There was a feud going on with the coach, Chris Ford. Therefore, sensitivities were running high.
I think the reason he was benched was that he missed the plane comming back form the ASG and he missed practice.
I believe he was benched a second time. I don't remember why.
I know. How about this? Start Manu so that he can steal the Jump Ball, wherever it is tipped and go in for the first points of the game...as he has so adeptly learned how to do. Then pull him out after 2 minutes. Then manage them using timvp's formula for rest until the playoffs start.
I'd go for it.
But would the Manu Defenders?
QUESTION.
I think part of the reason he got bashed by the media was what he said after the game, and the way he said it. Here's a quote I found in an old article:
"A lot of people might look at it like it's a selfish thing or something like that," Iverson said. "Why wouldn't I start? I'm the franchise player here. I don't know any franchise players that come off the bench. I don't know any Olympian that comes off the bench. I don't know any All-Star that comes off the bench. I don't know any former MVP that comes off the bench. I don't know any three-time scoring champion that comes off the bench.
"I don't know any first team All-NBA (player) that comes off the bench. Why Allen Iverson? Why should I come off the bench? ... I think it is an insult to me. Who I am as a player, who I am to this organization, who I've been to this organization, that's an insult to me to come off the bench if I'm a starter."
Do you think Manu would say something remotely similar to what AI said?
Actually, when he started coming of the the bench last year to coddle Hedo, he wrote an article which can still be read on his website, where he basically said coming of the bench was not a punishment, that he was going to do what the coach said, etc.
TimVP, comparing what AI did to Manu is just flat out wrong...
IIRC AI refused to come off the bench and said he didn't like his coach...
Manu did come off the bench...
There's a difference between not wanting to do something and actually not doing it because you don't want too...
Manu has never refused to do anything the team has asked of him, he's also never verbally attacked his coach because of a coaching deicsion...
does this mean glen robinson might start
I like Solid's solution.I know. How about this? Start Manu so that he can steal the Jump Ball, wherever it is tipped and go in for the first points of the game...as he has so adeptly learned how to do. Then pull him out after 2 minutes. Then manage them using timvp's formula for rest until the playoffs start.
Can someone call Pop?
Whottt, I had forgotten what happened with AI. That's why I asked for backup.
But we got to this subject because every time I say Manu should come off the bench, posters rush in saying Manu doesn't like coming off the bench.
Well neither did AI. But AI made the mistake of being honest on why he didn't want to come off the bench.
I really don't understand your logic.
The goal is to avoid playing him more than x minutes continuously. That is what Pop and the Spurs have been doing the entire year.
If you want to maximize the resting time of a player in a particular game, you play him at the beggining and at the end of the game, in order to maximize the total time span you can play him. The larger the time span you use, the larger the rest it is possible to schedule for any total x amount of minutes of playing time. If he doesn't start, you are reducing the total time span you can play him, and therefore, he would have less resting time for the same amount of minutes played. This is a basic scheduling problem.
It is obvious that if the goal is to maximize the resting time in between playing periods, you have to maximize the total time span that you use the player for any x total amount of minutes you want to use.
If this is not clear, I'll give you some scheduling examples, but I am a little busy now.
timvp, do you think TD, KG, Lebron, Kobe, TMac, etc would like coming of the bench?
Duncan came off the bench last season.
He didn't have a problem with it.
Pop has even said that he considered bringing Manu off the bench when he was coming back from the groin injury, but didn't do it because he thought he might tighten up from sitting in the beginning if he didn't start.
So it's not unfathomable right now, especially if the Spurs get locked into the two seed soon, that Manu may play very limited minutes -- yes, even off the bench.
I understand that Manu is tired and that he gives 110% and that he has played a lot of basketball in the last few years. But it's starting to irk me that he's too tired to even practice. It's not about his groin bother him -- he's just tired. And that sucks.
Actually, the goal should be playing him the least amount of minutes, period.
Incorrect. The total time span starts when the ball is tipped and ends when the game is over. If he doesn't start, he's resting on the sidelines during a time when he'd usually be playing.If you want to maximize the resting time of a player in a particular game, you play him at the beggining and at the end of the game, in order to maximize the total time span you can play him. The larger the time span you use, the larger the rest it is possible to schedule for any total x amount of minutes of playing time. If he doesn't start, you are reducing the total time span you can play him, and therefore, he would have less resting time for the same amount of minutes played. This is a basic scheduling problem.
Tim came off the bench ONE game. You're talking about taking a guy who has been rewarded by his play and then taking that award away and not just for ONE game. No one is going to LIKE that. But he WOULD do it...he's already done it. That was pretty messed up to compare him to AI and that situation. He does what's best for the team, and if him coming off the bench was what was best for the team, then he'd be doing it. Obviously Pop and Co. feel differently.
It's got to be a little bit of the groin though too right? I mean it's not gonna fully heal in that short amount of time, especially with him playing heavy minutes. The tiredness worries me, and yeah it does suck but if they could just rest him on these back to backs or heck even consecutive games it'd really help him out I think.
Pop and Manu both say it's not. They both have repeated that it's not the groin; that he just doesn't have anything left in the tank.It's got to be a little bit of the groin though too right?
First of all, look at the question I was answering.
Second of all, since when has starting a basketball game become a reward? I don't get where it came from that coming off the bench is a slap in the face. Look at all the great sixth men in NBA history. They didn't come off the bench as some sort of punishment, it was to better utilize them.
Who Pop starts should be a strategic move.
Not some sort of reward.
Only once.
Keep bringing good examples and better analogies to the table.
In any case, as I said before, I'm not against Manu coming of the bench, if everybody concludes its the best way to help the team.
So it's not a reward? Manu could've played like crap in 03 and still be the starter in the 04 season? I don't see it like that. Coming off the bench isn't a slap in the face but starting the season as a starter and then moving to the bench...that isn't exactly "happy sparkly good feeling" stuff. Ya know?
If the situation is so serious, he shouldn't come of the bench, he should be benched entire games.
Yeah, that's basically what Pop said today. He may not play in both games of back-to-backs. I wish that he would have played less minutes per game throughout the season, and perhaps he wouldn't have been so tired at this point.he should be benched entire games.
Either way, it's water under the bridge now. They really need to do something about his conditioning this summer. I understand that he's not going to playing international ball this summer. But I can't help to think that if he plays 30+ mpg throughout next season and doesn't change his conditioning, then he'll be tired again at this time next year.
Why is his conditioning so poor? Is he physically weak in general, or does he just not know how to pace himself? Combined with the fact he has played a lot of basketball since 2002-03?
What is it?
I'm sure it's a lot of things. Too much basketball. Skinny. Can't pace himself (and I don't want him too).
This is what I mentioned in the other thread, why no response there?
Anyhow, I mentioned his lack of upper body strength might be a reason that his offense can be ineffective at times, especially when he is tired. If he can slowly put on a little muscle this off-season that might help. Be worth a try. Of course muscle can hinder a players athleticism, but I think it can help if it is put on slowly (year by year).
Does he even attempt to do any sort of muscle building program in the off-season?
You asked the question. I was only answering it.
My bad.
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