Any way the Spurs get in on the Anthony Davis conversation!?!

[DAF86]

Anyone who thinks leonard was in the best player in the world conversation when he’s not better than westbrook and harden that year

Talk to Pop, tbh. (1:45 minutes mark).

[DAF86]

You do. The Pelicans have probably had the worst injury luck in his time in the league, including him. They've also been poorly managed. '03 Duncan was an exception to the rule, but there's generally only so much one player can do. Even James didn't win a championship until he was surrounded by multiple other All-Stars and he wouldn't have made the Finals most years if he were in the West.

I'm not talking about winning championships. I'm talking about winning more than 1 playoffs series in 7 years. I'm talking about making the playoffs more than twice in that same time frame.

They don't and even if they did, Leonard has never touched the season Davis is having, is no more a natural offensive hub nor has a strong enough playoff pedigree as one to take precedence.

For their careers:

Kawhi: BPM: 6.2 - VORP: 28.4 - WS/48: .221

Davis: BPM: 4.8 - VORP: 26.9 - WS/48: .215

So tell again, which are these metrics were Davis, "as usual", performs better than Kawhi.

It doesn't matter. The less reliant you are on tools that are bound to age poorly, the better you're likely to age. James, Durant, Leonard, etc. are different than Bryant, Wade, Ginobili, etc. though because they're all essentially half bigs.

Between Leonard and Davis I would say that AD is the one that relies more on tools that will age poorly, tbh.

No, Pop said it because he was biased and being a prisoner of the moment. There hasn't been a legit discussion in 11 years.

Do you really see Pop as the knee jerk type? He's usually very reserved, and doesn't seem like the kind to overpraise his own. Heck, I don't think I have ever heard Pop say Duncan was the best player in the World (although I want to believe he must have said it sometime).

[TD 21]

I'm not talking about winning championships. I'm talking about winning more than 1 playoffs series in 7 years. I'm talking about making the playoffs more than twice in that same time frame.



For their careers:

Kawhi: BPM: 6.2 - VORP: 28.4 - WS/48: .221

Davis: BPM: 4.8 - VORP: 26.9 - WS/48: .215

So tell again, which are these metrics were Davis, "as usual", performs better than Kawhi.



Between Leonard and Davis I would say that AD is the one that relies more on tools that will age poorly, tbh.



Do you really see Pop as the knee jerk type? He's usually very reserved, and doesn't seem like the kind to overpraise his own. Heck, I don't think I have ever heard Pop say Duncan was the best player in the World (although I want to believe he must have said it sometime).

I know and I don't disagree, but the injuries, poor roster construction and being in the West have been by far the biggest reasons for that. It's not because of some inherent flaw.

Context: Davis has had to carry his franchise from day 1. Leonard had to for 1 season ('16-'17). Had Leonard had that responsibility throughout, a bunch of his career metrics wouldn't look as good as they do now.

Pop called Duncan the best player in the world sometime in the early 00s.

[DAF86]

I know and I don't disagree, but the injuries, poor roster construction and being in the West have been by far the biggest reasons for that. It's not because of some inherent flaw.

Untill proven otherwise, we won't ever know.

Context: Davis has had to carry his franchise from day 1. Leonard had to for 1 season ('16-'17). Had Leonard had that responsibility throughout, a bunch of his career metrics wouldn't look as good as they do now.

Well, you didn't talk about context when you made your original comment. You just said: "as usual, Davis is having better metrics" which is a lie, because Davis doesn't "usually" tend to have better metrics than Kawhi.

Also, I would argue that having lesser teammates, and therefore lesser replacements, tends to help you with stats like BPM and VORP.

Pop called Duncan the best player in the world, sometime in the early 00s.

And he was right. It wasn't a knee jerk reaction.

[TD 21]

Untill proven otherwise, we won't ever know.



Well, you didn't talk about context when you Made your original comment. You just said: "as usual, Davis is having better metrics" whic is a lie, because Davis doesn't tend to have better metrics than Kawhi.



And he was right. It wasn't a knee jerk reaction.

We will because of common sense. No one as good as him is only capable of 1 playoff series win and 2 playoff appearances in 6 seasons because of some inherent flaw with them.

I haven't been around in a few weeks; even greatness gets rusty. I forgot that the vast majority either doesn't know better, doesn't factor that in or both.

He was never better than James for the simple fact that the latter possesses the most important skill in the game and the one he doesn't: the ability to make his teammates better.

[Leetonidas]

Funny seeing that Pop spoke with Demps (supposedly) and told him not to cave to LA Popblocked

[callo1]

No chance of AD, Magic and the media has already made their play. 50k fine is a joke.

Magic can always hide behind the national media and let them do his bidding.

Check this article out: https://www.complex.com/sports/2019/...-anthony-davis

I checked articles author out. He would have you believe he is a Knicks fan, but he calls LA his home.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/adam-caparell-b9a36762

The fix is always in, even when you don't know about it. It all comes down to the Benjamins. Just ask the Saints.

Did you know that the New Orleans Saints market is 30th in the NFL, while the Chiefs is 27th.

For comparisons sake, New England has the 2nd largest NFL market, while the resurgent Rams have the 2nd largest overall sports market.

So say the Saints and Chiefs would have met in the Superbowl...2 small markets sharing the same time zones. Great revenue for the NFL which has see its ratings drop 9.7 percent since last year. It simply wasn't allowed to happen. Anyone who thinks those games had accidental blown calls is a fool.

[DAF86]

We will because of common sense. No one as good as him is only capable of 1 playoff series win and 2 playoff appearances in 6 seasons because of some inherent flaw with them.

Maybe he has leadership problems, maybe him being constantly in and out of lineups with recurring injuries s up with his teammates rythm. Maybe he's just an empty stats guy like Kevin Love back in the day. Untill he proves he can win consistently, we will never know.

I haven't been around in a few weeks; even greatness gets rusty. I forgot that the vast majority either doesn't know better, doesn't factor that in or both.

Poor attempt at a cop out, tbh.

Also, don't worry, I know just as good as anyone, tbh.

He was never better than James for the simple fact that the latter possesses the most important skill in the game and the one he doesn't: the ability to make his teammates better.

I have never ranked Kawhi ahead of Lebron but I could definitely see point of people thinking that back in 2017. That's how good Kawhi was that year. So yeah, he was "arguably" the best player in the World.

[TD 21]

Maybe he has leadership problems, maybe him constantly being in and out of lineups with recurring injuries s up with his teammates rythm. Maybe he's just an empty stats guy like Kevin Love back in the day. Untill he proves he can win consistently, we will never know.



Poor attempt at a cop out, tbh.

Also, don't worry, I know just as good as anyone, tbh.



I have never ranked Kawhi ahead of Lebron but I could definitely see point of people thinking that back in 2017. That's how good Kawhi was that year. So yeah, he was "arguably" the best player in the World.

Then the same applies to Leonard, who's resume as a lead player, on better teams, isn't much better. Matter fact, he has 2 playoff series wins, 1 against the injury decimated Grizzlies and the other against the declining Grizzlies.

You should be familiar enough with my work to know that I'd be well aware of easily accessible numbers before bringing them up. I'm nothing if not thorough.

Never. No one has been since '07 Duncan.

To be clear, we're splitting hairs here between Davis and Leonard. I'm certainly not suggesting he's in another stratosphere.

[Spurs da champs]

Anyone who thinks leonard was in the best player in the world conversation when he’s not better than westbrook and harden that year

you really think Westbrook>Leonard that year?

[DAF86]

Then the same applies to Leonard, who's resume as a lead player, on better teams, isn't much better. Matter fact, he has 12 playoff series wins, 1 against the injury decimated Grizzlies and the other against the declining Grizzlies.

Kawhi has the best winning % ever as a player. There's no way to compare that to one playoffs series win in 7 years.

You should be familiar enough with my work to know that I'd be well aware of easily accessible numbers before bringing them up. I'm nothing if not thorough.

Well, you dropped the ball on this one.

To be clear, we're splitting hairs here between Davis and Leonard. I'm certainly not suggesting he's in another stratosphere.

Really? the way you worded this:

- Davis is definitely better than Leonard right now and save for a blip 2 seasons ago, always has been. Until proven otherwise, only playoff James is definitively better than him.

Gave me another impression, tbh.

[TD 21]

Kawhi has the best winning % ever as a player. There's no way to compare that to one playoffs series win in 7 years.



Well, you dropped the ball on this one.



Really, the way you worded this:



Gave me another impression, tbh.

As a lead player.

Without giving it much thought, I think he's better, but not drastically so.

[Uriel]

I stand by the statement that if the Pelicans had ever offered Davis for Kawhi, the Spurs pull the trigger instantaneously.

Well, timvp does have insider info so I doubt he's just speculating when he says that.

[DAF86]

As a lead player.

Without giving it much thought, I think he's better, but not drastically so.

Kawhi's winning % as a leader is even better than his overall winning %, tbh. He has two 60+ wins seasons under his belt on that role.

[skin27]

you really think Westbrook>Leonard that year?

yes!! That’s why westbrook won the mvp

[skin27]

you really think Westbrook>Leonard that year?

yes!! That’s why westbrook won the mvp

[Russ]

I stand by the statement that if the Pelicans had ever offered Davis for Kawhi, the Spurs pull the trigger instantaneously.

I can't believe anyone would debate this.

Apart from the statistical analysis, in the real world, does anyone doubt that each and every NBA GM would consider it a no-brainer to trade Kawhi for AD?

[toki9]

I think Pop talking to Dell Demps is really much ado about nothing. Demps got his NBA FO career started in San Antonio. Demps probably still talks to Pop/RC for advice, etc., and that's probably what happened. Demps turning to Pop for some advice, and the media turning that into Pop trying to screw over the Lakers rather than just giving an old friend some advice based on his own experience.

[lmbebo]

heard it on NBA radio on drive home, might be reported by Woj. That Pels are saying that they aren't trading AD by the trade deadline unless they are blown away by a can't miss trade.

[R. DeMurre]

Kind of funny that Jahlil Okafor, now starting, just completed the best 5 game streak of his career, posting an average of:

21.2 ppg
11 rpg
2.6 bpg
74.6% FG%

[TheGreatYacht]

Overrated stat padder on a ty team. Minny Kevin Love with a unibrow. Okafor and Randle can put up 20 a night on that paper thin team...

Tired of always being right.

[lmbebo]

Kind of funny that Jahlil Okafor, now starting, just completed the best 5 game streak of his career, posting an average of:

21.2 ppg
11 rpg
2.6 bpg
74.6% FG%

Offensive talent was always there. It was the early trouble he got into. The lack of speed and defense as well. But I'm happy he's getting an opportunity to show what he can do. Only thing I think is a fluke is the FG%. Won't stay that high. Otherwise, I think the rest of the numbers are easily numbers he could maintain going forward.

All things considered, NO could still get production from the center spot. He's no AD. But he's no Chuck Nevitt.

[R. DeMurre]

I think Pop talking to Dell Demps is really much ado about nothing. Demps got his NBA FO career started in San Antonio. Demps probably still talks to Pop/RC for advice, etc., and that's probably what happened. Demps turning to Pop for some advice, and the media turning that into Pop trying to screw over the Lakers rather than just giving an old friend some advice based on his own experience.

I dunno... Pop just dealt with essentially the same issue and sent Kawhi East instead of his preferred destination in the West, and I could see him making the argument that giving in to demands of a player under contract sets a bad precedent for GMs. LeBron is 34 now, and every little delay put in his way lessens the chance of the Lakers building a team that could challenge for a ring. I guess I would just phrase it as "trying to prevent another superteam" as opposed to "trying to screw over" the Lakers because of a vendetta.

[Russ]

. . . as opposed to "trying to screw over" the Lakers because of a vendetta.

No one needs to "screw over" the Lakers.

They consistently do that themselves.

[toki9]

I dunno... Pop just dealt with essentially the same issue and sent Kawhi East instead of his preferred destination in the West, and I could see him making the argument that giving in to demands of a player under contract sets a bad precedent for GMs. LeBron is 34 now, and every little delay put in his way lessens the chance of the Lakers building a team that could challenge for a ring. I guess I would just phrase it as "trying to prevent another superteam" as opposed to "trying to screw over" the Lakers because of a vendetta.

Or Pop pointing out that the same deals will still be available in July when the Celtics can officially make their offer. Doing a deal now under pressure just limits the Pels' options. Waiting it out is better for the franchise and that should be the priority, not pleasing the player who wants to leave.