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Valenciunas, the guy has star written all over him.
Definitely a crap shoot...
One example that I still have zero idea how it worked out is how the 6-8, 260 Al Jefferson was able to become a 20-10 player at his NBA peak, but the 6-11, 270 Randolph Morris has merely bounced around...
Both were highly skilled low-post players who had great footwork, positioning and instincts for classic C play. Neither were great athletes, but each made up for it by knowing more, playing in control and playing hard. I saw Morris destroy the much more athletic Dwight Howard in HS. The odd part is it was the shorter, slightly heftier PF who succeeded with the traditional skillset rather than the traditionally heighted/weighted C. What the ? Crapshoot... All it is.
If Drummond goes to a player-friendly school for a year or two, he may be too far gone to ever dominate in the NBA. He needs to learn to care all the time very soon.
Valenciunas, the guy has star written all over him.
Jamstone = Jose
Tyson = Kool
These are things we know.
I think as far as being dominant, the Oden ship has sailed. IMO, the best case scenario for him is a defensive specialist who can play the role Tyson Chandler played last year on the Mavs, but even then I don't see Greg Oden having the basketball IQ or personality to be the leader Chandler is.
Even when Oden was healthy, I never saw potential for offensive dominance.
I, find it remarkably easy to label a player great when he's the difference between a team being 2 games from the NBA finals and a team being in the lottery.
Doesn't surprise me tho, because it's a culture in the state of Arizona to do everything humanely possible to minimize Amare's impact.
Bynum. Just a matter of whether or not the gun powder in his knees are reduced or not.
This is sad when the most promising answers are Glass-Knee Drew and Sam Bowie Part 2.
To revise what I said earlier: Oden, even if healthy, won't challenge Howard (and Love for rebounding) for rebound/block shot les and the DPOY award, because he'll probably never play enough games or log enough minutes to be seriously considered. Nonetheless, if healthy, he could push to be the best rebounder/shot blocker in the league.
History shows that roughly every five years or so, an all time great big man comes along. Because of how the game has evolved, that will probably become closer to ten years or so. It's been seven years and counting since the last one. But eventually, we will see someone who's, if not in the class of O'Neal and Duncan, at least in the class of Howard. It's inevitable.
im still waiting to see how greg monroe will turn out. Hes a PF/C center like duncan & could be a surprise star.
Greg Monroe is a player I thought had the potential to be a 20/10 guy in this league. Hopefully he gets there, but nothing about his game really screams "dominating." People say the game has changed and evolved without centers but I think that's because there are no centers to build around these days
Amare is a great offensive player. His overall impact is very high, but his inability/unwillingness on the glass and down low certainly undercuts his status as overall "great" a bit.
Yeah, Amare was a rebounder. I'm sure that's why the Suns were a worse rebounding team last year than they ever were with Amare.
They showed so much promise on defense and on the glass without that cancerous spook last year!
Given that Amare is 3rd all time in total rebounds as a Sun and 10th all time in rebounds per game as a Sun, all the Suns fans who whine incessantly about how he wasn't a better rebounder () must think the Suns are a pretty rebounding team in their 43 year history.
It's weird, when overrated honkies like Alvan Adams are mediocre rebounders, Suns fans don't seem to care, but they seem to think all black NBA players 6'10" and over should average 15 rebounds a game.
Don't exaggerate for me. I can do well enough on my own. Fact of the matter is that the Suns have been a pretty mediocre rebounding and defensive team for much of their history.
Adams is before my time, but I was vocal about Chambers and Gugliotta not rebounding up to their position (or as needed/able), and, just so it's not a black/white thing, have recently been critical of Lopez and Frye (both mixed race) as well.
Amare's impact on the Suns is undeniable. Anyone who belittles is wrong. Overall, Amare's impact on the greater game is a little less due to his inconsistencies as a rebounder, shot-blocker and inabilities as a defender. I also blame whitey D'Antoni for fostering a culture where Amare didn't have to care and improve.
I've said it while he was a Sun, and I'm saying it now.
I'm also not a bitter Suns fan who's upset he left the beloved organization. I don't blame/begrudge him at all for bolting Sarver. Not one bit.
It's def. a black/white thing in this city.
When a white guy (Nash) sucks at defense, Suns fans say, "Hey tries so hard (
When a black guy (Amare) sucks at defense, Suns fans say, "That no good lazy piece of could be a defensive player of the year candidate if he tried! Thank you Sarver for not offering that bum a max contract!"
That's^ not some coincidence.
Amare averaged 9.0 rebounds per game as a PF. How much of a difference would the 2-3 more rebounds people expected from him have made?
In the city... not my posts. I've been critical of both, plus the coaching (white or black) that doesn't/didn't hold 'em accountable.
You are correct with the overriding sentiment, although I still maintain that the most overrated defensive position is PG. However, the argument can be made that the constant flood of slashers to the basket was more than most reasonable "shotblockers/defenders" could handle, but this also extends just beyond Nash and Amare's defense and encompasses the team as a whole. Even the teams better defenders were susceptible to matador defense and untimely lapses.
True. I'll never understand how Raja Bell and Shawn Marion were considered shutdown defenders when Ginobili and Parker basically got to the rim at will against them.
I agree
Rebounding isn't just the hard numbers. Rebounding is much more the journey than the destination. It's about being in the right position, always putting a body on someone to minimize their ability to track down the ball, even if you are out of position to get the rebound, it's about always going hard. Watch a player like Noah on the boards. He doesn't get every rebound, but he damn sure as an impact on just about all of them, through tipping, through boxing out, through hustle, etc...
Maybe you're out of the play half the time, but just playing smart, hard and in position can keep 2/3 offensive rebounds out of your opposition's hands, and maybe give your team an extra 2/3 chances at offensive rebounds, all of which is entirely independent and in addition to the extra 2/3 rebounds playing smart, hard and in position adds to your own stats. Ultimately, maybe it's worth 10 points. How many games are decided by less than that?
Marion was an athlete with great defensive stats and Bell was a bully (or wannabe) who did what it took to look tough. In a game driven by stats and perception, I understand it, and while they were better defenders than not, they weren't all-defensive. Both were average at best on-ball defenders. Thomas was the only actual defender who could be counted on, and he barely played.
When Amare got to play power forward, he did everything you described. Asking him to body up a center several inches taller than him weighing 20+ pounds more than him wasn't realistic. As far as Noah goes, he has a motor you're either born with or you're not. His ability to put that much effort in on every play isn't something you can develop. Plenty of dominant big men (Shaq and Duncan just to name a few) took plenty of plays off.
Amare also has an extremely frail lower body and is maybe 6'9" with platform shoes on. The reason he was out of position so often is largely because it's easy for centers he was going up against to muscle him out of position.
Yup, he has great potential
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