Poker straight or flush

[Heath Ledger]

To simplify use the rule of 4 and 2. With two cards count your outs and multiply by 4 that is the approximate chance you have of hitting your draw. Its accurate typically within a few percentage points. After the turn card has peeled you now use the #2 to figrure out your odds.

You also have to keep in mind what cards your compe or may be holiding, if you have a j10 of hearts or 46 of hearts and have four to a flush, its pointless to keep drawing if you think the opponents could be betting into you with his higher draw with something like kq of hearts, queen jack etc. You cannot play by just your cards, you have to try to narrow the range of cards your opponent may be holding base on your note taking of his prevoius play and his betting patterns/actions.

Another thing if he bets the flop and you flat call, this pegs you to a very limited # of holdings, if the turn comes a blank that doesnt help your hand, meaning another card of the flush, or pairing the board, you are going to be looking at a very nice sized bet.
When you call its a tell to low pair, mid pair, flush draw, or top pair with weak kicker.

So in review its always very important to consider your oppoents possible holdings when making your decision. Its very dangerous to only think in terms of "if i hit my flush" "straight" cuz nothing is worse than being on the dummy end of a straight or flush and all of your chips are in the middle.

[Heath Ledger]

As far as a good time for playing in Casinos pro's are always looking for fishy games, you are gonna run into solid pros/regulars all the time. You look for signs that they are a regular, if the staff talk to him on a first name basis you know they are a regular and tread with caution. Don't be afraid of them just dont try to be tricky, one trap and they take all of your chips. play them very straightforward and dont try to bluff them.

More times than not they will see thru your bluffs, and more times than not if you try to trap them they will not pay you off unless their ego comes into play which does happen. Always remember this, they miss their flops just as much as you but if you don't hit the flop, quit it and forget it. Don't try to win all of your money on one hand. Solid play will take you far, eventually you will learn when the time is right to pull off the more elaborate plays.

Good beginner books
Phil muth on Texas Holdem

Any of the books by Phil Gordon (blue book, black book, green book)

For tourney play the bible is

Harrington on Holdem 1 2 3
If you can stomach lots of math Sklansky books are great but its a little too out there for my tastes but you can still pick up some very solid theory in his books as well.

Cash games Harrington has two new books that just came out that i assure you is reccomended reading.

For poker training sites

realpokertraining.com
pokerxfactor.com
pokerschoolonline.com
spadeclub.com

all very solid learning and teaching tools, you invest the money your learning curve will be much less than if you ahve to figure this stuff all out on your own. Also the tutorial videos can be slighty more interesting than reading. Because you can see and hear and visualize rather than reading in hopes of remembering what you've read.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Damn, Heath, you gave away the whole book of secrets!

Thanks for news of the new Harrington books - I'm basically a cash game player. Never know how much to risk at what time in tournaments...

As for rounders, good advice to play them straight. And you know what, once they think they know you they often underestimate your BIG hand if you hit one. I had AK flopped AK8, turn K, and this freakin rounder gave me $600 after playing with me for 4 hours. He obviously had me tagged as harmless while I tagged him for dangerous, and he was so pissed afterwards he had to leave. I just waited for him to be dumb.

My simple rules - never take more than you can afford to lose; play right, not for results; and, if you're not enjoying it any more, time to go home. I rarely win big, but I usually double or treble my $200 by the time I leave the table, andhave a lot of fun doing it. There's a song in that...

[Jimcs50]

play them very straightforward and dont try to bluff them.

More times than not they will see thru your bluffs, and more times than not if you try to trap them they will not pay you off unless their ego comes into play which does happen.

I think the opposite is true, you can bluff the good players and not the fish. My bluffing is much more successful against the good players, because when I bluff, I do it in a way that I would do if I had the hand that I am representing. But if I do it against a novice, they do not see what I am representing and they call with the better hand, lets say top pair.

Example. I have position and I have A K s, I reraise a good player preflop, he calls. The Flop misses me completely 4 8 J, the original raiser bets the size of the pot, I again reraise trying to sell a big over pair, he folds because he sees what I am representing.

Now look at the same scenario against a fish who has AJ

He would probably reraise my raise with his top pair top kicker, not even thinking that I am representing a big over pair, then I have to fold.

This is why early in the night, if I have a huge hand on my reraise and the player folds, I show it, that will allow me to get away with this bluff later.

[MannyIsGod]

If you always reraise me when it looks like I'm just continuation betting I promise you its going to cost you a lot in the long run.

[Jimcs50]

If you always reraise me when it looks like I'm just continuation betting I promise you its going to cost you a lot in the long run.

Manny, you have no chance against me...I will raise you every time...and you will be my .

[Jimcs50]

I only reraise preflop when I have one of the top 5 hands, I will not reraise with a hand that I will not put all my chips in the middle with.

[Heath Ledger]

Im talking about the novice player not somebody who has a pretty good understanding of the game. obviously if you have some board reading abilities you can make plays against a good player or pro, it is NOT a good idea for a novice to do this. He should not be in there playing lots of pots with a pro. As i said and ill say it again, when you start out play a very straightforward game, it will look like you are very tight but that is okay, you may be able to pull off an occasional bluff because of your tight image, but dont bluff a loose player or someone who appears to call all the time.

And don't be that guy who is always calling down with top pair or low or middle pair when there are straights and flushes on the board or if the board has paired.

Another thing is if you are starting to feel uncomfortable at the table and you think a player and or players are starting to bully you get up and leave, nothing says you have to stay there, move to another table if possible (cash game)

[Fabbs]

Heath Ruff Jim and (Manny non smartass version if available),

Thanks again for the input. Books ordered from Amazon, waiting for delivery (Ruff there is hope for me ). I will also post a site that reviews the various poker books, i want to see your guys reaction to his reviews.

Same question as op on straights on the flop. Working example:
I'm holding J8. Flop is 9 10 Q unsuited. Sweet, right? However after the draw, no one upped the blinds and only 3 players went. So the pot was, meh 10 chips. Would you nonetheless put out a large enough bet to chase away any of the Bingo Bettys that want to hang around and possibly flush? Or a JK would have drilled me. I know it's once again many variables, not wanting an exact answer. But generally, with the straight on the flop (hardly ever happens i know but does occasionally) or with the straight on the turn (much more likely), do you tend to put out a large enough bet to ensure you win the pot and blow out the chasers (or make them pay) to chase their flush/boat? Or, when the flop does not show a pair (nor the turn) and does not seem to show any flush or higher straight possibilities do you go ahead and let the pot build to the turn, let a few more chasers hang around?

[MannyIsGod]

Why are you playing J8 without a raise against loose players is my question. You'll help your game a lot more by fixing bad preflop leaks (hint - j8 is a bad preflop leak) than by worrying about post flop play on weird hands like that.

[Jimcs50]

Why are you playing J8 without a raise against loose players is my question. You'll help your game a lot more by fixing bad preflop leaks (hint - j8 is a bad preflop leak) than by worrying about post flop play on weird hands like that.

Manny there are many reasons why you can play J8. One, he could have been in the blinds with no raises ahead of him, or there was a min raise and he would be getting 6-1 odds to call with 3 others in the pot.

To answer you question, Fabbs, I always bet on a flop if I do not have the nuts, if I have a probable winner. This will tell you where you are in the hand. If someone raises, they you throw slow down, because of the JK possibility. I would not fold to a raise with the 2nd nuts though.

[Heath Ledger]

Many factors to consider but you cant be results oriented like what if i let somebody draw to a flush, the next card comes putting a 2nd of a suit on board, then u may consider a larger bet but when you flop a striaght you dont want to waste it, id thorw out a little fishy bet making it look like your taking a stab at the pot, in hopes of the person rasing you, in which case you can jump right back on top of him with a large reraise.

So in summary if im first to act i may check sometimes hoping to check raise, or i may bet a small amount looking like a stab in hopes of being raised so i can snap off their neck.

If there are two of a suit on the flop you can bet the pot to try to take it down, if they still call you know they probably have a middle pair, some people will take another card with bottom pair but not usually for a pot sized bet. If they do call your pot sized bet your against top pair maybe weak kicker, medium pair or someone slowplaying a higher flopped straight in this situation. On the next street a good sized raise will tell you exactly what is the case as they will either fold or probably raise, a 2nd call usually means your in trouble.

This is just my interpretation of the situation without knowing many other factors such as how the opponent has been playing etc.

But as Manny says j8 is generally not a great hand unless you are in late position and there has already been one or two other limpers, or no limpers and you try to steal the blinds. Other than that they go in the muck unless you can play them without a raise in the small or big blind. Even if they were suited i would throw them away except in the few mentioned above occasions.

[Fabbs]

Good beginner books
Phil muth on Texas Holdem

Any of the books by Phil Gordon (blue book, black book, green book)

For tourney play the bible is

Harrington on Holdem 1 2 3
If you can stomach lots of math Sklansky books are great but its a little too out there for my tastes but you can still pick up some very solid theory in his books as well.

Cash games Harrington has two new books that just came out that i assure you is reccomended reading.

Heath i believe you and have ordered them. What do you all think of this guy
Nick Christenson as a reviewer?
http://www.thepokerforum.com/bookreviews.htm

For example his review of Phil muth Presents Read 'Em and Reap
http://www.thepokerforum.com/bookreviews57030207.htm#

Also the tutorial videos can be slighty more interesting than reading. Because you can see and hear and visualize rather than reading in hopes of remembering what you've read.

Which videos? Found where, at the training sites?

[Heath Ledger]

Im not familiar with Nick Christenson, doesn't mean hes's not a credible reviewer ive just never heard of him. The videos im talkinb about are on the training sites i mentioned. Also there are tons of free ones up on youtube. Don't buy Helmuths black blet poker course, its a scam id spend the money on his first book before buying those videos.