Reply With Quote
So long as you're Christian, you should never have to face a religious test, just as the cons ution says!
Pretty impressive scholar, ol' Benedict is.
So long as you're Christian, you should never have to face a religious test, just as the cons ution says!
I've had more than one discussion with a fundamentalist claiming that that very clause needs to be amended out.
alright, i've let these bull assertions go on unchallenged for too long. precisely what warrant can you people provide for this country being built on Christian values?
these mindless assertions are starting to piss me off
Do you parrot everything Rush says on his show? He spent an entire segment today saying this exact same thing.
They are warranted by the simple fact that its what they choose to believe, and there is nothing you can say/demonstrate/prove to make them believe anything to the contrary.
No matter how many facts you bring up that contradicts this belief?
Have you ever tried to reason with these people? You are welcome to give it a shot...
This country was based on many things, but I would say the primary one is a balance between natural rights and the social contract. There are not too many republics or democracies in the Bible.
Xray is guilty as charged. I will give him credit though because he doesn't deny that he listens to hush. I just wich ray would expand his choices to receive the news and opinions from somoeone other than an entertainer..
I concur. I listen to Rush and Sean Hannity to try to get a better understanding of conservatives and their views. I have views and values that agree with many conservatives. I don't know why they think they have a monopoly of values.
Good for Rush.
Scott would like to read President George Washington's
First Inaugural Speech, it just might enlighten you to
how our founding fathers felt. I would point you to
his closing paragraph. But he refers to their belief in
God thoughout the speech.
OurDo ents.gov Home Page
www.ourdo ents.gov December 7, 2007
Transcript of President George Washington's First Inaugural Speech (1789)
Fellow-Citizens of the Senate and of the House of Representatives:
Among the vicissitudes incident to life no event could have filled me with greater anxieties than that of which the notification was transmitted by your order, and received on the 14th day of the present month. On the one hand, I was summoned by my Country, whose voice I can never hear but with veneration and love, from a retreat which I had chosen with the fondest predilection, and, in my flattering hopes, with an immutable decision, as the asylum of my declining years--a retreat which was rendered every day more necessary as well as more dear to me by the addition of habit to inclination, and of frequent interruptions in my health to the gradual waste committed on it by time. On the other hand, the magnitude and difficulty of the trust to which the voice of my country called me, being sufficient to awaken in the wisest and most experienced of her citizens a distrustful scrutiny into his qualifications, could not but overwhelm with despondence one who (inheriting inferior endowments from nature and unpracticed in the duties of civil administration) ought to be peculiarly conscious of his own deficiencies. In this conflict of emotions all I dare aver is that it has been my faithful study to collect my duty from a just appreciation of every cir stance by which it might be affected. All I dare hope is that if, in executing this task, I have been too much swayed by a grateful remembrance of former instances, or by an affectionate sensibility to this transcendent proof of the confidence of my fellow-citizens, and have thence too little consulted my incapacity as well as disinclination for the weighty and untried cares before me, my error will be palliated by the motives which mislead me, and its consequences be judged by my country with some share of the partiality in which they originated.
Such being the impressions under which I have, in obedience to the public summons, repaired to the present station, it would be peculiarly improper to omit in this first official act my fervent supplications to that Almighty Being who rules over the universe, who presides in the councils of nations, and whose providential aids can supply every human defect, that His benediction may consecrate to the liberties and happiness of the people of the United States a Government ins uted by themselves for these essential purposes, and may enable every instrument employed in its administration to execute with success the functions allotted to his charge. In tendering this homage to the Great Author of every public and private good, I assure myself that it expresses your sentiments not less than my own, nor those of my fellow- citizens at large less than either. No people can be bound to acknowledge and adore the Invisible Hand which conducts the affairs of men more than those of the United States. Every step by which they have advanced to the character of an independent nation seems to have been distinguished by some token of providential agency; and in the important revolution just accomplished in the system of their united government the tranquil deliberations and voluntary consent of so many distinct communities from which the event has resulted can not be compared with the means by which most governments have been established without some return of pious gra ude, along with an humble anticipation of the future blessings which the past seem to presage. These reflections, arising out of the present crisis, have forced themselves too strongly on my mind to be suppressed. You will join with me, I trust, in thinking that there are none under the influence of which the proceedings of a new and free government can more au iously commence.
By the article establishing the executive department it is made the duty of the President "to recommend to your consideration such measures as he shall judge necessary and expedient." The cir stances under which I now meet you will acquit me from entering into that subject further than to refer to the great cons utional charter under which you are assembled, and which, in defining your powers, designates the objects to which your attention is to be given. It will be more consistent with those cir stances, and far more congenial with the feelings which actuate me, to subs ute, in place of a recommendation of particular measures, the tribute that is due to the talents, the rec ude, and the patriotism which adorn the characters selected to devise and adopt them. In these honorable qualifications I behold the surest pledges that as on one side no local prejudices or attachments, no separate views nor party animosities, will misdirect the comprehensive and equal eye which ought to watch over this great assemblage of communities and interests, so, on another, that the foundation of our national policy will be laid in the pure and immutable principles of private morality, and the preeminence of free government be exemplified by all the attributes which can win the affections of its citizens and command the respect of the world. I dwell on this prospect with every satisfaction which an ardent love for my country can inspire, since there is no truth more thoroughly established than that there exists in the economy and course of nature an indissoluble union between virtue and happiness; between duty and advantage; between the genuine maxims of an honest and magnanimous policy and the solid rewards of public prosperity and felicity; since we ought to be no less persuaded that the propitious smiles of Heaven can never be expected on a nation that disregards the eternal rules of order and right which Heaven itself has ordained; and since the preservation of the sacred fire of liberty and the destiny of the republican model of government are justly considered, perhaps, as deeply, as finally, staked on the experiment entrusted to the hands of the American people.
Besides the ordinary objects submitted to your care, it will remain with your judgment to decide how far an exercise of the occasional power delegated by the fifth article of the Cons ution is rendered expedient at the present juncture by the nature of objections which have been urged against the system, or by the degree of inquietude which has given birth to them. Instead of undertaking particular recommendations on this subject, in which I could be guided by no lights derived from official opportunities, I shall again give way to my entire confidence in your discernment and pursuit of the public good; for I assure myself that whilst you carefully avoid every alteration which might endanger the benefits of an united and effective government, or which ought to await the future lessons of experience, a reverence for the characteristic rights of freemen and a regard for the public harmony will sufficiently influence your deliberations on the question how far the former can be impregnably fortified or the latter be safely and advantageously promoted.
To the foregoing observations I have one to add, which will be most properly addressed to the House of Representatives. It concerns myself, and will therefore be as brief as possible. When I was first honored with a call into the service of my country, then on the eve of an arduous struggle for its liberties, the light in which I contemplated my duty required that I should renounce every pecuniary compensation. From this resolution I have in no instance departed; and being still under the impressions which produced it, I must decline as inapplicable to myself any share in the personal emoluments which may be indispensably included in a permanent provision for the executive department, and must accordingly pray that the pecuniary estimates for the station in which I am placed may during my continuance in it be limited to such actual expenditures as the public good may be thought to require.
Having thus imparted to you my sentiments as they have been awakened by the occasion which brings us together, I shall take my present leave; but not without resorting once more to the benign Parent of the Human Race in humble supplication that, since He has been pleased to favor the American people with opportunities for deliberating in perfect tranquillity, and dispositions for deciding with unparalleled unanimity on a form of government for the security of their union and the advancement of their happiness, so His divine blessing may be equally con uous in the enlarged views, the temperate consultations, and the wise measures on which the success of this Government must depend.
Transcription courtesy of the Avalon Project at Yale Law School.
Page URL: http://www.ourdo ents.gov/doc.php?...age=transcript
U.S. National Archives & Records Administration
700 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, DC 20408 • 1-86-NARA-NARA • 1-866-272-6272
Are we talking about his faith? Or the collective faith of the country when he made this speech? I believe in God but I don't want my govt invloved in the religion business..
GGA you know the answer to your question. But just
don't want to accept the answer.
There is no doubt on what principles our country was founded. None whatsoever. It was founded on Christian
principles. Whether anyone wants to accept that premise is
really up to them. I just wanted to show on what
principles our first President said in his first address to
the nation on these principles.
is the about bill o'reilly's ridiculous war christmas? what's your point? So we can agree tha this country's LAWS originated from chrsitan principles but that doesn't change the fact that there is a seperation of church and state. You seem to ignore that..
god saved his love for the US.
a country just over 200 years old.
What he said doesn't make it a fact.
For the record, as someone whose lived in Utah for 24 years I'd like to say I find religion paramount to a President's campaign. At least in this case. I'm not sure if I'd call myself a christian. Probably more of just a theist. Whether or not one is Christian though doesn't matter. You can't really make the argument that belief in the right type of christian values (ie: aguape love) is bad for anyone.
I will say this though. Mormons are delusional, selfish and crazy. The entire purpose of their religion is to, after death, ascend to the level of godhood over ones own planetary realm. I don't care whether you think religion should or should not be considered; A man who thinks he is capable of becoming a god unto his own world is not fit to run the nation.
If Mitt deluded himself into believing in this cult, who the else knows what he's capable of believeing. It's not a matter of religion, it's a matter of sanity. Plain and simple. And nothing is more insane than mormonism.
"Mitt deluded himself into believing in this cult'
He was born into a Mormon family, his grandparents being polygamists who fled to MX to avoid prosecution.
As an adult, tearing down and inspecting what you were born into, received from your family, and then deciding to accept or reject it is often difficult.
Romney is obviously, accurately tatooed as a devout, practicing, believing Mormon, too late to change his spots. I'd say, and hope, that he's ed as a candidate. What the could a president who believes in "continuing revelation" come up with as revealed to him. We already know how ed up the world is due to God telling dubya to invade Iraq.
His yesterday's "religion requires freedom, freedrom requires religion" is scary bull . Freedom is a fairly recent political/social construct. Religion is supposed to be transcendant and spiritual, but American religion makes it material, political, venal. The success of the "Christian" supremecists is that they have confused America about Caesar vs God, Christ himself making the crystal clear distinction.
How can both parties continue to put forward such horrendously weak candidates, compounded by horrendously weak and over-extended, too-long campaigns? Does it really take 2 years for Americans to elect a President? The system is ed.
As George Carlin said, maybe something else (besides the politicians) sucks around here. Maybe it's the citizens who suck.
Last edited by boutons_; 12-07-2007 at 01:11 PM.
Here's an easy one for all of you. Where does this quote come from?
"The government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion."
Probably Thomas Jefferson. Am I right?
Last edited by boutons_; 12-07-2007 at 03:33 PM.
I guess that ends this thread. nice find.
I don't find what Mitt Romney said scarey at all. Not one bit. I think he spoke from the heart and I believe him.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions