Bulls: Compare Jordan at age 34 to Lebron at age 34.

[DMC]

IMO? No. I have him in Top 10


Shaq, Duncan, Kobe & James is a great debate

You cannot compare James to Kobe, and Tim and Shaq are bigs.

There's a reason Lebron/MJ discussion is legit, while the others you mention are only compared to Mike by homer fans of the respective player.

[HarlemHeat37]

Dumb comparison..

Dad Killer at the same point of his career as LeBron when he beat a 73-win team with 0 All-Stars and overcame a 3-1 lead(and then led teams to the Finals in the subsequent 2 years): missed the playoffs in consecutive years in the worst conference in NBA history

LeBron has the mileage of a 45-year old player, I don't know why people expect more of him, he's finished as an elite player..he'll probably come back strong next season after getting rest for the first time in 10 years, but he's not going to win another le..

[DMC]

You don't have to slight MJ to credit Lebron.

Lebron never had a good coach. He was never part of a "system". He was dropped into the league as if he was constructed in a workshop to exacting specs, and people seem to think he didn't work for any of it. MJ wasn't heralded like James was, never labeled himself "The Chosen One", and so didn't have to live up to a bar set too high by himself and the media. MJ came around in an era where media hype was limited to a few broadcasters. James was bigger than life before he graduated HS. People remember MJ fondly, even if they lost to him, because he epitomized "don't quit" and was the consummate winner on and off the court. James brought his teammates along with him when he won, and when he left they basically sunk back into oblivion. This happened in Cleveland twice and in Miami once. James has been cursed/blessed by the narrative of getting a cursed city to the promised land. While he doesn't possess the sheer "kill your own father" mentality that MJ does, Lebron's mark has been undoubtedly his business a en and the ability to keep his nose clean even while playing at a high level year after year and being in the hottest part of the spotlight constantly.

We've never seen anyone like Lebron and we had never seen anyone like Mike. Lebron isn't like Mike, but Lebron is the greatest basketball player that's ever played the game if you consider all aspects of the game and his tenure and results on multiple teams. We'll never know if Mike could have taken another team to the Finals. He would never have left Chicago to play on one but he also had the fortune of having ownership that brought in players to compliment his game, and a coach that knew how to coach him. Lebron had Mike Brown, Eric Spoelstra, David Blatt, T-Lue and Luke Walton. Perhaps a great coach couldn't coach Lebron, but we'll never know. Imagine Lebron with cerebral teammates instead of that he had that didn't even know the situation, and dribbled the clock out. Or a teammate that wouldn't choke two FTs in the most clutch moment. Lebron never had a stacked team other than Miami, but even in Miami they weren't built well rounded enough to be dominant. They were just all really good players, some past their primes and had the fortune to play in the East.

I think too much is said about Lebron being in the East and how he cannot compete in the West. The Lakers were middle of the playoff picture before Lebron got injured, and they quickly fell out of the race. Now they are struggling to regain the drive, but if they do regain it and reel off 5 or 6 in a row and sneak in, will anyone here really be surprised?

[HarlemHeat37]

Jordan was a great player, but his rings were mostly a product of timing and cir stance..there are 20-30 perimeter players that could have replaced him and still won at least 3 les with Phil, Scottie and their elite system/defense..

Definitely would have won 6: LeBron, Durant, Curry, Clyde Drexler, Kobe, Wade, McGrady, Pippen(if you cloned him), Dr. J, Isiah, Magic

Definitely at least 4: Giannis, Iverson, Kawhi, Vince Carter, George Gervin

Likely at least a few: Paul Pierce, Harden, Reggie Miller, Dominique Wilkins, Manu Ginobili, Mitch Richmond, Ray Allen, James Worthy, Bernard King

Probably others I'm forgetting, as well..

[djohn2oo8]

Jordan was a great player, but his rings were mostly a product of timing and cir stance..there are 20-30 perimeter players that could have replaced him and still won at least 3 les with Phil, Scottie and their elite system/defense..

Definitely would have won 6: LeBron, Durant, Curry, Clyde Drexler, Kobe, Wade, McGrady, Pippen(if you cloned him), Dr. J, Isiah, Magic

Definitely at least 4: Giannis, Iverson, Kawhi, Vince Carter, George Gervin

Likely at least a few: Paul Pierce, Harden, Reggie Miller, Dominique Wilkins, Manu Ginobili, Mitch Richmond, Ray Allen, James Worthy, Bernard King

Probably others I'm forgetting, as well..

2 of LeBron’s rings were a result of colluding. Because he couldn’t beat Boston otherwise

[Ghazi]

Harlem's meltdown.


Lebron wouldn't have won 6 rings in Jordan's shoes.

[Ghazi]

Jordan would have 4 rings in Lebron's shoes ... Lebron would have 4-5 in Jordan's shoes but certainly not 6.

[djohn2oo8]

One of the things that separates the two

[HarlemHeat37]

Based on what?

Jordan never accomplished anything from a team perspective without Phil Jackson..I'd still rank him in my top 3 all-time without Phil since I don't care about rings in any sport, but he owes his rings to the God Phil Jackson..

[djohn2oo8]

Based on what?

Jordan never accomplished anything from a team perspective without Phil Jackson..I'd still rank him in my top 3 all-time without Phil since I don't care about rings in any sport, but he owes his rings to the God Phil Jackson..

Did Phil lace em up on the court?

[HarlemHeat37]

Did Phil lace em up on the court?

So you think it's a coincidence that Jordan never reached the Finals without Phil(and won less than 40 games like 5 times and missed the playoffs in several seasons), yet Phil went to the Lakers and won 5 championships? Stop

[djohn2oo8]

So you think it's a coincidence that Jordan never reached the Finals without Phil(and won less than 40 games like 5 times and missed the playoffs in several seasons), yet Phil went to the Lakers and won 5 championships? Stop

So which is it? Because first it was Pippen and now the goalpost have been moved to Phil. Pretty sure Phil also needed all time greats to win as a coach.

[djohn2oo8]

Phil has Shaq, Kobe, Gasol and Bynum in LA. Remind me what he won when Jordan retired the first time?

[FrostKing]

You cannot compare James to Kobe, and Tim and Shaq are bigs.

There's a reason Lebron/MJ discussion is legit, while the others you mention are only compared to Mike by homer fans of the respective player.

Because James is the most recent. He'll have a disappointing end to his career just like the rest and in 5 years we'll be making "MJ or Zion" threads. There is nothing special with James versus Kobe except for time span.

[DMC]

Because James is the most recent. He'll have a disappointing end to his career just like the rest and in 5 years we'll be making "MJ or Zion" threads. There is nothing special with James versus Kobe except for time span.

Wishcasting kills debate

[HarlemHeat37]

So which is it? Because first it was Pippen and now the goalpost have been moved to Phil. Pretty sure Phil also needed all time greats to win as a coach.

The goal posts have moved? I mentioned both in the first post

[djohn2oo8]

The goal posts have moved? I mentioned both in the first post

And it works both ways. Pippen did what without Jordan? He was pretty much a cancer outside of Chicago when he left

[DMC]

Phil has Shaq, Kobe, Gasol and Bynum in LA. Remind me what he won when Jordan retired the first time?

Remind me what any of those you mentioned won without Phil.

[djohn2oo8]

Remind me what any of those you mentioned won without Phil.

Didnt Shaq ring in Miami?

[djohn2oo8]

Damn fat hands.

[djohn2oo8]

Oh yeah. Phil also had multiple finals losses after coaching Jordan. Including losing to Larry Brown and Doc Rivers

[FrostKing]

Wishcasting kills debate

What killed MJ vs Kobe debates? Bryant's poor career finish. James is right on que to duplicate.

[DMC]

Oh yeah. Phil also had multiple finals losses after coaching Jordan. Including losing to Larry Brown and Doc Rivers

Phil is an overrated coach. He's still echelons better than anything Lebron ever had.

[HarlemHeat37]

What killed MJ vs Kobe debates? Bryant's poor career finish. James is right on que to duplicate.

That's not why, nobody even remembers that Jordan missed the playoffs in consecutive years in the worst East in NBA history once he finally player without Phil and Scottie..

Kobe would have easily won 6 if he replaced Jordan

Jordan will never be surpassed in team accolades, nobody will ever come close due to cir stances that will never occur again..social media dissects everything(also, Jordan could have never gotten away with playing a part in the murder of his father today), Free Agency and huge money prevents continuity and long runs, and most importantly, there will never be another time in the history of basketball where white American players play a prominent role in the league..the Utah Jazz reached consecutive Finals with 6 white American rotation players, that's just unfair, it's the equivalence of playing against today's High School players..

[DMC]

What killed MJ vs Kobe debates? Bryant's poor career finish. James is right on que to duplicate.

There was never a Kobe/MJ debate by anyone other than Kobestans. Giving up 3 consecutive Finals MVPs to Shaq killed that right away.