Along those lines, Mills had a significantly better year than Simmons in terms of impact stats:
https://www.basketball-reference.com...02&idx=players
I have zero idea how you thought Jon compared favorably here.
Lee wanted to return. PATFO was risk averse due to his serious injury/age. That one is understandable. Though, they did pass on a guy that had "gotten over himself" who could've been signed along with Simmons combined for cheaper than Mills.
Dedmon said some stuff that I don't immediately recall that hurt Gregg's feelings.
Simmons, the company line was they wanted him but simply couldn't afford him. Maybe that was true, but only after overpaying Mills.
He played like one against Golden State, tbh. He was one of few bright spots after Kawhi went down.
And without that series, he might not even have gotten half what he got.
Orlando fan probably sees him as their Patty contract. The reality is, the Spurs did him a solid. They didn’t have to retract the QO, but they did. He was getting NO offer sheets.
I think both Simmons and especially Dedmon, did not get along with Pop or care for their (spurs) coaching style and that's the big reason. Could have easily retained both.
I think PATFO felt they needed Patty after TP’s injury. I think that is why they pressed hard with 12:01 stuff. I think Pop thought they were s Rudy Gay and healthy TP away from beating GSW. Bad decision in hindsight. The Gasol stuff is much worse. Someone may have given Patty that same deal.
Giving Mills a bad contract doesn't mean that letting Simmons go was a mistake.
Simmons leaving was as much about playing time as the money imo.
Spurstalk analysis at its bestMills advanced stats for 2017-18 reg season:
https://stats.nba.com/player/201988/
BY YEAR TEAM GP MIN OFFRTG DEFRTG NETRTG AST% AST/TO AST RATIO OREB% DREB% REB% TO RATIO EFG% TS% USG% PACE PIE
2017-18 SAS 5 33.0 100.2 111.8 -11.7 14.3 1.44 16.0 1.2 6.1 3.4 11.1 55.3 56.6 18.9 93.17 6.0
Simmons advanced stats for 2017-18 reg season:
https://stats.nba.com/player/203613/
BY YEAR TEAM GP MIN OFFRTG DEFRTG NETRTG AST% AST/TO AST RATIO OREB% DREB% REB% TO RATIO EFG% TS% USG% PACE PIE
2017-18 ORL 69 29.4 103.8 110.9 -7.2 13.1 1.17 14.4 3.3 9.8 6.5 12.3 51.1 55.5 22.0 100.34 7.7
Both were net negatives but Mills was more negative when on the court for the Spurs (-7.2) than Simmons for the Magic (-11.7). Surprisingly, Simmons was better on offense than Mills by rating, and Mills/Simmons were about equally bad on defense.
Mills and Simmons averaged basically the same assists per game (2.5/2.6), which is not great for Mills. And Mills got slightly more PT (33 vs 29 MPG)
Mills 3P% was only 37%, and Simmons jumped up to 33.%, so they were similar there (also bad for Mills).
Mills shot 43% from the field, while Simmons jumped up to almost 47%. Wow this is looking pretty bad
Off yourself.Spurstalk analysis at its best
No second best was likely Manu. I'd take Rudy ahead of Mills too.
Without Manu or Rudy the Spurs don't even make the playoffs.
The one game the Spurs were able to win in the playoffs Dejounte had a terrific offensive game and Manu was key.
Mills could easily switch spots with Jon in a bad team and look a lot worse IMO... and I am not a Jon fan.
From what I have seen, they are happy with him. His contract is really small in comparison to similar wings and he brought some toughness and fearlessness to that team... but after seeing him start for most of the season, from what I have read, they are mostly convinced he's a bench quality player and shouldn't play as many minutes as he was playing or starting.... whether that's true or not, I feel the same about Mills. I think with less minutes and a lesser role he was fine, but playing as much as he was and being relied on for as much as he was wasn't good. Just got to hope Dijon and hopefully White and others develop to take minutes and the ball.
Mills is clearly worse... And the only reason Simmons had bad numbers is because he was on a bad team...
Simmons may be a flash in the pan, flavor of the month, or even a system guy, but Mills is criminally overpaid. He isn't worth that. But hey! Culture has no price now.
100% on both of these
Actually, on/off court adjusts for how bad the team is:
- Spurs were +2.5 when Mills was on the court and +3.5 when he was off the court. So 1 point worse when on the court with a much better surrounding cast.
- Magic were -7.2 when Simmons was on the court and -2.9 when off. So 4.3 points worse when the rest of the team was worse than Spurs other players. Pretty bad, while Mills was pretty average.
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