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Would someone please translate this for me. I am bilingual,
you know English and Profane, but this is even above me.
whott "brilliantly" fell for all the Repug/neo- lies and still support the oil-grab war in Iraq.
That huge, inarguable right-wing fiasco marks them all as willfully, maliciously, murderously dumb .
Would someone please translate this for me. I am bilingual,
you know English and Profane, but this is even above me.
You know instead of quoting every lib post on here, I would like to just make
one statement: everytime someone from the conservative side
speaks the truth, they win. Everytime someone from the progressive side express their views, they lose. That is a
fact. I know it will hurt some on here, like think, but think
about it.
I never claimed you said he was a socialist.
I just find it funny how you assume (together with the other american poster in this thread) that Sarkozy is going to be any different than CHirac. If anything he's going to be worse since he's even more open about his hatred for all things foreign.
Calling Chirac more of a socialist than Sarkozy is a joke. None of them would be caught alive in the company of socialists - they are both right wing conservatives (slightly to the left from Le Pen who is a right wing extremist). Also don't forget that Chirac in many ways is responsible for Sarkozy being on the political stage at all.
As for the socialist aspect of France your statement and most quotes that you referenced over simplify the situation. The changes that Sarkozy proposes are more a result of the demographic changes in the country and the current financial reality - regardless who would have been elected, he/she would have had to deal with them and probably in very similar manner.
Solmo, you mean we cant take him at his word? And his
statements about 35 hour workweeks. Funny, some of the
folks they interviewed on FOX said they voted for him because
they like America and he was quite open about wanting to be
one of or friends.
I really don't know where the Fox have found them !!!!
These are the true main reasons Sarko won :
- Royal is a woman and hasn't prove enough she has the balls needed to become president
- Many people of our middle class like Sarko's statement about security in our cities (I'm not talking about terrorism, but of sort of gangs dealing drugs, stealing,...)
- Socialists didn't have a true economical program, Sarko has
BTW, I'm french and I'm really fed up with the anti-french feeling of some of US citizen..... and Sarko wants friendly relationship between USA and France as it was before Bush wanted to invade Iraq, but I won't say he is pro-American, he is just pro-French and needs to be as French President.
Belive it or not: elections in europe are not about USA, we have problems of our own too.
Well I'm glad to here that my President was acting for my country's interest !!!!
Well I'm glad to here that my President was acting for my country's interest !!!!
Yeah but...our liberals over here wanted to elect someone President who would kiss the ass of a French President acting in his countries interest in opposing us...which is what makes them idiots.
Our libs think the only President in the entire world who acts in his countries interests is Bush.
Oh really? You have no idea how sick I am of the Anti-Americanism of some Europeans and the rest of the world...
That's not what lead to the bad blood between Bush and ChIraq...it started the day of their first meeting, before 911, before Iraq...ChIraq was talking about Bush behind his back and word got back to Bush...and Sarko wants friendly relationship between USA and France as it was before Bush wanted to invade Iraq,
That is what started the bad blood between them.
So you do understand why we elected Bush then instead of Kerry?but I won't say he is pro-American, he is just pro-French and needs to be as French President.
And I think a good President will act in his countries best interests...but the type of action is important.
ChIraq felt he had more to gain, both politically and economically, for France by opposing us...
And by opposing I mean ordering the French Ambassador DeVillpen to veto any resolution that calls for the removal of Saddam from powers...
Not just staying out of it....vetoing any resolution that removed the dictator from power.
That's not failing to aid us...that directly opposing us...and supporting a hostile mid-east leader that was in violation of cease fire agreements with us.
ChIraq may have believed that to be in the best interest of France...but it wasn't....he was just being a modern day Neville Chamberlain...
I don't particularly care if Sarkozy hates us or likes us...it's not going to make any difference in the Iraq war at this stage...whether he does or not...
I just care if he's going to act in direct opposition to us, IMO, to the detriment of Europe, the US and all of Western Civilization.
I don't think he will...
And I think glossing him a fascist right winger is typical of European Leftist Political Propaganda...
If were European...
The last thing I would ever be is solidly aligned with either the left or the right....knowing some European Leaders love for authoritarian rule...whether it be on the right or the left.
But anyway....60 years of peace in Europe, no need to say thanks...a nice big you and knife in the back is thanks enough
Now don't get me wrong the majority of French people do not hate americans (contrary to the popular belief in the US), but at the same time I haven't met a french person that would base her/his vote on the fact whether the candidate likes or dislike the US or any other country for that matter.
Anybody who has spent any time in France with French people knows that they have a certain " them" at ude when it comes to other countries - they don't exactly hate them or wish them harm, but they feel they are more equal in the company of equals.
Now it makes it very easy for us foreigners to poke fun at them, but their behaviour is not the worst and certainly not unique - as a matter of fact it reminds me a lot of another country I like - the USA.
P.S. What makes me laugh at this point is that both will cringe at that comparison
Yeah but the Lefties hate us just as much...
Sarkizy wants what ChIraq wanted...for France to be the big boss of the EU, the difference is that Sarkozy has a better economic mind that ChIraq...at least IMO. He's much more liberal when it comes to capitalism...which is a good thing IMO...at least for France's economic situation...and they got a lot of pissed of muslims living in their slums that need jobs...Sarkozy will fix that.
MM....to me the basic tenet of Socialism is government controlled industry...
Calling Chirac more of a socialist than Sarkozy is a joke. None of them would be caught alive in the company of socialists - they are both right wing conservatives (slightly to the left from Le Pen who is a right wing extremist). Also don't forget that Chirac in many ways is responsible for Sarkozy being on the political stage at all.
And even ChIraq was way to the left on that issue compared to what we consider centrist...I don't think Sarkozy is a far to the left on that as ChIraq...but he's more liberal on Free Trade IMO...he has to be...
The confusion is just in the differences between the Right and Left in America and Europe...
The definition of conservative in America has changed much since WWII...our conservatives are only conservative on the subject of religion and unfortunately, science...but when it comes to business, and free trade they are extremely liberal...
As for the socialist aspect of France your statement and most quotes that you referenced over simplify the situation. The changes that Sarkozy proposes are more a result of the demographic changes in the country and the current financial reality - regardless who would have been elected, he/she would have had to deal with them and probably in very similar manner.
It's only complicated because they still don't get free enterprise...
THe perfect model has been laying in front of you for 200 years but...they just have to do it their own way...
IF we see someone doing something better than us, we'll just give them credit and copy it...rather than spending decades trying to prove we can do it better differently.
And we steal your smart people too.
Oh really? You have no idea how sick I am of the Anti-Americanism of some Europeans and the rest of the world...
That's not what lead to the bad blood between Bush and ChIraq...it started the day of their first meeting, before 911, before Iraq...ChIraq was talking about Bush behind his back and word got back to Bush...
That is what started the bad blood between them.
So you do understand why we elected Bush then instead of Kerry?
And I think a good President will act in his countries best interests...but the type of action is important.
ChIraq felt he had more to gain, both politically and economically, for France by opposing us...
And by opposing I mean ordering the French Ambassador DeVillpen to veto any resolution that calls for the removal of Saddam from powers...
Not just staying out of it....vetoing any resolution that removed the dictator from power.
That's not failing to aid us...that directly opposing us...and supporting a hostile mid-east leader that was in violation of cease fire agreements with us.
ChIraq may have believed that to be in the best interest of France...but it wasn't....he was just being a modern day Neville Chamberlain...
I don't particularly care if Sarkozy hates us or likes us...it's not going to make any difference in the Iraq war at this stage...whether he does or not...
I just care if he's going to act in direct opposition to us, IMO, to the detriment of Europe, the US and all of Western Civilization.
I don't think he will...
And I think glossing him a fascist right winger is typical of European Leftist Political Propaganda...
If were European...
The last thing I would ever be is solidly aligned with either the left or the right....knowing some European Leaders love for authoritarian rule...whether it be on the right or the left.
But anyway....60 years of peace in Europe, no need to say thanks...a nice big you and knife in the back is thanks enough
Posting drunk again?
I don't think it's so much people hating the people...as it is political, it's a dislike and hatred at a national level, not a personal level...
Now don't get me wrong the majority of French people do not hate americans (contrary to the popular belief in the US), but at the same time I haven't met a french person that would base her/his vote on the fact whether the candidate likes or dislike the US or any other country for that matter.
And it was inflamed by 2 leaders that don't like each other.
Anybody who has spent any time in France with French people knows that they have a certain " them" at ude when it comes to other countries - they don't exactly hate them or wish them harm, but they feel they are more equal in the company of equals.
Now it makes it very easy for us foreigners to poke fun at them, but their behaviour is not the worst and certainly not unique - as a matter of fact it reminds me a lot of another country I like - the USA.
P.S. What makes me laugh at this point is that both will cringe at that comparison
I just can't write it off as typical French being the french...not in this case, not after the threats from the mid-east, the threat of nuclear terrorism, which threatens Europe(even the pro terrorists/appeasers like Zapatero) as much if not more than the US.
If ChIraq had supported us through the UN...
It would have been political suicide for Bush to be giving bids to US companies for post war development....
There would have been no propaganda basis to this war for the recruitment of terrorists...or at least it would have been hindered.
Together we stand, divided we fall...
ChIraq didn't want to do that, of course, because FRance already had the post sanction development deals for Iraq with Saddam.
He acted entirely in the financial gain of his country....not just at the expense of America...but of Western Europe as well...
I just can't believe so many of you didn't see through it.
Just like W...only worse.
ChIraq was insecure about France status in Europe and Worldwide...he shouldn't have been...
Make no mistake about it....his support of Saddam, and direct opposition to this war made this war made it much more difficult for us to win. It did hurt us...and a lot Americans are resentful of that...not towards the French people themselves...but no definitely towards their government.
It's going to take time to heal this...and it's going to take two leaders wanting to do so...
Sarkozy seems willing, but I am not sure about Bush at this stage...he's got nothing to lose by being an asshole.
But anyway...he'll be gone in a couple of years, and we'll see if we elect a better diplomat than Bush...that's when the bad blood will begin to subside at the National Level.
All the peace loving liberals on this forum are not save the world type libs...
They are isolationaists...the exact same ones that let Hitler kick the out of you guys for 5 years before getting involved.
THe guys ya'll hate and consider the Ugly American are the ones that got involved...
Whottt I won't quote you, but one day you should come to France and other European contry to see how far from the truth you are !!!
You seem to believe many things about us but are so far from reality that I understand why you hate us.
240 years of independance and freedom......... no need to say thanks
LMAO...why do you guys always think I am speaking from ignorance?
I never argue from a position of ignorance...and if I do...I certainly won't be an asshole like I am when I know what I am talking about. That would be stupid on my part....
I've been to France. I've been to the UK, I've been to Germany, I've been to Norway, I've been to Switzerland, I've been to Estonia, I've been to Sweeden, I've been to Finland, I've been to the Russia.
In Asia, I've been to Hong Kong(when it was still under the British).
To be quite honest...I love most of the European Land...I just don't like it's propensity for spawning homicidal maniacs and dictators. And I don't like that it's chief form of intellectual thought is a simple minded hatred of America.
Now granted...for the most part these were brief stops on cruises, but I still have been there.
I'm more qualified to speak on the subject of those countries than I am on the Mid-Eastern ones...
As for France...I took French in college and my professor, who I dated, was a PHD in French Linguistics and just about the biggest French lover in America...she even changed her name to the true French spelling. I've studied quite a bit on France and it's relationship with America...and that's why I have the opinion I do.
What might surprise you is that, prior to 2003, most Americans loved France...and now they really don't...and if that bothers you, you can thank ChIraq for that...
As I said...I don't think it's at the personal level...it's definitely at the national level.
But it is there...and pretending it isn't would be naive on the part of Americans, especially when it comes to electing a leader.
Our libs think you guys are all just sitting there wanting to be friends...and that is BS on the international level, the political level, the economic level...
Now that the cold war is over, you guys are compe ors period, and we our your chief adversary...again, I have no problem with this...I just have a problem with dumbass libs that think you guys are a bunch of peace niks...
Europe exports many things...but peace is not one of them...never has been, and the past 60 years is the exception to the rule.
I applaud you guys in Europe unifying, it means we can pull our military, get paid back the Marshall loan, and stop being drug into your wars. I just want to make sure we are calling a spade a spade.
Point blank...Unified Europe's main goal is supercede the US as the World Leader, at least economically...which I personally have no problem with, compe ion is the heart of capitalism and it benefits all mankind...it's just the methods I have a problem with. Methods that IMO put us all at risk.
Europe did a crappy job of carving up the mid-east after the two WW's...
America didn't go in their and install a bunch of puppts...Europe installed a bunch of dictators...and that's what's breeding this fanatical strain of Islam..and it aint going away until those leaders are gone...
and you France, need to help clean up your mess...and stop attempting to maintain the status quo for no other reason than financial gain and regional influence.
We never thought you guys were a lap dog...any more than we think the UK is a lapdog...or Israle...valued strategic allies is the term I would have used prior to 2003.
And things are realigning now...
China and India are probably more strategic allies now...and you can thank the last Franco German alliance for that.
Hey Freeze and Slomo...btw, please don't take my views as being personally directed towards you individually...and I am glad to see some Euros participating on the forum...
It broadens the view and discussion base for this forum...
And unlike the libs on this forum, I don't think the world revolves around America and I actually do pay attention to what is going on in Europe...and the rest of the world, at their national level.
So by all means...keep participating, I remember asking slomo to participate 2 or 3 years ago....I guess it took me a while to get you pissed off enough to post
Hey slomo...I have a question for you...concerning Europe.
I see you Slovenians as more of former Eastern Bloc country...one that knows to a great extent thge chains of Socialism...
How can you guys...meaning you slomo, and velik(who I believe is Slovenian) still toe the socialist line...
Surely you see the improvement in your own country since you guys threw off the shackles that hold back...
Secondly...why do Slovenians get defensive when I attack Europe...surely you realize I mean the colonial empires of Western Europe...
After all,, there aren't any countries in the Western Hemisphere that speak slovenian...so why do you bear their guilt? And take offense at comments that are obviously aimed at Western Europe...
Huge differences between Western and Eastern Europe, I conider the Eastern Europeans to largely have their together more than the West at this time... and I don't understand why the more Eastern Europeans(which I consider Slovenia to be, at least in the cultural sense) get upset...surely you can see the difference?
Just trying to be a good Euro?
Fine...but the criticism I aim at Europe(Western) is deserved and factually based...and denying it is like Americans trying to deny that we pollute.
Fascism
Nazism
Socialism
Communism
Anti-Semitism
Racism...
All concepts that took modern root in Europe over the last 500 years or so up until the end of the 20th century.
WWI and WWII were both carried over into the Middle East for strategic and material gain of European countries warring with each other...we were drug into those conflicts, and the UK, France, and the UN(prior to America being a member) are responsible for the current layout of the mid-east, the despots in power there, and the harsh living condition and lack of respect for human life that gives rise to Militant Islam.
It's all true...
And the mid-east is not going to have peace until that is rectified. They'll have opressive silence, but that doesn't stop terrorism...and it's just not right, and no citizen of a free country should argue against that.
And BTW, you notice that most of the guys ripping Beno and Rasho are Libs right?
Last edited by whottt; 05-08-2007 at 06:33 PM.
Hey Whottt, problem with some of these French Libs and Libs
over here is that France has told the ILLEGALS there, that is
what they are and will remain so. Also that the Muslims aren't
changing anything to suit them. That France is what it is: France.
Wished our government would take this lesson from Europe, but
they want.
Wassup with your obsession with illegals today.
Third post about them in three different threads.
Change the subject, already.
Why, it is pertinent to all the post. Look around sometime.
You might want to really read something besides this forum.
it's not "political", it's not "personal", it's just right-wing, stupid xenophobia and chauvinisn to hate an entire country in western Europe.
Seems like a lot of US people actually think well of France
=============
France Counts, for Eight Americans out of Ten
By Jean-Louis Turlin
Le Figaro
Friday 18 May 2007
The time of the "with us or against us" on Iraq Francophobia is over: For 80% of Americans questioned within the framework of a poll for the French-American Foundation - an NGO devoted to strengthening Franco-American relations - it is "very important" or "quite important" to maintain good relations with France during the coming years. But a significant majority of them (62%) declare they don't know what effect Nicolas Sarkozy's presidency will have on the connection between Paris and Washington.
The foundation's president, Nicholas Dungan, sees a "very positive sign" in the first statistic (only one American out of seven deems the Franco-American relationship to be unimportant), but the second "reminds us that too many Americans remain under-informed about European events" (only 57% declare they make an effort in that regard), and "many are unfamiliar with the new government in France." Those who are sufficiently informed to have expressed an opinion with respect to the Sarkozy presidency are many times more likely than the others to deem that it will be positive for transatlantic relations (21% versus 3%). For Nicholas Dungan: "The United States's international experience of the last five years has shown Americans the importance of relations with their historic allies, especially their European allies, notably France and Germany. Great Britain is not enough."
===============
And never forget: Germany and France were right about not supporting the invasion of Iraq, and the US was wrong to invade Iraq.
Who's a bigger friend of US and our military: lap-dog Blair or the French and Germans?
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