I think we can put to rest the BS that the Civil War was about state's rights.

[vy65]

Your analogy is flawed. A SOCV license plate is a single thing that has to be created by Texas. A public park exists regardless of whether SOCV groups meet there or not. The state does not designate SOCV public parks.

Plus, the government has "opened up" license plates by allowing other groups to express their message on them. The case law treats this as a "public forum," meaning that people should have access to license plates to express their viewpoints.

[Spurminator]

They're both government property being used for speech. Whether it has to be created (and who creates it) is irrelevant.

Except the speech on a license plate has to be created, thus sanctioned, by the government. The government won't make banners and special napkins for your SOCV get-togethers.

You are free to print 30 SOCV bumper stickers and plaster them all over your car.

[scott]

They're both government property being used for speech. Whether it has to be created (and who creates it) is irrelevant.

Not really. The park exists and requires no expenditure of public funds in order for a bunch of racists to meet there, if they choose.

Creating a license plate, on the other hand, requires specific effort and expenditure.

So pretty much exactly what Spurminator said.

[scott]

Plus, the government has "opened up" license plates by allowing other groups to express their message on them. The case law treats this as a "public forum," meaning that people should have access to license plates to express their viewpoints.

If there are other license plates used for groups/causes such as this, I object to those too.

I would object to a Black Panther, La Raza, Muslim League, I "Star of David" Jewish Girls, NAMBLA, Laker Fan license plates just as readily.

[vy65]

But the state has to pay for the park's upkeep.

You don't think allowing a hate group on public property sends a message that the government is condoning that group's message?

[vy65]

If there are other license plates used for groups/causes such as this, I object to those too.

So then you think the government has the right to prevent the kkk from meeting in a park?

Edit: I see your point. The only problem is that the government "opened up" license plates - and - incurred first amendment obligations in doing so.

[scott]

But the state has to pay for the park's upkeep.

It's a sunk cost that will be incurred with or without that group meeting on it. If any group causes damages to public grounds beyond reasonable wear and tear expected from anyone using it, they should be billed for those damages.

You don't think allowing a hate group on public property sends a message that the government is condoning that group's message?

No, not at all actually.

[Blake]

Personally, if the klan has a cons utional right to have a rally at a public park, I don't see a good reason why you shouldn't have a cons utional right to have a confederate flag on a license plate.

Do you even know what strawman means?

do you know what a false analogy means?

[scott]

Here is a list of all the approved licenses plates representing organizations. I don't see any that are overtly politically based or offensive. Though I think some of them are overtly stupid.

4-H
A Fine Cause
Adopt-A-Beach
Air Force Association
American Quarter Horse Association
Animal Friendly
Be A Blood Donor
Big Bend National Park
Big Brothers Big Sisters
Boy Scouts of America
CASA - Court Appointed Special Advocate
Coastal Conservation
College for all Texans
Cotton Boll
Deaf/Hard Of Hearing
Ducks Unlimited - Blue Heron
Ducks Unlimited - Classic
El Paso Mission Valley
Fight Terrorism
Florida Alumni Association
Girl Scouts
Go Texan II Farm Trailer
Go Texan II Farm Truck
Go Texan II Farm Truck > 1 Ton
Go Texan II Farm Truck Tractor
Go Texan II Token Trailer
Go Texan II Trailer
Go Texan II Truck > 1 Ton
Go Texan Passenger Car or Truck
God Bless America
God Bless Texas
Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo
Insure Texas Kids
Keep Texas Beautiful
Knights of Columbus
LSU Alumni Association
March of Dimes
Marine Mammal Recovery
Mothers Against Drunk Driving
Native Texan
Organ Donor
Read to Succeed
Red Grapefruit
Rotary International
San Jacinto Texas Historic District
Share The Road
Smile Texas Style
Space Shuttle Columbia
Special Olympics Texas
State Capitol
State of the Arts
Stop Child Abuse
Texans Conquer Cancer
Texas Aerospace Commission
Texas Lions Camp
Texas Masons
Texas Master Gardener
Texas Music
Texas Parks and Wildlife Conserv - Bluebonnet
Texas Parks and Wildlife Conserv - Horned Lizard
Texas Parks and Wildlife Conserv - Largemouth Bass
Texas Parks and Wildlife Conserv - Whitetail Deer
Texas Reads
Texas State Rifle Association
Texas Trails
Texas Young Lawyers
Texas.-It's Like a Whole Other Country
United States Olympic Committee
United We Stand
Urban Forestry
YMCA

[scott]

So then you think the government has the right to prevent the kkk from meeting in a park?

Edit: I see your point. The only problem is that the government "opened up" license plates - and - incurred first amendment obligations in doing so.

No, I don't think they have the right to prevent the kkk from meeting in a park so long as they were not violating any other laws or ordinances. That is speech, and I believe in free speech and the first amendment.

Where my opinion is that license plates don't fall under free speech because no one has the right to have public funds devoted to creating you a license plate. You do, however, have the right to buy your own flag or bumper sticker or even paint your entire truck like a confederate flag if you want.

[Spurminator]

Frankly, I've always thought the idea of personalized LPs is unnecessary. You have plenty of bumper space to tell people what school you went to or what cause you support, if doing so on your car is so important to you.

[vy65]

Here is a list of all the approved licenses plates representing organizations. I don't see any that are overtly politically based or offensive. Though I think some of them are overtly stupid.

I don't know what makes something overtly political or not. Some of those groups definitely express a political leaning to me.

[vy65]

do you know what a false analogy means?

lol cuck

[scott]

Frankly, I've always thought the idea of personalized LPs is unnecessary. You have plenty of bumper space to tell people what school you went to or what cause you support, if doing so on your car is so important to you.

+1.

I guess the state is looking to make some money any way they can though.

[z0sa]

Every war is about money.

[vy65]

No, I don't think they have the right to prevent the kkk from meeting in a park so long as they were not violating any other laws or ordinances. That is speech, and I believe in free speech and the first amendment.

Where my opinion is that license plates don't fall under free speech because no one has the right to have public funds devoted to creating you a license plate. You do, however, have the right to buy your own flag or bumper sticker or even paint your entire truck like a confederate flag if you want.

You're right. The problem is when the government opens up property it owns to allow groups to organize/meet/"speak." Once a state allows groups to use government property to "advertise" its message, it can't turn around and deprive other groups similar "advertising" just because it doesn't like that group's message or ideology.

[Wild Cobra]

Why are liberal pansies afraid of the Battle Flag?

[vy65]

I'd like to hear the argument why the Boy Scouts of America or Freemasons can advertise/advocate their groups on a license plate, but not the SOCV?

[vy65]

Why are liberal pansies afraid of the Battle Flag?

You're a ing moron.

[Wild Cobra]

You're a ing moron.

Say what you will you hate filled bigot. What ever happened to acceptance of others beliefs? Instead, you are what you say you are against.

A BIGOT!

[Spurminator]

Well it was a good adult conversation until WC chimed in.

[Wild Cobra]

Well it was a good adult conversation until WC chimed in.

I just cannot stand intolerant bigots.

[Blake]

Frankly, I've always thought the idea of personalized LPs is unnecessary. You have plenty of bumper space to tell people what school you went to or what cause you support, if doing so on your car is so important to you.

I have no problem with extra cash for the state if people want to buy silly plates.

[scott]

I just cannot stand intolerant bigots.

[Blake]

lol cuck

It was already obvious you didn't know.