OT: Drake..

[midnightpulp]

Amb knew there was a reason I fux with ya...
That is good stuff even if it's old.
Lately a buddy of mine got me access to some hi-res remaster of Stevie, Miles, Coltrane and even some Smashing Pumpkins. I need to update some components in my chain (my AVR is good but the one I want and preamp are both pricey) but really love the quality difference it makes already.

What gear (speakers, receiver, etc) are you running?

[midnightpulp]

Thanks. Good stuff. Good to see something with a little depth.

Can’t say I’m an audiophile as I got tin ears. That said, just got an old sansui amp. Those things sounds phenomenal. Gonna have it restored but it’s gonna cost me a pretty penny. I just don’t have the skills to do it.

Listening to old stuff still, death cab for cutie lately, broken social scene as well. But just older bands in general.

Sansui made some of the best receivers. What model is it?

Did you ever buy a set of speakers? You were looking at PSB, if I remember.

[Killakobe81]

What gear (speakers, receiver, etc) are you running?

Marantz avr, klipsch refference towers and surrounds elac height speakers 2svs subs the 12s, not the monster 1 sub to rule them all one... No pre amp yet. Sony projector and Sony hi Res player

[midnightpulp]

Marantz avr, klipsch refference towers and surrounds elac height speakers 2svs subs the 12s, not the monster 1 sub to rule them all one... No pre amp yet. Sony projector and Sony hi Res player

Same. I have the SR6009. 2 SVS subs is godly. . Yeah, dual subs (or more) are the way to go for bass accuracy and smooths out the bass in the room. I have a single Rythmik 12" but eventually want to go dual. Nerdy "audiophile" . https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofer-setup/two-subs

[DJR210]

Also, the only way the lyrics on Scorpion could have been more embarrassing for Drake is if Push ghostwrote them himself. Dude literally rewrote the album at the last minute to put in some lines about how he really is what Pusha said he was.

Yeah, I saw a bunch of articles on my feed come up saying he mentioned accusations Push made on Adidon.. all in a span of like 2 weeks. Pusha T made him rethink his life

[midnightpulp]

I’ve always been a rock guy but I’m trying to get into jazz and blues. Mostly the biggest of the names like Miles Davis and John Coltrane. But for rock, anything from Beatles to white stripes is good with me. Some of the newer stuff is nice as well
But I’m just so out of it.

The home setup is decent just nothing amazing, and most of that is through headphones (grado, hifiman, stax, diy even) and they sound amazing. I’d have to spend so much more for an equivalent quality for speakers.

This is actually a myth (and one I'm not particularly sure how it started). Here's a quote from a respected member of the stereo enthusiast community (the term audiophile implies kind of a cultist, irrational mindset ) who takes a scientific approach toward audio rather than the all too often subjective approach that has people believing 5000.00 cables magically open up a new audio world.



A pair of monitors like the JBL LSR305s measure better than any headphone in existence and cost all of 299.99 for the pair. Room issues also aren't the problem as they once were perceived to be. As psychoacoustic researcher Floyd Toole (Harman's former chief scientist) found:

Humans evolved while listening in reflective spaces, and are comfortable listening in them. In fact, it is now widely recognized that we perceptually "stream" the sound of the room as separate from the sound of the sources - that is what happens in live performances. A Steinway is a Steinway; only the hall changes. Performance halls generally don’t have room mode problems because they are so large. The parallel situation in sound reproduction is that a good loudspeaker is a good loudspeaker, and its virtues are appreciated in a wide variety of rooms – except for the differences in the bass region.

Bass is typically the trickiest thing to get right in rooms, and that problem can be mitigated by multiple subs or room treatment. I say this to not scare you off of buying <1000.00 speakers. You don't need to spend 5 figures on speakers to get equivalent performance to a 300.00 pair of headphones. I honestly think it's the reverse, since headphones can't really produce a soundstage (the holographic representation of singers/musicians in the room) without something like a Smyth Realizer (5000.00) and can't resolve dynamics like speakers. And if you prefer the close/inside the head imaging of headphones, you can always do a nearfield speaker setup which produces a similar fine detail result but with more dimensionality.

[Killakobe81]

Same. I have the SR6009. 2 SVS subs is godly. . Yeah, dual subs (or more) are the way to go for bass accuracy and smooths out the bass in the room. I have a single Rythmik 12" but eventually want to go dual. Nerdy "audiophile" . https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofer-setup/two-subs

Appreciate it. I realize it's a process. I figured I'll wait until I can get the avr and pre amp I truly want it's an investment. Right now my man space is not fully enclosed its a large 2nd story game room and sound proofing and enclosing it will be a 2019 home improvement project. My wife is finishing a 2nd Nursing degree so all projects on hold til she finishes.

[ambchang]

Sansui made some of the best receivers. What model is it?

Did you ever buy a set of speakers? You were looking at PSB, if I remember.

I got the integrated amps. Have the au717 for about two years and now just got the au11000a. The 11ka got serious power but I wanted to have it restored as it is a 40 yo amp.

Not sure if I should have the 717 restored first then sell or just straight out sell it. The 717 is in great shape overall, like a three year old piece of gear. The 11ka needs a bit of attention.

For speakers I just some book shelves. Whafedale diamond 10.1. Will get some floor standing when money flows a little.

[ambchang]

This is actually a myth (and one I'm not particularly sure how it started). Here's a quote from a respected member of the stereo enthusiast community (the term audiophile implies kind of a cultist, irrational mindset ) who takes a scientific approach toward audio rather than the all too often subjective approach that has people believing 5000.00 cables magically open up a new audio world.



A pair of monitors like the JBL LSR305s measure better than any headphone in existence and cost all of 299.99 for the pair. Room issues also aren't the problem as they once were perceived to be. As psychoacoustic researcher Floyd Toole (Harman's former chief scientist) found:



Bass is typically the trickiest thing to get right in rooms, and that problem can be mitigated by multiple subs or room treatment. I say this to not scare you off of buying <1000.00 speakers. You don't need to spend 5 figures on speakers to get equivalent performance to a 300.00 pair of headphones. I honestly think it's the reverse, since headphones can't really produce a soundstage (the holographic representation of singers/musicians in the room) without something like a Smyth Realizer (5000.00) and can't resolve dynamics like speakers. And if you prefer the close/inside the head imaging of headphones, you can always do a nearfield speaker setup which produces a similar fine detail result but with more dimensionality.

That’s good to know. My headphones are unreasonably expensive, second handed, so I’m thinking I can get better sound just selling those and get better speakers. Thinking of getting an Oppo 105 as source but then again that’s so expensive. Will obviously sell my Cambridge network player in that case.

At the end. I want a chain of Oppo 105, Nad m3 (or m2), then a set of speakers and will call it a day. Not a huge subwoofer fan but will look if need be.

[midnightpulp]

That’s good to know. My headphones are unreasonably expensive, second handed, so I’m thinking I can get better sound just selling those and get better speakers. Thinking of getting an Oppo 105 as source but then again that’s so expensive. Will obviously sell my Cambridge network player in that case.

At the end. I want a chain of Oppo 105, Nad m3 (or m2), then a set of speakers and will call it a day. Not a huge subwoofer fan but will look if need be.

Oppo makes nice stuff but at the end of the day it's just a transport to play your media. I take it you want the Oppo since it's a universal player that can play SACDs, DVD-A, etc, etc. Yamaha make reasonably priced universal players for much less. https://www.accessories4less.com/mak...-player/1.html

I would bet any amount of money that even the most critical ear would not be able to tell the two players apart in a blind test. DACs are essentially all the same now, even in lower end gear. You can put the difference toward speakers, which is the most important part of the chain. For speaker reviews when you're shopping, read the reviews on Audioholics. They're one of the more objective review sites out there. Stereophile is good, too (like audioholics, they cite measurements).

[Killakobe81]

Oppo makes nice stuff but at the end of the day it's just a transport to play your media. I take it you want the Oppo since it's a universal player that can play SACDs, DVD-A, etc, etc. Yamaha make reasonably priced universal players for much less. https://www.accessories4less.com/mak...-player/1.html

I would bet any amount of money that even the most critical ear would not be able to tell the two players apart in a blind test. DACs are essentially all the same now, even in lower end gear. You can put the difference toward speakers, which is the most important part of the chain. For speaker reviews when you're shopping, read the reviews on Audioholics. They're one of the more objective review sites out there. Stereophile is good, too (like audioholics, they cite measurements).

Good knowledge you dropping on there mid.
Plus Oppo is getting out of business of making players this year.
They claim they will still support but I am not 100% sure I trust that.
when I buy good equipment (which Oppo is) I expect it to last a very long time.
My guess if you buy a Oppo player now not only will you pay a premium (post announcement they have become harder to find and the price has skyrocketed on the secondary market) but their support will not last as long as that player will. Which if you do care about being able to play all disc dormats may be come an issue once they stop pushing out updates.

[ambchang]

Oppo makes nice stuff but at the end of the day it's just a transport to play your media. I take it you want the Oppo since it's a universal player that can play SACDs, DVD-A, etc, etc. Yamaha make reasonably priced universal players for much less. https://www.accessories4less.com/mak...-player/1.html

I would bet any amount of money that even the most critical ear would not be able to tell the two players apart in a blind test. DACs are essentially all the same now, even in lower end gear. You can put the difference toward speakers, which is the most important part of the chain. For speaker reviews when you're shopping, read the reviews on Audioholics. They're one of the more objective review sites out there. Stereophile is good, too (like audioholics, they cite measurements).

I am looking into Oppo because of value for money, and strictly because of the audio circuitry. I have the Cambridge CXN in one system, and then a Mytek 192DSD Dac for my office, and I have to say DACs do make a difference. Just the pacing and the clarity is different, and in general, just strictly on the DAC side, I actually prefer the Mytek.

For speakers, they go up to crazy prices sometimes, but being a Canuck, will stay with PSB.

[midnightpulp]

I am looking into Oppo because of value for money, and strictly because of the audio circuitry. I have the Cambridge CXN in one system, and then a Mytek 192DSD Dac for my office, and I have to say DACs do make a difference. Just the pacing and the clarity is different, and in general, just strictly on the DAC side, I actually prefer the Mytek.

For speakers, they go up to crazy prices sometimes, but being a Canuck, will stay with PSB.

If you feel you can get an Oppo without it eating into your speaker budget, yeah, go for it. Just make sure you spend every penny you can on your speakers. They are the most important link in the sound quality chain. Can't go wrong with PSB. They've dusted other Canadian high-end companies like Paradigm, so if you want to stick to Canadian made, PSB is the choice. Are you looking at their flagship model the T3?

[Killakobe81]

If you feel you can get an Oppo without it eating into your speaker budget, yeah, go for it. Just make sure you spend every penny you can on your speakers. They are the most important link in the sound quality chain. Can't go wrong with PSB. They've dusted other Canadian high-end companies like Paradigm, so if you want to stick to Canadian made, PSB is the choice. Are you looking at their flagship model the T3?

Either of yall still mess with or gotten in to the Vinyl Renaissance? Some audiophiles hate it say they would never go backwards while some audio enthusiasts still swear by the experience.

[midnightpulp]

Either of yall still mess with or gotten in to the Vinyl Renaissance? Some audiophiles hate it say they would never go backwards while some audio enthusiasts still swear by the experience.

Always been into LPs and have a large collection that I thrifted when CDs became stupidly expensive in the late 90s/early 00s. Remember how the general price for new CD was 18.99 then?

Yeah, LPs are worth getting into. LPs will still have the best master of a lot of pre-90s music. Many remasters of classic rock, soul, pop etc are terrible, victims of the loudness war philosophy. The biggest determinant of sound quality other than the speakers is how the music was mastered. Something like Californication sounds more like the better your gear gets. If you're wondering about which version of a particular album is mastered the best, just type search the le on google, best master, and steve Hoffman. The forum members there have seemed to compare every album in existence lol. Ex. http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/thread...ing-cd.201033/

[Killakobe81]

Always been into LPs and have a large collection that I thrifted when CDs became stupidly expensive in the late 90s/early 00s. Remember how the general price for new CD was 18.99 then?

Yeah, LPs are worth getting into. LPs will still have the best master of a lot of pre-90s music. Many remasters of classic rock, soul, pop etc are terrible, victims of the loudness war philosophy. The biggest determinant of sound quality other than the speakers is how the music was mastered. Something like Californication sounds more like the better your gear gets. If you're wondering about which version of a particular album is mastered the best, just type search the le on google, best master, and steve Hoffman. The forum members there have seemed to compare every album in existence lol. Ex. http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/thread...ing-cd.201033/

Appreciate it Mid. Funny how things have reversed I can find lots of Cd's even hard to find ones in the secondary market for $5-8.99. LP's new are twice that and their prices on the used market is rising ... that is awesome to hear I will use that serach.

For demo or reffernce material can you give me a suggestion in each of the following categories: Rock, Classical (bach, betthoven etc), rap, Jazz, funk, Disco, Country, 80's pop. No rush , looking for both quality of the music (i know tastes are subjective) but even more important sound staging, instrumentation, quality masters etc.

Lets say Amb came over something you would use to demo for him.
No rush, whenever you get to it.

[ambchang]

If you feel you can get an Oppo without it eating into your speaker budget, yeah, go for it. Just make sure you spend every penny you can on your speakers. They are the most important link in the sound quality chain. Can't go wrong with PSB. They've dusted other Canadian high-end companies like Paradigm, so if you want to stick to Canadian made, PSB is the choice. Are you looking at their flagship model the T3?

No way I can afford flagships. I’m thinking mid range stuff as the upstream cabin is likely going to be of that caliber anyways. Looking at used synchrony stuff right now. Also thinking about focal 826 but they ain’t Canuck.

Amp wise I will either stick with my ancient sansuis or go with Nad.

[ambchang]

Either of yall still mess with or gotten in to the Vinyl Renaissance? Some audiophiles hate it say they would never go backwards while some audio enthusiasts still swear by the experience.

I have a very cheap turntable and some vinyls but it would be a huge drain for me to get all the vinyl back. They are $30 to $40 each and there’s at least 100 to 150 albums I listen to seriously. So that will cost me $3000 to $4500 and I’d rather spend on gear.

Vinyl generally sounds warmer because the disc itself is scratched out and deteriorated. The first frequencies to go are the high frequencies and it’s actually not a good thing even though it sounds pleasant to the ears.

[ambchang]

Always been into LPs and have a large collection that I thrifted when CDs became stupidly expensive in the late 90s/early 00s. Remember how the general price for new CD was 18.99 then?

Yeah, LPs are worth getting into. LPs will still have the best master of a lot of pre-90s music. Many remasters of classic rock, soul, pop etc are terrible, victims of the loudness war philosophy. The biggest determinant of sound quality other than the speakers is how the music was mastered. Something like Californication sounds more like the better your gear gets. If you're wondering about which version of a particular album is mastered the best, just type search the le on google, best master, and steve Hoffman. The forum members there have seemed to compare every album in existence lol. Ex. http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/thread...ing-cd.201033/

You’re right. Mastering wasn’t properly done for a while. But the costs of vinyl and the wear is just too much to deal with for me. I only have like 10 vinyls.

Californication sounds like ass. Ruined a perfectly great album.

[Killakobe81]

No way I can afford flagships. I’m thinking mid range stuff as the upstream cabin is likely going to be of that caliber anyways. Looking at used synchrony stuff right now. Also thinking about focal 826 but they ain’t Canuck.

Amp wise I will either stick with my ancient sansuis or go with Nad.

I am mostly dealing with mid-range stuff myself.
Flagship is to cost prohibitive right now.
Mid is right great speakers do make a great difference but just doesnt make sense for me right now. and i cant afford what I would want yet anyways.

[ambchang]

I am mostly dealing with mid-range stuff myself.
Flagship is to cost prohibitive right now.
Mid is right great speakers do make a great difference but just doesnt make sense for me right now. and i cant afford what I would want yet anyways.

Still spending my money on music. I must have spent about $15k to $20k over the years just buying music.

[Killakobe81]

Still spending my money on music. I must have spent about $15k to $20k over the years just buying music.

I rmember doping a cost estimate during the Cd era that Mid was spaking of It was before I had kids so I was close but not quite that high but slowed down once the kids came. I will say this tough nowadays when I purchase I i ahve bought digital won some Apple music gift cards in a community service raffle and $100 worth of credit lasted me a almost 3 years because there just wasnt much I wanted in new music and with new music I can accept not having physical media. on classics i still like having the CD (or VINYL)
I need a a new low to mid priced turntable though.

[ambchang]

I rmember doping a cost estimate during the Cd era that Mid was spaking of It was before I had kids so I was close but not quite that high but slowed down once the kids came. I will say this tough nowadays when I purchase I i ahve bought digital won some Apple music gift cards in a community service raffle and $100 worth of credit lasted me a almost 3 years because there just wasnt much I wanted in new music and with new music I can accept not having physical media. on classics i still like having the CD (or VINYL)
I need a a new low to mid priced turntable though.

Similar for me. I had a $100 a week budget buying music, and I was buying them second hand so each album was about $8 to $10 (was working in HK then so there were these huge markets for cheap second hand stuff). So everyweek, I would head down and get like 10 albums for the two years I was there. Came back home, then kept buying music. Still have the rare binge now and then (getting like 15 CDs in a batch) but that is like once every 6 months instead of once a week now.

BTW, got the Good Kid MAAD city album because you guys kept talking about Kendrick. Didn't have much time to listen to it but I like what I hear. Can't listen to it with kids around for obvious reasons. I am way out of my element, but it reminds me of the early Outkast stuff, aquemini type stuff.

For rap, I pretty much only listen to Jay-Z, 2Pac, Big, Roots and Outkast. Some NWA as well, body count, but not a huge fan of the Snoop and Iced Tea stuff in general as it's too cartoonish at some point. Got some Eminem, Cypress Hill, Beastie Boys and Kid Rock as well ... come to think of it, I think I have more rap stuff than I thought, but they are all very main stream as you can tell.

Huge fan of Rage Against the Machine, I am not sure why they are not really that loved by general hip hop fans, perhaps of the entire collapse of rap-metal due to Limp Bizkit (I have that and Linkin Park as well )

Wanted to get into older stuff like Rakim, any other recommendations from you? You seem to be a much bigger rap fans than me.

[Killakobe81]

Similar for me. I had a $100 a week budget buying music, and I was buying them second hand so each album was about $8 to $10 (was working in HK then so there were these huge markets for cheap second hand stuff). So everyweek, I would head down and get like 10 albums for the two years I was there. Came back home, then kept buying music. Still have the rare binge now and then (getting like 15 CDs in a batch) but that is like once every 6 months instead of once a week now.

BTW, got the Good Kid MAAD city album because you guys kept talking about Kendrick. Didn't have much time to listen to it but I like what I hear. Can't listen to it with kids around for obvious reasons. I am way out of my element, but it reminds me of the early Outkast stuff, aquemini type stuff.

For rap, I pretty much only listen to Jay-Z, 2Pac, Big, Roots and Outkast. Some NWA as well, body count, but not a huge fan of the Snoop and Iced Tea stuff in general as it's too cartoonish at some point. Got some Eminem, Cypress Hill, Beastie Boys and Kid Rock as well ... come to think of it, I think I have more rap stuff than I thought, but they are all very main stream as you can tell.

Huge fan of Rage Against the Machine, I am not sure why they are not really that loved by general hip hop fans, perhaps of the entire collapse of rap-metal due to Limp Bizkit (I have that and Linkin Park as well )

Wanted to get into older stuff like Rakim, any other recommendations from you? You seem to be a much bigger rap fans than me.

You have a pretty good selection of rap but I wont lie I steer more 90's than other eras because its the one I grew up in and when i could afford music. Definitely add TPAB to your Kendrick list. My dark twisted is Kanye's sonically best album that and droput are good. as far as old school Rap, Rakim is defintely good (iIgot the greatest hits) but for an album I would give Paid in full the edge over Folloe the Leader. EPMD Strictly business is aclassic too.
As you stated some rap is hard to listen to as you age on a consistent basis . The guys you mentioned Outkast/Jay/big/roots are the guys I would go back to. But I would add Ice Cube's death certificate as well which accurately predicted the riots and says a lot about race and politics. Another is Pulbic enemy it takes a nation of millions. I also would recommend Tribe's midnight marauders and the Low End theory which has great jazz samples. I also was a fan of Wutang especially Rae's Only built for cuban Linx (purple Tape) and Wu tang forever ...36 chambers is very good but it sounds as it was mixed in a garage/basement studio.

[Killakobe81]

As you can tell though I can appreciate the gin and juice style west coast gangsta ...
I prefer conscious rap or at least guys with lyrics. It's all money, hoes, drugs I cant do it. Rap should have an element of potery and or social commentary