11 people shot in garlic festival

[Chucho]

I expect you could be right about the actuarial truth of the matter regarding mortality, Chucho but that isn't what I referenced. I believe I asked which was the greater threat to public order.

How common are vehicular homicides committed by teenagers versus intentional shootings? Regardless of the ratio, it might be reasonable to restrict the access of teens to guns for reasons of public safety.

How many of the teenage gunmen owned the guns they murdered with? If someone wants something, they're going to do whatever they can to get it. This is why there is still mass gun violence on the streets and in urban areas. Kids can access a vehicle and booze a whole lot easier than they can a gun.

That said, I'm not trivializing the need to prevent teenagers from buying weapons or minimizing the issue. Just saying, especially in this society, people will do what they want if they want to badly enough.

[TSA]

It might be reasonable to restrict the access of teenagers to guns regardless of which is the bigger threat.

I’m not disagreeing, but it was you who asked which was the bigger threat.

[Winehole23]

How many of the teenage gunmen owned the guns they murdered with? If someone wants something, they're going to do whatever they can to get it. This is why there is still mass gun violence on the streets and in urban areas. Kids can access a vehicle and booze a whole lot easier than they can a gun.

That said, I'm not trivializing the need to prevent teenagers from buying weapons or minimizing the issue. Just saying, especially in this society, people will do what they want if they want to badly enough.

All fair points.

That said, being unable to prevent the -bent doesn't mean we should do nothing to make it more difficult for them to wreak mayhem.

[Chucho]

What do you want to call it? Didn't you use crazed or insane at some point?

I'll use whatever term you want. It won't change where those people are. Households with guns.

You're equating gun ownership to crazy to frame it fit your speculation and there's nothing to support your speculation aside from correlation. There's correlation between LGBTQs and suicide. There's correlation between blacks and not wanting to work. There's correlation between a lot of political hot topics, but that doesnt drive the argument all the way home like you're trying to here.

[Winehole23]

I’m not disagreeing, but it was you who asked which was the bigger threat.

Well then we agree.

[Pavlov]

You're equating gun ownership to crazy to frame it fit your speculation and there's nothing to support your speculation aside from correlation. There's correlation between LGBTQs and suicide. There's correlation between blacks and not wanting to work. There's correlation between a lot of political hot topics, but that doesnt drive the argument all the way home like you're trying to here.

No, I'm saying the mass shooters are people from households with guns. Period.

Full stop. That's where they are and that percentage of households has been shrinking while the number of mass shootings has increased.

What you make of that is your deal. But these people are where they are and that's where their guns are.

[Chucho]

No, I'm saying the mass shooters are people from households with guns. Period.

Full stop. That's where they are and that percentage of households has been shrinking while the number of mass shootings has increased.

What you make of that is your deal. But these people are where they are and that's where their guns are.

You interjected into the conversation when the point is WHY are there so many crazy shooters when access to guns is harder and gun ownership is down. You said you pinpointed where all the "crazy" is concentrated and are making a simple correlation. My assertion is there is an issue inherent to American culture that makes the issue about the gun and not the people, hence you're stuck on "gun owners = crazy", you've changed the reason for your original interjection.

[Chucho]

So, back to the original course of topic; what makes gun owners more crazy today than back when access was easier and ownership was thicker?

[boutons_deux]

Yet another one of You People, extreme rightwing hater/racist terrorist

[TSA]

So, back to the original course of topic; what makes gun owners more crazy today than back when access was easier and ownership was thicker?

I don’t think gun owners are any more crazy than back in the day, I think there are more crazies concocting a plan to murder a large amount of people and than seeking out guns. I know the shooters actually owned the gun but I think you get what I’m saying.

I too want to know what is driving the recent e in mass shootings. Just saying guns and then legislating around that obviously hasn’t worked.

[boutons_deux]

The number of mass shootings by crazy people from de facto households with guns is increasing while the percentage of households with guns has been trending downwards the last 40 years.

The overall firearm homicide rate has gone down while the percentage of households with guns has also gone down.

May just be correlation and not causation, but the mass shooting crazy is in a smaller number of households -- the ones with guns.

Because there are guns in those households.

guns are public health issue that BigGun has paid Congressional s to block from being studied.

BigGun makes gun policy to enrich itself, slaughter of Americans be damned.

[ElNono]

Wikipedia lists a total of 15 mass shootings for the entire decade of the 70s.

From the same page, there were more deaths from those incidents in the 80's than in the 90's.

But, again, what was even reported as a 'mass shooting' back in the day? The majority of the episodes listed for the 70s are in relatively big cities, and I kinda doubt that's the only place where somebody blew a gasket.

[ElNono]

Considering how few homicides are committed with rifles overall, and then just looking at homicides with rifles by 19 year olds, and then considering 16-19 year olds are the most dangerous group of drivers, the 19 year old with a rental car may actually pose more of a threat to the public

We could make the same argument with terrorism, tbh... "considering how few homicides are committed by 19 year old terrorists (or even not 19 years old) we shouldn't have the TSA"... but it's a poor excuse to do absolutely nothing about it.

[ElNono]

So, back to the original course of topic; what makes gun owners more crazy today than back when access was easier and ownership was thicker?

Exactly, especially now that America is great again! The best economy ever!... just weird, tbh

[Pavlov]

You interjected into the conversation when the point is WHY are there so many crazy shooters when access to guns is harder and gun ownership is down. You said you pinpointed where all the "crazy" is concentrated and are making a simple correlation. My assertion is there is an issue inherent to American culture that makes the issue about the gun and not the people, hence you're stuck on "gun owners = crazy", you've changed the reason for your original interjection.

The American crazy gun owners who are killing people are indeed American gun owners. No real way to spin that.

There are more guns in the hands of fewer people and your assertion is that more of those people are acting crazy than they did before.

[Pavlov]

I don’t think gun owners are any more crazy than back in the day, I think there are more crazies concocting a plan to murder a large amount of people and than seeking out guns. I know the shooters actually owned the gun but I think you get what I’m saying.

I too want to know what is driving the recent e in mass shootings. Just saying guns and then legislating around that obviously hasn’t worked.

But it worked for regular ol' gun homicides if that's your metric, so what are we actually trying to prevent here?

[Spurtacular]

The American crazy gun owners who are killing people are indeed American gun owners. No real way to spin that.

Nice philo. I imagine the majority of murderers in every single country are persons of the country of origin, with the possible exception of a Euro country with Muslim immigrants leading the charge.

[Pavlov]

Nice philo. I imagine the majority of murderers in every single country are persons of the country of origin, with the possible exception of a Euro country with Muslim immigrants leading the charge.

Why are you guys getting upset about that?

That's simply true. The more interesting thing is the concentration of gun ownership and the in crease of what we're just calling crazy. I'm not accusing anyone here of it (especially you since you don't own any guns); it's just damned interesting.

[boutons_deux]

[Proxy]

How many of the teenage gunmen owned the guns they murdered with? If someone wants something, they're going to do whatever they can to get it. This is why there is still mass gun violence on the streets and in urban areas. Kids can access a vehicle and booze a whole lot easier than they can a gun.

That said, I'm not trivializing the need to prevent teenagers from buying weapons or minimizing the issue. Just saying, especially in this society, people will do what they want if they want to badly enough.

Are the guns used in these mass shootings acquired within the networks that gangs use to get their guns? Bull to group the California and Chicago gang related gun violence stats in with these events where innocents are targeted.

[Spurtacular]

Why are you guys getting upset about that?

That's simply true. The more interesting thing is the concentration of gun ownership and the in crease of what we're just calling crazy. I'm not accusing anyone here of it (especially you since you don't own any guns); it's just damned interesting.

Don't on my nothing points.

[Pavlov]

Don't on my nothing points.

So just post about me.

[ducks]

Gun murder rate is higher in AZ.

Thanks to the illegal crossing

[ducks]

Shooter isn't old enough to buy a beer or rent a car, but is old enough to buy a semi-automatic rifle.

How much sense does that make?

Then why can he join the milarty?

[Pavlov]

Thanks to the illegal crossing

More cross illegally in CA.