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wow boutons first postive post I have seen youpost in awhile
He's 11 - 8 in 28 mpg. Don't see why he can't do that @Spurs, pro-rated for his MPG.
Also 1 STL and 1 BPG, and 5!! ASTs, so that sounds like he's pretty good passer with some floor vision.
I bet that's what Pop expects of him.
Looking at Rasho's number @MIN, I bet Pop expected similar from Rasho as Spur.
If Nazr can put up his NYK numbers as a Spur (which is what we could have reasonably expected from Rasho), we'll all be very pleased with Nazr.
Well, not everybody.
I'm sure the Super-Malik-forever fans will piss on Nazr continuously.
wow boutons first postive post I have seen youpost in awhile
And I'm sure the Pop sucking Malik haters will continue to deride and trash a guy that didn't want to leave here, and defend this trade...no matter if Nazr sucks or not.
And I don't know what drugs you guys are taking...but Duncan does not help the numbers of other bigmen...
Had you guys been around when won a le in 99...you would know that one of the seminal points of that season occurred when Drob stepped back on offense and gave up his offensive numbers....gave them up. Gave up getting the ball early in the clock...let Duncan take on that role.
The reason Mohammed is probably not going to put up better rebounding numbers here is because Duncan is one of the best rebounders in the NBA and he gets to most of them before anyone else...including his own teamates.
Now this going to be balanced by the fact that Spurs opponents miss a lot more shots than the Knicks opponents do...but my money is on Duncan to still get to more rebounds than any one Nazr has ever played with.
The Spurs also don't miss as many shots as the Knicks do...our guards are shooting 50%...so I think there is going to be less Offensive rebounding opportunities for him as well.
Ditto garbage baskets...In addition to Duncan being probably the best block scorer in the NBA...he's also probably the best garbage man.
Guys that score off o rebound putbacks are gonna get less opportunities to do so playing alongside Tim Duncan because Duncan does those things better than just anyone in the NBA....
This not saying that Nazr is going to suck...but I don't think you are going to be able to measure his contributions to this team by looking at an improvement in NYK numbers...he might be able to put up better numbers than Rasho...
But I don't see anyway possible for him to put up better numbers than he was putting up in NY, with the type of game he has...and that's not the way I am going to judge him...I am going to judge him by Malik and Rasho's numbers(and our W-L record)...not his own Knick numbers. I think his own Knick numbers have nothing to do with the Spurs.
ducks, you from here to Finals. Don't use my name in vain, or at all, head.
Duncan avg's 12 RPG, Spurs 42 RPG.
That's 30 RPG that Nazr can take a crack at, and why wouldn't Nazr, in best case, increase the Spurs RB pie larger than 42?
What I'd like to see at least two Spurs fighting EACH OTHER for every rebound. I've seen Manu take RBs off Tim.
boutons, please stop using the F word, we have already been scolded for doing so.
.5 assists.
.5 assists???
I think even the Coyote has .5 assists.
One thing to remember is the Spurs' defense is played in a way that it doesn't allow players to attempt for offensive rebounds. They are taught to get back on defense rather than contest for the offensive boards. I wonder how Nazr will react to this defensive rule, seeing as that is one of his strengths as a basketball player.
oops, a miniscule disadvantage workin on a 1400 pixel laptop screen is
missing a few "."
"get back on defense rather than contest for the offensive boards"
Sounds too rigid.
If the opponent is not a fast-breaking, ball-pushing team, I'd hit the offensive boards rather than always get back and settle for "one-and-done", esp when the Spurs are having a cold-shooting night, where 70%+ of Spurs shots would be effectively TOs under Pop's rigid scheme.
THAT. Profanity goes hand in hand with great discussions.
Every other Spurs board on the Net limits profanity, it's not like there is a shortage of them...this one doesn't....this one also has the best discussions....coincidence? No way.
When you start imposing limitations on people ability to express themselves the discussions are naturally going to suffer. Putting rigid constraints on individuals can only impair the free exchange of ideas...Put no contstraints on indivduals and the discussions will flourish... ing big time. Besides...some of us have a severely limited vocabulary if not allowed to use profanity.
On top of that...ever see Pop during a game? I study him during games to try and pick up new cuss words.
My other source of new cusswords is 13-15 years olds, who put my vast vocabulary of them to shame. Wake up.
Last edited by whottt; 02-28-2005 at 02:32 PM.
dude, chill, I was being facetious.
That's good point, but guys are only able to get to a certain PCT of rebounds..it is kind of a zero sum game when guys are playing along side each other, just look at what happened to Duncan and Robinson. The Spurs are third in the NBA in rebounding PCT and most of those they don't get too are long boards from 3PA.
If Nazr is getting minutes alongside Duncan, theoretically his rebounding numbers should suffer...Although Nazr should still improve our offensive rebounding, especially when Duncan is off the court.
Now if Nazr starts eating into Duncan's rebounding totals..I think our overall rebounding will show a huge improvement...and I will judge this trade a smashing success.
Don't know if this has already been posted but it's a decent article.
link
Bringing Mohammed to the Mountain
By Emmett Shaw
for HOOPSWORLD.com
Feb 24, 2005, 23:49
"Who is that?", asked the professional looking young father about the solidly built 6-10 shooter stroking several set-shots, most of them swishing, from one of Madison Square Garden's two free throw lines. "That's Mohammed," I replied. The khaki-clad man's 10-year-old son clicked off a couple more photos of the almost glistening player from the end zone's fourth row. Nazr Mohammed was in his new snow-white game togs -- no warmups. He was sweated up good already, 45 minutes before he was to start at center for New York in their second pre-season game.
Mark Aguirre was still nearby, after giving Nazr an ernest teaching workout under the basket. The Knicks assistant had fed his fellow Chicago native time and again, helping him refine the timing of his footwork, his moves: With both feet slightly in the air, catch strong with two hands, then briefly try to squeeeze some air from the NBA Spalding, elbows flared while turning into a powerful crouch, establishing either foot as a pivot. At the right rhythmic moment, a third of a second after the opponent begins to move the wrong way -- BAM -- explode every muscle to spring the ball over the iron for some dunkage. That too is Mohammed.
He was soon to tip-off with Rasho Nesterovic, a two inches taller man, a year and a half older man who was drafted only 12 choices ahead of him in 1998. Rasho is a more durable center who has outdistanced Nazr in the money-go-'round that is pro basketball, though Mohammed can't complain. In that Fall afternoon in New York 19 weeks ago, both players so exuded hope from progress they had made through their summer of work!
Both have a Championship past, Nesterovic with Euroleague's Kinder, Mohammed in the NCAA with Kentucky. But those runs were now several years ago. Both centers went at it hard in preseason last October 16th, pushing each other, yet both refusing to be pushed around. Now after the NBA's latest trade deadline, they are set to push each other all the time -- as teammates with San Antonio. Rasho was the more fundamentally polished prospect in the first round of that 1998 Draft. Nazr was the more athletic project, the last person selected.
Thanks to the Knicks' Isiah Thomas wheeling and dealing -- which got his team nowhere -- he needed to replenish his young talent or get more poker chips to keep playing Texas Hold 'em, and obtaining extra draft picks was his only way to do that. Having no chips left had already cost him any chance at Chris Webber, who now relocates to rival Philadelphia.
Isiah had to do something to buy himself more time from New York's Cablevision ownership and from the big town's impatient media. You can almost hear him. "I hit with Trevor Ariza in the 2nd round, didn't I. Watch what I do with a couple of number ones." Thus San Antonio, owning excess future choices, got a taker for Malik Rose's big contract.
The NBA money-go-'round creates a money crunch at times, and Tony Parker, Manu Ginobili, Tim Duncan, and Rasho control so much of the Spurs' pie chart the next few years that a reserve like Malik has had a wedge-shaped spatula shoved underneath his tail for the last year and a half. He knew it. He didn't like it, but he accepted the facts of multi-millionaire life in today's NBA.
The ongoing tension -- over two years old -- between Coach Popovich and Malik was an outgrowth of the situation, explained a friend of the Rose family to HOOPSWORLD. Also, "Malik just wanted to play, and Popovich wasn't letting him do that." Further, Rose is a man who speaks his mind, and when Pop sometimes didn't like what his ultra-hustling banger had to say, the tension was natural. Ironically, Malik is not a man who likes the dishing out and taking of an in-house fight. He never took sick enjoyment from his tiffs with Pop. But Rose didn't let it get to him, either. "He's too professional to let it bother him."
What was stressed over and over to HOOPSWORLD is what a nice person Malik Rose is, with the same being said of all his many family members who have relocated from Philadelphia to live in San Antonio. The loving, human side of a sports trade could be cut with a Ginsu knife at Rose's Malik's Philly's Phamous restaurant in SA after the trade news broke. Customers, usually couples or parents with kids, quietly ordered and ate cheese steaks, sometimes studying the ESPN ticker on the overhead televisions, checking whether the Rose for Mohammed swap was actually official.
There was a lot of sentiment to the experience. You step up to order from a menu that merely includes "Timmy's MVP Sandwich", "Pop's Pizza", "Manu's Pizza Steak", the "Admiral's Sub", and so on. Rose, not Tim Duncan, was the man who took the microphone at David Robinson's gala tribute after a March 2003 game, a tilt that saw Joel Pryzbilla nearly end Malik's season with a flagrant foul. To think back on 7 1/2 seasons of Rose in Silver and Black and look at that menu made every patron's eyes water.
"I hated basketball. But because of Malik, I love to watch the Spurs. He's the only reason I like the Spurs. I take it back to when he had the 'fro. I love him. I'm heart-broken," said Vanessa Rosales at the eatery. She had brought a large sign reading, "We Love You, Malik! Good Luck in the Big Apple!" Vanessa's date stressed that the Spurs would never have won it all in 2003 without Rose, reminiscing, "I remember especially when they beat the Lakers how happy he was. Just watching him celebrate when they beat the Lakers was great. Then that dunk on Mutombo in the Finals! It was awesome!"
For the diner's part though, he likes the trade. "I think it's a good trade. Mohammed -- he's a physical player who's pretty good. The Spurs'll be good, but I hate to see Malik go. It's a lot like when Sean was traded (in 2003). That hurt." Yes, it hurts. Malik was tearful on the local Channel 4 News tonight. What truly hurts the most is the breaking of the daily bond in the locker room and in the NBA trenches with his SA teammates. Every one of them he loves, Rose stressed.
How much like a heavy novel or wrenching movie the NBA often is! An incentive moment sets the theme, the characters -- more and more of them -- grow on you, the action intesifies, then culminates. In Malik Rose's last game as a Spur, it went just that way. Everything culminated when the intensity got to be too much for the Houston Rockets. The Spurs got in passing lanes in the final period and Houston's offense fell apart, while the Spurs completely went off. Malik Rose pulled the chair one last time on Juwan Howard and Tony Massenburg pulled 8 rebounds in 20 minutes, the kind of pace Pop can only hope Nazr Mohammed can do.
Nazr truly is a taller, younger Massenburg. There can be no doubt that Larry Brown, Mohammed's first NBA coach was fully consulted about the newest Spur. When Aguirre put Mohammed through his paces before the afore-mentioned preseason game, SA general manager RC Buford was beside the players' tunnel looking on. What Nesterovic lacks, the ability to finish, Nazr adds. Unlike Rasho, Mohammed is over a 50% shooter. When Duncan drops a dime on Mohammed, the ball will be as good as already in the hole. Spurs fans can only be greatful that the exchange wasn't for Kurt Thomas. Kurt's contract is much longer than Nazr's and Kurt can't move his feet quickly enough on D to close off the baseline drives of funneled foes.
Bill Walton said it so well early in the season on Boomer Esaison's TV program, and his words have now been answered by RC Buford and the Spurs front office. "The Spurs seem to be a big man down," said Walton, referring to Duncan and Nesterovic being the only centers on the team. In contrast, Detroit won it last year with the two Wallaces, Mehmet Okur, and Elden Campbell all chipping in. With Mohammed's addition, the Spurs are ready to battle either the Wallaces or Shaq and 'Zo in the Finals. But there may yet be hairy playoff moments against Kevin Garnett, Dirk Nowitzki, Shawn Marion, or Rashard Lewis when Malik Rose's quickly moving feet -- combined with his muscle and hustle -- are missing from Pop's discretion.
The Spurs are more fit to win an NBA Finals today than before the trade, but are no closer to getting out of the West, and may be a bit further away. Lamond Murray couldn't find his way onto the Spurs roster in trade, and the injured Linton Johnson III, another swing-forward type who could help against the finesse Western teams, still can't push off hard on his repaired left foot. Johnson's chance with the Spurs appears a season away. San Antonio's third trip to the Finals rides largely on the success of the Spurs' small lineups manned by Brent Barry and Devin Brown.
That is an awesome article, that just about nails it.
We are going to have to count on Horry to step up against Garnett and the like.
But there is one thing...Larry Brown might be Pop's friend, but he's also the coach of the defending champions and he's smart enough to realize who his biggest threat is....He traded Mohammed...actions speak louder.
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