Reply With QuoteThat I agree with Brodels.
You can't compare their skillsets directly, but you can evaluate their relative dominance against the rest of the league. Each generally dominates by doing different things, but in th end, you can determine who is "better" within an era.The thing is you can't compare Center Vs PG/SG. The one scenario in my opnion is if on a game of 1 on 1 if the center gets takeout then he wins, if the guard gets the ball then he wins.
Otherwise, you can't say that Jordan was the best player of the 1990s. You could say that Jordan was the best guard of the 1990s, but he wasn't necessarily better than Hakeem.
But you can safely say that Jordan was better, because he dominated more than Hakeem did. Jordan could take over more games for a greater number of years.
That I agree with Brodels.
Well, I think we're talking about the 1990s, and those were undeniably Jordan's best years. He was a rookie in the 1980s.Jordan was a rookie back then, I'm referring to his prime. They're still a lot of people who couldn't hang with Jordan in his rookie years anyway.
And you're right. A lot of people couldn't hang with him his rookie year. He could have been the best shooting guard in the league as early as his rookie season, but it doesn't make him better, than, say, a top shooting guard from the 1960s.
Yeah because Jordan was like 2 year old.
Jordans best years were from 84-90.
84-85:
PPG: 28.2
RPG: 6.5
APG: 5.9
85-86:
PPG: 22.7
RPG: 3.6
APG: 2.9
86-87:
PPG: 37.1
RPG: 5.2
APG: 4.6
87-88:
PPG: 35
RPG: 5.5
APG: 5.9
88-89:
PPG: 32.5
RPG: 8
APG: 8
89-90:
PPG: 33.6
RPG: 6.9
APG: 6.3
Jordan's Career Stat:
PPG: 30.1
RPG: 6.2
APG: 5.2
Wilt's Career Stat:
PPG: 30.1
RPG: 22.7
APG: 4.4
His statistics were better in the 1980s, but don't fool yourself into thinking that he was a better player then. He was a good player and he put up great stats, but he played on crappy teams without any other options.Jordans best years we're from 84-90.
Jordan was at his best after he learned to win. Once he got a decent supporting cast, he began to understand what a bad shot was and could provide the things the Bulls needed to win. Sometimes he scored a ton, sometimes he was more of a distributor. At other times he was quiet until he needed to come up with a big shot.
In Jordan's case, stats don't tell us much. He was at his best in the early 1990s, and he was still great in the middle part of the decade when he lost a little bit of athleticism but made up for it with incredible basketball smarts.
It's not a coincidence that Jordan's teams succeeded in the 1990s.
E20- Wilt was very thin...(Wilt the stilt) but he was a freak of nature...A track star...A gym rat...A professional volleyball player in his 50’s...Jerry West called him the fastest guy on the team...Dr Jack called him the strongest guy in sports...
There is a clip of Bob Lanier size 20 feet crowding Wilt under the basket and Wilt gently brushing Big Bob back with the back of his wrist...Were talking; he pushed the guy out of the key with the back of one arm!
Wilt was a gentle giant on the court....If he played like Shaq or Malone Wilt would have hurt people...Keep in mind...Wilt never fouled out of a game Not Even Once!
People that saw Wilt play in his prime laugh at any Shaq or Kareem comparisons...Wilt was in shape & played every minute of every game...He was not a pampered athlete...Bill Russell & Wilt paved the way for today’s NBA ballas...
Wilt Photos...
www.kskssports.com/ksks_sports/sports_illustrated/1960s/images/si6_6_20.jpg
Wilt in 1960...
www.americanphoto.co.jp/photosearch/Previews/PLX035857.jpg
Wilt & Mohammed Ali....
www.bvbinfo.com/sands/images/16_9.jpg
Wilt with shirt off & a couple of hotties....
espn-att.starwave.com/media/nba/1999/1012/photo/a_wiltinline.jpg
Check out the old guys guns....LMAO....
iwant.on.ca/FavPhotographers/leibovitz-wiltchamberlainwillieshoemaker.jpg
Wilt & Willie Shoe...
You compare statistics.
Well - game is diferent in '80, '90 etc.
Look at that in a team changing contest. What was the players influx(?) to the game - to the winning.
It's all about winning.
You can compare Wilt to other eras by looking at his own era and see his dominance. The numbers are there to do it...It might not be so easy to do in rebounding but it is easily done in scoring. No need to try and do it across eras...no other player from Wilt's era averaged more than 38ppg....about the same as the best from Jordan's era. Wilt averaged 50...it was just as much of a freak in his era as it would have been in Jordan's era.
And you can kind of judge players across era by seeing players who overlapped...
I continually hear people claim that shooting PCT's have gone down, even from the 90's... due to the defense played..I've always thought it was because guys don't place as much emphasis on being high PCT shooters...I think the Olympics taught us that shooting is doing quite well in other parts of the world.
But you can also look at a guy like John Stockton and see that his shooting PCT's remained the same throughout his career...a career that spanned from the run n gun no D 80's to the defense oriented era we have today...and he remained a high PCT shooter and assistman in every one of those eras.
I think the changes in era are due to the talent moreso than the rules...
In the mid 90's it was common for Centers and Forwards to average 27-29 ppg..Malone, Drob, Hakeem, Shaq, Barkley...by the year 2000 it was unheard of...
Execpt by the one player who's prime bridged those eras...Shaq..his averaged never dropped until last season when he had to give up shots to other HOFers.....so I don't think it was the rules that caused the changes...I think what caused the difference in eras was the lack of talent at the center position...the late 80's - mid 90's were the golden age of the center when many talented 7 foot men walked the Earth...right now there aren't as many.
What it all means to me...there's only one Wilt...there was only one in the 60's there would be only one today.....There were only a few Jerry Wests Jordans and Gervins who shot @ or near 50% as 2 guard while leading the league in scoring(we are lucky to have a mini Gervin in Barry who shoots at that PCT)....And there haven't been many Shaqs, Drob's and Kareems and Hakeems either. But no matter how you slice it...Wilt stands all alone with that 50PPG AVG. In his era...in any era.
And baseball players aren't supposed to be able to do what Barry Bonds does in todays era either...I think that proves that Ruth's number had less to do with his era and more to do with him...just like with Barry.
A guy that can hit the ball 500-600 feet just can do it...there aren't many...a guy that can score 50ppg...there's only 1.
Whottt is easily the biggest asshat on FSP.
Not that I deny that...but would you care to state why, or do you just pop off like an idiot with no reason, as a general habit?
Oh wait...you're a LakerFan...if you understood reason you wouldn't be one...never mind. I'll leave you to go burn a car to celebrate something.
I will say that I will definitely look forward to hearing from you this season as your team s u c k s a s s. So be sure to stick around.
1. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2. Shaquille O'Neal
3. Wilt Chamberlain
4. Hakeem Olajuwon
5. Karl Malone
6. David Robinson
7. Charles Barkley
8. Kevin Garnett
9. Moses Malone
10. Bill Russell
One thing I know is- that you can score 50 and loose.
I know in "Wilt's era" it was freaking amazing. But you don't win with statistics. ]
For me Russell is better
why?
He was part of a team, a winning team.
If It was me who creates a team I would rather pick Russell than "the Stilt"
Yes I know -Boston many Allstars
BTW- Lakers-5 HOF- no Championship
But Yes of coure , I understand your point of view Whott
Maybe Arvydas Sabonis should be considered in your list.
True, spurster. An analysis of his stats in the USA alone would not provide much ammunition for debate...but those stats are the tip of the iceberg.
Sabas Stats - NBA
TEAM......G....GS..MPG FG% 3P% FT% OFF DEF RPG APG SPG BPG TO...PF...PPG
Portland 470 314 24.2 .500 .328 .786 1.60 5.70 7.30 2.1 .79 1.05 1.78 2.70 12.0
Here are a some Euroleague stats, though only going back to 89-90.
SEASON TEAM......G PTS AVG 2FGM-A..% 3FGM-A..%....FT M-A %....REB ST AS BL
1989/90 Valladolid 37 856 23.1 315/525 60 28/69 40.6 142/208 68.3 485 41 66 119
1990/91 Valladolid 37 724 19.6 274/502 54.6 14/51 27.5 134/185 72.4 405 30 70 70
1991/92 Valladolid 36 770 21.4 272/496 54.8 24/59 40.7 154/208 74 483 41 89 73
1992/93 Real Mad. 44 767 17.4 274/485 56.5 28/63 44.4 135/179 75.4 537 52 57 82
1993/94 Real Mad. 39 674 17.3 236/376 62.8 22/54 40.7 136/174 78.2 453 52 84 78
1994/95 Real Mad. 42 963 22.9 339/535 63.4 33/100 33 186/245 75.9 526 66 101 97
Total Euroleague since 1989 - 6 seasons (235 Euroleague games)
Avg. 20.27 ppg, 12.3 rpg, 2.2 bpg
There's more out there somewhere on the years prior to 1989...more research needed.
Why am I not surprised that I would open up this thread and see a filibusttter about David Robinson?
Because you are the proud owner of 15-20 nicks, averaging between 2000-10000 posts each, whose total contributions to the board can be summed up as you whining and ing about:
1.Jason Kidd
2.Spurfans being critical of a loss.
3.Ghost Writer
4.Ghost Writer
5.Ghost Writer
6.Ghost Writer
7.Ghost Writer
8.Ghost Writer
9.Ghost Writer
And
10.Me...
Making you the all time king and expert on fillibuster.
Sure, it doesn't take me 1,000 words to convey something which could be written in a 20 word sentence.
Figure it out.
So says you....by my perspective I can't see what you could have possibly had to say in the 50,000 posts you have made on this board that required 50,000 posts.
I think you should just start 4 threads...
1.Sign Jason Kidd
2.Ghost Writer is a negative
3.Some of us didn't dessert the Spurs in 96-97
4.Whott thinks the Coyote is > Drob, Shane Heal > anyone and is a fillibustering .
And we'd pretty much be able to read everything you have ever said on this board just by clicking on 4 different threads.
Irrelevant. The point is that when any topic comes up for discussion you tend to deposit a 2,000 word turd right in the middle of it.
False...at this moment, on the front page, I have posted in a total of 3 different threads. My participation in threads in this forum in the past 3 months is limited to a total of 3 total threads.
One thread...that asked for discussion(this one)...and I feel my points about Drob being under-rated were very valid to this topic and required extensive explanation, since obviously, many ing morons still are barely putting him on the list and in many cases putting 2 teamates who played together and were unable to win a le, ahead of him.
And another...that no one really cared about or was participating in extensively, except for myself and 2 Argentinians.
And there is such a thing as a scroll button...I cannot dominate a topic or an argument unless the person has no mind of his own.
Well that..or unless I get drug into a flame war by morons who are being inconsiderate of the topic starter by contributing nothing to the thread other than antgonistic and derisive personal attacks.
And BTW....Spamming(otherwise known as MarcusBryanting) takes up more bandwidth than a long post.
Exhibit A.
Exhibit B.I think you should just start 4 threads...
1.Sign Jason Kidd
2.Ghost Writer is a negative
3.Some of us didn't dessert the Spurs in 96-97
4.Whott thinks the Coyote is > Drob, Shane Heal > anyone and is a fillibustering .
And we'd pretty be able to read everything you have ever said on this board just by clicking on 4 different threads.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions