Spurs sign Julian Washburn and Amida Brimah

[Truth4sale$]

Good training camp adds. Both have good defensive potential.

Who is Washburn
https://www.minerrush.com/2015/6/19/...ulian-washburn

[Chinook]

Murray, White
Mills, Belinelli, Forbes, Walker
DeRozan, Gay, Pondexter, Huestis, Washburn
Aldridge, Bertans, Cunningham Metu
Gasol, Poeltl, Eubanks, Brimah

Bolded are the players on the projected 15-man roster. Italtics are the projected two-way players.

Really unbalanced depth chart. You ideally want to be four-deep at every position in camp so you can adequately rest people and run five-on-fives in practice. It's not all that rare for SA to run with only 19 players, though, so it's possible they don't add a final guy. I'd still want them to do so for at least some semblance of PG depth (even if it's just a guy like Ledbetter), but I've harped on that enough. Actually, to that end Washburn seems to have a reputation for passing the ball, even though his assist number don't suggest it. I don't see the fourth unit having any ball-handler as of now, so Washburn's passing should help there. Julian is literally one day older than Huestis, so it's not like he has a much higher upside. Though I guess that could also be interpreted to mean he has a similar chance of sticking if he shows something.

Brimah makes a good deal of sense as a camp-only center. In a Eubanks-less roster, he would have been ideal to soak up minutes behind the other bigs. Even now, it just suggests Pop is going to try to run two bigs as much as possible in camp, which is good both for the team if that's how they'll play in the regular season and for LMA's legs. Eubanks seemed like a post-up/dunker type in school, but if he has any versatility to show at the four, Brimah being there should help him get the opportunity.

As a general thought, I think Walker will see some time as the lead guard. The reason why I liked him as much as I did was because he seemed like someone who could break down a defense and penetrate. His metrics in college didn't really back that up, but if PATFO saw what I think I saw and have a plan to work on it, then giving Lonnie chances to do that and to evolve his passing off that penetration will likely be his roadmap in camp and in Austin. Unlike say Murray, Walker is coming in with an NBA body already. So it's going to be about working on his offensive skills and shot-selection.

[tbdog]

Any known injuries? Are we coming into camp healthy this year?

[Coach X]

IMO, PATFO thinks Patty Mills is a PG. White might be the third PG (despite he plays minutes as a SG) with Forbes and Walker being alternative options to that.

IMO, Gay is a PF. I'd classify our players like this:

Guards: Murray, Mills, White, Forbes, Walker
Wings: Belinelli,DeRozan, Pondexter,
Forwards :Gay, Bertans, Cunningham, Metu, Huestis, Washburn
Bigs: Aldridge, Gasol, Poeltl, Eubanks, Brimah

I don't see Pop using a classic structure (PG-SG-SF-PF-C) too often with this roster. We've seen in recent years that sometimes he goes small, sometimes he goes big. It depends on the individuals he wants to play, injuries, the rest he is giving to veterans, opponent team, who's in the dog house, etc. I don't even think he has decided who will start or what the structure of the starting unit or the second unit will be. This is a completely different team in terms of leadership (on and off the court) and roles. During training camp, Pop will put players in situations, observe how they relate to each other off the court, how they react to coaching, how they blend on the court and then he will figure out a rotation.


Only one more week for starting to have some answers! Let's go guys, we're almost there!

[szkorhetz]

IMO, PATFO thinks Patty Mills is a PG. White might be the third PG (despite he plays minutes as a SG) with Forbes and Walker being alternative options to that.

IMO, Gay is a PF. I'd classify our players like this:

Guards: Murray, Mills, White, Forbes, Walker
Wings: Belinelli,DeRozan, Pondexter,
Forwards :Gay, Bertans, Cunningham, Metu, Huestis, Washburn
Bigs: Aldridge, Gasol, Poeltl, Eubanks, Brimah

I don't see Pop using a classic structure (PG-SG-SF-PF-C) too often with this roster. We've seen in recent years that sometimes he goes small, sometimes he goes big. It depends on the individuals he wants to play, injuries, the rest he is giving to veterans, opponent team, who's in the dog house, etc. I don't even think he has decided who will start or what the structure of the starting unit or the second unit will be. This is a completely different team in terms of leadership (on and off the court) and roles. During training camp, Pop will put players in situations, observe how they relate to each other off the court, how they react to coaching, how they blend on the court and then he will figure out a rotation.


Only one more week for starting to have some answers! Let's go guys, we're almost there!

That wing depth

[Dancer]

What day does training camp start

[SpursWoman]

What day does training camp start

September 25

[Truth4sale$]

Murray, White
Mills, Belinelli, Forbes, Walker
DeRozan, Gay, Pondexter, Huestis, Washburn
Aldridge, Bertans, Cunningham Metu
Gasol, Poeltl, Eubanks, Brimah

Bolded are the players on the projected 15-man roster. Italtics are the projected two-way players.

Really unbalanced depth chart. You ideally want to be four-deep at every position in camp so you can adequately rest people and run five-on-fives in practice. It's not all that rare for SA to run with only 19 players, though, so it's possible they don't add a final guy. I'd still want them to do so for at least some semblance of PG depth (even if it's just a guy like Ledbetter), but I've harped on that enough. Actually, to that end Washburn seems to have a reputation for passing the ball, even though his assist number don't suggest it. I don't see the fourth unit having any ball-handler as of now, so Washburn's passing should help there. Julian is literally one day older than Huestis, so it's not like he has a much higher upside. Though I guess that could also be interpreted to mean he has a similar chance of sticking if he shows something.

Brimah makes a good deal of sense as a camp-only center. In a Eubanks-less roster, he would have been ideal to soak up minutes behind the other bigs. Even now, it just suggests Pop is going to try to run two bigs as much as possible in camp, which is good both for the team if that's how they'll play in the regular season and for LMA's legs. Eubanks seemed like a post-up/dunker type in school, but if he has any versatility to show at the four, Brimah being there should help him get the opportunity.

As a general thought, I think Walker will see some time as the lead guard. The reason why I liked him as much as I did was because he seemed like someone who could break down a defense and penetrate. His metrics in college didn't really back that up, but if PATFO saw what I think I saw and have a plan to work on it, then giving Lonnie chances to do that and to evolve his passing off that penetration will likely be his roadmap in camp and in Austin. Unlike say Murray, Walker is coming in with an NBA body already. So it's going to be about working on his offensive skills and shot-selection.

I like your analysis. I would like to see that 20th Spot go to a truly developmental type that will be more for showcasing for time with the Austin Spurs. Maybe a point guard or Power Forward. Someone who came out of the last 2 years, still on the young side. Such as Ajdin Penava from Marshal a great shot blocker

[Pavlov]

Thank you contracts for staying in Austin.

Still find it weird that Eubanks got the full two-way. Has anyone else corroborated that report?

[EDIT: Eubanks retweeted Shams, so that's good enough.]

[TD 21]

Opinions can obviously vary on how you think and/or want the rotation to play out, but the roster should be classified as follows . . .

Defensively:

Guards: Murray, Mills, Forbes
Wings: DeRozan, Belinelli, White, Walker
Big wings: Gay, Bertans, Cunningham, Pondexter*
Bigs: Aldridge, Gasol, Poeltl, Metu

Offensively:

Ball handlers: DeRozan, Murray, White
Wings: Belinelli, Mills, Forbes, Walker
Bigs wings: Gay, Bertans, Cunningham, Pondexter*
Bigs: Aldridge, Gasol, Poeltl, Metu

[MaNu4Tres]

This.

Dont know why some posters are still stuck on traditional lineups.

[Chinook]

This.

Dont know why some posters are still stuck on traditional lineups.

Ugh. The problem isn't being traditionalist. That could be the case if someone were arguing that Forbes HAS to be considered a PG or whether Aldridge is a four or five. No one is ing about the lack of pure PFs or SGs. The need for lead guards remains as high as ever in the "modern NBA", and whether you call that guard a PG or a ball-handler is irrelevant. The Spurs don't have enough. It's even worse when you look a little deeper and see that two of the guys listed as "ball-handlers" are young and don't have a lot of good tape being a lead guard, and the other player on that list played his whole career as a secondary play-maker (or worse) and has not demonstrated that he can be the main facilitator for successful offense, let alone doing so while maintaining his high scoring burden and improving his defense.

Right now, Pau's almost a guaranteed starter because of the need for his passing in the SL. Even having two "ball-handlers" in that unit leaves a lot to be desired. The only reason why SA might be able to get away with having just one on the bench is that Gay can also get his own shot and force mismatches. As much as I love White, there's a legit chance that he sucks too badly to stay in the rotation, let alone hold down the fort at PG. Moreover, the bigger issue is that with all three of those players in the rotation, Pop has no flexibility to handle an injury. If White goes down for a couple of weeks (which has happened already), then who's the next man up? Forbes? Yeah, no. They aren't going to "modern" their way to wins that way. If Murray has to miss significant time or just shows he's not ready for real PG production, can the team just slide Pondexter or Huestis into that slot and feel like they have a good chance of winning games? Of course not.

[TD 21]

Ugh. The problem isn't being traditionalist. That could be the case if someone were arguing that Forbes HAS to be considered a PG or whether Aldridge is a four or five. No one is ing about the lack of pure PFs or SGs. The need for lead guards remains as high as ever in the "modern NBA", and whether you call that guard a PG or a ball-handler is irrelevant. The Spurs don't have enough. It's even worse when you look a little deeper and see that two of the guys listed as "ball-handlers" are young and don't have a lot of good tape being a lead guard, and the other player on that list played his whole career as a secondary play-maker (or worse) and has not demonstrated that he can be the main facilitator for successful offense, let alone doing so while maintaining his high scoring burden and improving his defense.

Right now, Pau's almost a guaranteed starter because of the need for his passing in the SL. Even having two "ball-handlers" in that unit leaves a lot to be desired. The only reason why SA might be able to get away with having just one on the bench is that Gay can also get his own shot and force mismatches. As much as I love White, there's a legit chance that he sucks too badly to stay in the rotation, let alone hold down the fort at PG. Moreover, the bigger issue is that with all three of those players in the rotation, Pop has no flexibility to handle an injury. If White goes down for a couple of weeks (which has happened already), then who's the next man up? Forbes? Yeah, no. They aren't going to "modern" their way to wins that way. If Murray has to miss significant time or just shows he's not ready for real PG production, can the team just slide Pondexter or Huestis into that slot and feel like they have a good chance of winning games? Of course not.

You're thinking about this too rigidly . . .

- Gay can and probably will have his minutes split between starting and playing with the 2nd unit, like Gasol did last season.
- If White goes down, Forbes probably will take his rotation spot, but they're not going to play a 0 creator, 3 shooter lineup on the perimeter. Instead, they'll likely do what I mentioned with Gasol and Gay, with Murray.

[runningnurse71]

I thought Washburn was a decent player SF in D-Legue with good defensive skills. I wish they sign him for a two-way contract.

[SAGirl]

Murray, White
Mills, Belinelli, Forbes, Walker
DeRozan, Gay, Pondexter, Huestis, Washburn
Aldridge, Bertans, Cunningham Metu
Gasol, Poeltl, Eubanks, Brimah

Bolded are the players on the projected 15-man roster. Italtics are the projected two-way players.

Really unbalanced depth chart. You ideally want to be four-deep at every position in camp so you can adequately rest people and run five-on-fives in practice. It's not all that rare for SA to run with only 19 players, though, so it's possible they don't add a final guy. I'd still want them to do so for at least some semblance of PG depth (even if it's just a guy like Ledbetter), but I've harped on that enough. Actually, to that end Washburn seems to have a reputation for passing the ball, even though his assist number don't suggest it. I don't see the fourth unit having any ball-handler as of now, so Washburn's passing should help there. Julian is literally one day older than Huestis, so it's not like he has a much higher upside. Though I guess that could also be interpreted to mean he has a similar chance of sticking if he shows something.

Brimah makes a good deal of sense as a camp-only center. In a Eubanks-less roster, he would have been ideal to soak up minutes behind the other bigs. Even now, it just suggests Pop is going to try to run two bigs as much as possible in camp, which is good both for the team if that's how they'll play in the regular season and for LMA's legs. Eubanks seemed like a post-up/dunker type in school, but if he has any versatility to show at the four, Brimah being there should help him get the opportunity.

As a general thought, I think Walker will see some time as the lead guard. The reason why I liked him as much as I did was because he seemed like someone who could break down a defense and penetrate. His metrics in college didn't really back that up, but if PATFO saw what I think I saw and have a plan to work on it, then giving Lonnie chances to do that and to evolve his passing off that penetration will likely be his roadmap in camp and in Austin. Unlike say Murray, Walker is coming in with an NBA body already. So it's going to be about working on his offensive skills and shot-selection.

good observation, good guess on the two big lineups going forward this season.

[Chinook]

You're thinking about this too rigidly . . .

- Gay can and probably will have his minutes split between starting and playing with the 2nd unit, like Gasol did last season.
- If White goes down, Forbes probably will take his rotation spot, but they're not going to play a 0 creator, 3 shooter lineup on the perimeter. Instead, they'll likely do what I mentioned with Gasol and Gay, with Murray.

Pop didn't stagger Pau and LMA. He either played them together and had Joff in the rotation, or he played them separate as the two centers. You could just be saying that Pop isn't going to line-sub all the time, but that's obvious. He does, however, play his full bench together more than most other coaches would if they had two stars. Your plan if White goes down assume Murray can handle being the sole PG. Pop didn't think he could last year (which was his stated reasons for starting Mills). Moreover, DeRozan always played with another point-guard. Toronto ran three PGs and DeRozan. So assuming he's going to be able to hold up as the only real perimeter creator is asking a lot. I don't disagree that he will be playing more as a guard than a wing (he is closer to being a better Parker than he is to being a worse Leonard). But even at his absolutely peak, DeRozan has averaged fewer assists per minute than Tony did in any year after this rookie campaign. Simply put, DeRozan has been a guy who can compliment solid PG play, not replace it.

[TD 21]

Pop didn't stagger Pau and LMA. He either played them together and had Joff in the rotation, or he played them separate as the two centers. You could just be saying that Pop isn't going to line-sub all the time, but that's obvious. He does, however, play his full bench together more than most other coaches would if they had two stars. Your plan if White goes down assume Murray can handle being the sole PG. Pop didn't think he could last year (which was his stated reasons for starting Mills). Moreover, DeRozan always played with another point-guard. Toronto ran three PGs and DeRozan. So assuming he's going to be able to hold up as the only real perimeter creator is asking a lot. I don't disagree that he will be playing more as a guard than a wing (he is closer to being a better Parker than he is to being a worse Leonard). But even at his absolutely peak, DeRozan has averaged fewer assists per minute than Tony did in any year after this rookie campaign. Simply put, DeRozan has been a guy who can compliment solid PG play, not replace it.

He generally staggered them when he started them together, after realizing that Lauvergne's training camp was a fluke and he wasn't rotation caliber and that they needed as much shooting and play making as they could muster.

Sure, when he had a genius creator leading the best bench in the league. The only way to attempt to make sense of this roster is constant mixing and matching. As an aside, I don't buy Mills starting because Murray has another ball handler now with DeRozan and Mills is the closest thing to a 4th one they have, so starting would mean White running the 2nd unit solo.

Nah. I know full well that Murray, barring a quantum leap, can't handle being the sole play maker on a unit. I'm just saying, that would be as close to a solution as possible.

I agree, but if White goes down for a few weeks, they won't have much choice. The answer isn't signing some fringe player because they're a true PG and playing them over either a player making in excess of $3M (Forbes) or probably their best prospect in 7 years (Walker).

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Get ready for nonstop iso plays this year. We’re going to make the “4 down” Tim Duncan offense of the early 2000’s look creative with this group.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Prove me wrong Pop...please prove me wrong.

[offset formation]

Prove me wrong Pop...please prove me wrong.

With LMA or DDR?

Just the fact that i had to ask that should negate its implementation. I think you'll see more ball movement and slashing than you're expecting.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

With LMA or DDR?

Just the fact that i had to ask that should negate its implementation. I think you'll see more ball movement and slashing than you're expecting.

I hope so. I want to see how DDR and LMA do together and how the offense looks with them sharing the touches.

[offset formation]

I hope so. I want to see how DDR and LMA do together and how the offense looks with them sharing the touches.

Me too. Stoked for this season moreso than any since 2014.

[Robz4000]

and now they're waived

[BillMc]

and now they're waived

In and out like the tides.

[Chinook]

and now they're waived

Yeah? Did something happen?