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  1. #26
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
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    I've written this year off as a transition season, so all I'm really looking for are positive signs for next year. White's Defense and all around development, Poeltl's comfort level, and DeRozen's growth as a distributor are all good ones...

  2. #27
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    It's been several hours since the game, and I've slept since then. So my memory's not as clear as it usually is. I don't think the defensive difference was all that pronounced, though. The Spurs played with more effort, and Utah missed a butt-ton of openish looks. In the last Jazz game, they hit every one of those shots until true garbage time. Combine that with Gay getting 23 points rather than zero like on Tuesday, and you get the main explanation for the score. Obviously, whatever makes the guys play with more heart and focus should form the basis of any adjustments. If that means playing White rather than Cun, then go with that. The main benefit of Dante is that he consistently tries on defense, which is something few guys on the roster can say. If effort is no longer an issue, then playing guys for things like scoring and spacing makes some sense. Dunno if the team can rely on Gay with his health in flux, though.

    Other things:

    Aldridge shooting so well from range really helped neutralize Gobert, who had only one block in 34 minutes despite the Spurs attacking the paint many times over the course of the game. Dude did threaten a triple-double with a Jazz-high seven assists, but LMA did what he has to do for the Spurs to reach their potential: be the best big on the floor. Gobert is also in a stretch of obvious frustration with the team's performance, though homeboy is signed for two more years after this one and isn't going anywhere. Still something to watch going forward.

    White guarded Ingles for most of the time both were on the court. I do think that's a good adjustment for the Spurs. Joe has PF size, but he plays with a guard skill-set and isn't selfish, so him having a mismatch doesn't result in the same crisis that it should. Difference between Ingles and Diaw is that Boris knew when he had the best shot and wouldn't hesitate to score when it was his turn. Diaw loved passing and did it a lot, but give that dude a mismatch in the post, and he was scoring the ball or drawing help. Ingles passed up multiple layups for kick-outs. Teams will exploit that in the playoffs.

    It's hard to say if the Spurs played successfully against Utah's back court. On the one hand, the two guys combined for 53 of their team's 97 points. On the other hand, they shot 19/46, which is actually worse than the rest of their team shot (18/39). The gameplan always has to be to make Rubio score, but he's had decent success in doing so against SA over the past couple of years. The Spurs did a good job of neutralizing his passing ability, but allowing 26 points to a non-scorer isn't a great plan to win. Mitc had a stretch where he tried to take over the game, and over all, he scored 27 points on 28 possessions. As mentioned in the OP, Gay did a decent job holding him off to preserve the win. White should have been the guy on Mitc tonight, but the others didn't get too hurt by it due to Don falling back to Earth this year.

    This game also gives a good look at how the Spurs were planning on playing offense with Murray. They have better spacing right now, but they were going to play shooters regardless. What I'm talking about is the pace the team had offensively, beating the Jazz down the floor with look-ahead passes and running duck-in post-up plays to get Gay good looks. It's easier to make up for the lack of outside shooting when everyone is moving toward the basket rather than waiting for everyone to set up and attacking off a high PnR. I've been clamoring for this type of fast-post attack for years, and I'm glad to see it used now, even if it's not for Aldridge. All in all, the downhill style doesn't seem to jive with LMA's and DMDR's comfort zones. They can fit that offense, but their games prioritize half-court isos. I'm interested in seeing if they can keep it up.

    Eubanks was active for this game, while Ben Moore was not. That's weird to me, given that they were missing two forwards. Moore has 45 games of eligibility for the big club (though that might be less depending on exactly how the CBA counts "active days"). They've played 27 games as it is, so there are only 55 games left in the season. There simply isn't all that much time left to worry about him sitting out. If being down two rotational guys isn't enough of a reason to bring a guy over, what is? Metu wasn't god awful or anything (though I wouldn't have called him good -- he only played six minutes for a reason), but this was a perfect game to give the guy some run. The Spurs are going to be in position to make some big roster moves after about another week. Ben shouldn't stop them from trading for a legit starting F if one is on the table, but he could be a factor in whether they could include Pon or Cun in a trade or whether they'd need to acquire a depth forward if someone is sent out. The way the team's handled that two-way spot this whole year has been odd.
    Good observations. Frankly to me, the game was decided bc Utah had a very bad start. They settled for a lot of jump shots when the 3 wasn’t falling. Donovan specially was chucking jumpers while ice cold. IIRC he was scoreless the entire half. I remember thinking at halftime it was a 15 point lead but it was unlikely Donovan was going to remain scoreless the entire game. Sure enough they told him to draw fouls and not settle for jumpers so much and he’s proceeded to go to work in the second half.

    You already know that IMO Forbes is the weak link in the SL, but there’s nothing that’s going to be done about it. Pop sat him down when the Jazz were rallying and that was the right call and the end for easy baskets for Jazz. Pop needs to have a shorter leash with him. I’d hope he gets less minutes going forward but unless Walker was going to start getting opportunities I don’t know how PATFO accomplishes that. The more the little dude has a hot hand the more Pop will continue to trust his net negative presence. Rudy Gay heroics sealed the deal but it probably would have been a tougher end with Forbes to close out the game.

  3. #28
    Veteran RC_Drunkford's Avatar
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    I've written this year off as a transition season, so all I'm really looking for are positive signs for next year. White's Defense and all around development, Poeltl's comfort level, and DeRozen's growth as a distributor are all good ones...
    I wish cap space was part of that transition

  4. #29
    Unstoppable TDomination's Avatar
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    Thanks for the grades Timvp i always enjoy them.

    I'm happy to see us put solid back to back performances finally. After Patty mentioned of having fun after that lakers game, i'm hoping they can continue to have fun with winning these next few home games.

  5. #30
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
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    Disagree as I think he's a good fit in any lineup, either next to LMA or Poetl. Him and Rudy should be the 4 with Cunningham getting 0-5 mins a night. I think Rudy is probably at his best going 25ish minutes a game and the rest should go to Davis. I mean if Bertans is a 10-12min a night player than I don't know what you'd consider Beli tbh
    I think they're both situational players, ideally. If we were deeper that's where I think they would both fall. There are certain matchups that Bertans is a good fit, and certain ones where is isn't. If his shot isn't falling he isn't really great for much else; he's not a rebounder and not a great defender. He gets pushed around in the paint and still finds himself out of position a lot. He's not great at creating his own shot. I like the guy, but he shouldn't be relied upon to do much more than shoot at this point in his development.

    Belinelli has disappointed. He can't defend, we know that, but I expected to see a smart, heady offensive player who could help the Spurs on that side of the ball. To me his play has improved as of late, but still disappointing so far.

    To Bertans credit, he has hurt the Spurs less than Belli has, but Davis's game is one-dimensional right now. I love his spirit and his shooting touch, but he's got to improve the rest of his game...which I think he's trying to do.

  6. #31
    R.C. Deez Nuts. Mugen's Avatar
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    I think they're both situational players, ideally. If we were deeper that's where I think they would both fall. There are certain matchups that Bertans is a good fit, and certain ones where is isn't. If his shot isn't falling he isn't really great for much else; he's not a rebounder and not a great defender. He gets pushed around in the paint and still finds himself out of position a lot. He's not great at creating his own shot. I like the guy, but he shouldn't be relied upon to do much more than shoot at this point in his development.

    Belinelli has disappointed. He can't defend, we know that, but I expected to see a smart, heady offensive player who could help the Spurs on that side of the ball. To me his play has improved as of late, but still disappointing so far.

    To Bertans credit, he has hurt the Spurs less than Belli has, but Davis's game is one-dimensional right now. I love his spirit and his shooting touch, but he's got to improve the rest of his game...which I think he's trying to do.
    Agree with pretty much most of your points, but it's just really slim pickings with this roster. We don't have enough good players to relegate either guy to a situational role.

    Sounds like I'm a little higher on Bertans than you but he's definitely one-dimensional (we have 4-5 guys that are completely one-dimensional and a few that i consider zero-dimensional tbh). I just think his shooting is elite level and that he has to play big minutes for this roster to maximize its potential especially since we feature Derozan and Lamarcus....

    In my ideal world, Bertans, White, and Poetl are locked in for 25 minutes a night tbh....

  7. #32
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    I think they're both situational players, ideally. If we were deeper that's where I think they would both fall. There are certain matchups that Bertans is a good fit, and certain ones where is isn't. If his shot isn't falling he isn't really great for much else; he's not a rebounder and not a great defender. He gets pushed around in the paint and still finds himself out of position a lot. He's not great at creating his own shot. I like the guy, but he shouldn't be relied upon to do much more than shoot at this point in his development.

    Belinelli has disappointed. He can't defend, we know that, but I expected to see a smart, heady offensive player who could help the Spurs on that side of the ball. To me his play has improved as of late, but still disappointing so far.

    To Bertans credit, he has hurt the Spurs less than Belli has, but Davis's game is one-dimensional right now. I love his spirit and his shooting touch, but he's got to improve the rest of his game...which I think he's trying to do.
    I honestly have no idea why Belinelli takes the most ridiculous of balanced shots. His shots are also flat without any arc. What the is he thinking? What is the coaching staff thinking with this kind of shot selection.

    The only plus of Belielli is that he moves very well without the ball.

    I would prefer PATFO invest in player development. Give time to the young guys. We don't need to see Cunningham on the court at all. Just give his time to Metu instead, let him learn on the job.

  8. #33
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
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    Agree with pretty much most of your points, but it's just really slim pickings with this roster. We don't have enough good players to relegate either guy to a situational role.

    Sounds like I'm a little higher on Bertans than you but he's definitely one-dimensional (we have 4-5 guys that are completely one-dimensional and a few that i consider zero-dimensional tbh). I just think his shooting is elite level and that he has to play big minutes for this roster to maximize its potential especially since we feature Derozan and Lamarcus....

    In my ideal world, Bertans, White, and Poetl are locked in for 25 minutes a night tbh....
    With this roster, you're probably right.

  9. #34
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    Great write-up and really fun game. After our very poor start where we missed about 10 shots in a row and shot 25% I was worried. Jazz didn't shoot great either, but nothing like that. I believe the we hit 25% they were shooting 43%. Luckily we improved and our Big 3 had a good night. Poeltl and Patty had some good minutes and Forbes picked a good time to score. However it was Gay that really sealed it...as you said. He was clutch!

  10. #35
    Born Slippy
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    Top deffensive effort from a team standpoint. Gotta continue it if spurs want to win.

    As Chinook pointed out, what will get overlooked is how Rudy Goberts impact was lessened because of LaMarcus's offense. One thing for sure, it safe to say His jumper is back. The only reason he didnt finish was the fifth foul.

  11. #36
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    Great write-up and really fun game. After our very poor start where we missed about 10 shots in a row and shot 25% I was worried. Jazz didn't shoot great either, but nothing like that. I believe the we hit 25% they were shooting 43%. Luckily we improved and our Big 3 had a good night. Poeltl and Patty had some good minutes and Forbes picked a good time to score. However it was Gay that really sealed it...as you said. He was clutch!
    Gay when healthy in the Spurs system is pure gold.

  12. #37
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    The only plus of Belielli is that he moves very well without the ball.

    I would prefer PATFO invest in player development. Give time to the young guys. We don't need to see Cunningham on the court at all. Just give his time to Metu instead, let him learn on the job.
    Exactly. But without Marco, we have nobody who is a natural at moving off-ball.

    Or cut Cunningham and bring up Moore. I think we need to see him with the mothership.

  13. #38
    Veteran spurs10's Avatar
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    Gay when healthy in the Spurs system is pure gold.
    Can't disagree with that!

  14. #39
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    - Poeltl improved a LOT. Enough for him to start at the five if they want to go back to the lineup with two bigs, while Gasol can lead the bench mob (he will be above average vs almost any other 2nd unit).
    Can't see Poeltl & LA playing together. Will be a disaster on both ends. On defense we will be killed by long-balls. On offense Poeltl can't play at 3pt line like Gasol can; Poeltl doesn't have Gasol's passing & shooting.
    It's a weird roster construction when we have like 3 out of 7 our best players at Center so only 1 can play at a time and only 2 can play at all.

  15. #40
    Believe. Spurs fever's Avatar
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    I would have loved to see what Pop could have done with Rudy in his prime.

  16. #41
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    TIMVP, if/when Lonnie comes back, will he be enough of an upgrade over Forbes to boost us into the playoffs, or does his rookie-ness equal a weakness on par with Forbes defense, lacl of athleticism, etc?
    Counting on him to be even an upgrade over Forbes is wishful thinking, tbh. He's so young and raw that you'd play him mostly to just get experience and build for the future. It's doubtful that a 19-year-old not named Luka Doncic will be ready to help you win NBA basketball games right away.

    Lonnie has something that I consider more important: the ability to run the pick and roll and create open shots for others (I believe he will be able to do this on the main team faster than expected if given the opportunity), and he and White seem like guys who know the time to cut to the basket taking advantage of the defensive flaws (it will be another addition on the offensive side),defensively it seems to be at least one level up
    I don't think Walker will be a playmaker until later in his career. He can create opportunities with his athleticism but he's had minuscule assist numbers at every level even though at Miami he spent time at point guard due to injuries.

    I do agree that he can use his athleticism to force defenses to account for him him. He could theoretically provide defensive energy but to expect a 19-year-old to be an even average defender is, again, wishful thinking.

    And adding to your question: Is Lonnie capable of consistently shooting and making 3s?
    I'm a Forbes hater but he at least his only skill which is shooting is a must from this position in our starting line-up since our two start don't shoot 3s at all.
    Doubtful Walker is a three-point shooter in year one. I'd be happy if he's even a 33 percent shooter from deep as a rookie. A betting man would be wise to take the under, though.

  17. #42
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    White should have been on Mitc as soon as he was getting it going in the 3rd and then switched to Rubio in the 4th
    I wanted White on Mitc . Rubio going off was partially by design because the Spurs weren't sending any help (the other part is no perimeter defender on the team outside of maybe White can keep a player in front of him consistently).

    Something I haven't liked for awhile but happens too much including last night's game is "point Rudy" where Gay decides to he's taking over as point guard and is abetted by some of the other players. I hate that it takes the ball from White and usually it's a few possessions of stagnant, no scoring basketball.

    Pop needs to cut that out and make sure the other guys get the ball to White or DeRozan if he's on the court, though this usually happens without him.
    Quality observation.

    I don't mind Point Rudy when the alternative is Forbes or Mills struggling to bring the ball up the court. I do agree that him taking the ball away from DeRozan or White is usually not a good idea. But in the rare games like last night where Gay is moving well, I don't mind him getting as many touches as possible.

  18. #43
    Veteran tbdog's Avatar
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    I would prefer PATFO invest in player development. Give time to the young guys. We don't need to see Cunningham on the court at all. Just give his time to Metu instead, let him learn on the job.
    Metu is not ready. Spurs were without Cunningham, Bertans and Gasol, yet Metu only got 6mins. And he wasn't that good in those 6 mins apart from that one good handoff.

  19. #44
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    Doubtful Walker is a three-point shooter in year one. I'd be happy if he's even a 33 percent shooter from deep as a rookie. A betting man would be wise to take the under, though.
    Thanks! Can't see him in the starting line-up yet then.
    But seeing lots of rookies even not named Doncic being able to contribute right away around the league one can remain hopeful Lonnie will be able to give us at least some defense off the bench.

  20. #45
    Believe.
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    Can't see Poeltl & LA playing together. Will be a disaster on both ends. On defense we will be killed by long-balls. On offense Poeltl can't play at 3pt line like Gasol can; Poeltl doesn't have Gasol's passing & shooting.
    It's a weird roster construction when we have like 3 out of 7 our best players at Center so only 1 can play at a time and only 2 can play at all.
    You're not wrong, but as you said, three of our top7 are bigs and as long as (or rather if) Gasol can still contribute, all of them should get their minutes. As soon as all of our bigs are healthy, LMA should probably not play more than 30 mpg on a regular basis.

  21. #46
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    You're not wrong, but as you said, three of our top7 are bigs and as long as (or rather if) Gasol can still contribute, all of them should get their minutes. As soon as all of our bigs are healthy, LMA should probably not play more than 30 mpg on a regular basis.
    The ideal way would be trading Gasol (Poeltl is more than ready to play 18+ mpg) but considering our mid-season trade history, or rather lack thereof, I really don't see it happening.

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