Bertans unhappy?
This reminds me of an old story told by UT basketball coach Abe Lemons.
A player walked into his office and said, "Coach, I'm just not happy."
Coach Lemons thought for a moment and then waved an imaginary magic wand over the player's head.
"Well, happiness to you," said Lemons smiling.
I used "net positive" as a general term...you are the ones who want to hide behind analytics to defend your ty arguments.Hes trying hard though
By the way, those same analytics say that Bertans was the Spurs best player this season...and Quincy ing Pondexter was our best player in the playoffs.
But, like I said....agendas.
love ya dexI used "net positive" as a general term...you are the ones who want to hide behind analytics to defend your ty arguments.
By the way, those same analytics say that Bertans was the Spurs best player this season...and Quincy ing Pondexter was our best player in the playoffs.
But, like I said....agendas.
Yeah, because we did so much better with Mills and Belinelli on those situations.So you want Bertans out there going up against Harris and Barton, and getting switched on to Murray and Beasley at every possible opportunity?
What were in the floor for, miss threes? Bertans could have done that while not being a complete traffic come on the perimeter, tbh.We all know that Mills and Beli are defensive negatives at this point. That's not what they are on the floor to do, and Pop still needed to find offense in the limited cards he had to play. Sometimes, you stick with your guns and suffer the consequences, and that's what happened. Bertans was obviously not ready for the moment...he had the worst overall FG%, the 2nd worst 3PT%, and wasn't doing jack on defense.
Stating the obvious? Is preferring to have Bertans playing SF over Belinelli stating the obvious? (It should be, but apparently here it isn't)You are haters because you won't shut up about it. Find a new slant and quit acting like you are Nostradamus for stating the obvious.
Also, what's wrong with being vocal about the things you think your team should do to improve? That seems like perfectly good and healthy fandom, tbh.
i am pretty sure it's not tough to replace his ty 3 points per game in the playoffs.
Yeah, because we did so much better with Mills and Belinelli on those situations.
What were in the floor for, miss threes? Bertans could have done that while not being a complete traffic come on the perimeter, tbh.
Stating the obvious? Is preferring to have Bertans playing SF over Belinelli stating the obvious? (It should be, but apparently here it isn't)
Also, what's wrong with being vocal about the things you think your team should do to improve? That seems like perfectly good and healthy fandom, tbh.
love ya dex
SpursTalk wouldn't be fun without any back & forth. None of us are right...we all just care about our team.
Who would you rather have defending a guy like Barton or Craig, Bertans or Mills/Belinelli?
"Hide behind analytics"I used "net positive" as a general term...you are the ones who want to hide behind analytics to defend your ty arguments.
By the way, those same analytics say that Bertans was the Spurs best player this season...and Quincy ing Pondexter was our best player in the playoffs.
But, like I said....agendas.
What should we do then, argue subjectively without providing any sort of data?
Cunningham played only garbage minutes, I don't know why you keep bringing him up.
On/off is a useful stat that should be looked at with a good enough sample size and adjusting by role. Bertans having a better on/off rating than Aldridge, obvioulsy, doesn't mean he's a better player than LA. It does mean, however, that Bertans is undoubtedly a valuable player for the role he plays. Another way to look at it is that it might mean that Bertans is better at being a role player, than Aldridge at being a first option, for example.
On/Off data is useful. In fact, the On/Off charts that timvp posts are some of the more interesting data points we get in the season."Hide behind analytics"
What should we do then, argue subjectively without providing any sort of data?
Cunningham played only garbage minutes, I don't know why you keep bringing him up. Which is why Cunningham, Pondexter, and perhaps Bertans look better on paper than their actual production showed.
On/off is a useful stat that should be looked at with a good enough sample size and adjusting by role. Bertans having a better on/off rating than Aldridge, obvioulsy, doesn't mean he's a better player than him. It does mean, however, that Bertans is undoubtedly a valuable player for the role he plays. Another way to look at it is that it might mean that Bertans is better at being a role player, than Aldridge at being a first option, for example.
But the data is, and can be, skewed...especially by sample size and/or role. Just in the same way that the data shows Cunningham and Pondexter were "useful" when they were far from that.
I'm not arguing that Bertans wasn't useful over the course of the season...his on/off numbers, shooting percentage, and other statistics support that.
But...he was put in a tough spot against Denver. He is not big enough to guard Denver's bigs, and he is not fast enough to guard Denver's wings. This became quickly evident by the eye-test...and frankly, you can crunch numbers all you want but that doesn't change what you see on the court. Basketball isn't a Calculus exam.
He made matters worse by missing his shots, which mostly seemed to be good, open shots.
As a coach, you have to make a choice...and the guy who can't defend his opponent and isn't making shots gets an easy hook.
I still think Bertans is, and will be, a valuable player next season and hopefully next post-season....but in a sample size of 7 games, I also don't blame Pop for making the decision that he did.
Yeah, and I guess Belinelli is best used opening up the offense playing the 3 and Mills playing the 1.He's best used opening up the offense from the perimeter playing the 4. He's really not much good at anything else to matter.
Retcon away!
That's some top level basketball analysis there, tbh.
Yeah, and I guess Belinelli is best used opening up the offense playing the 3 and Mills playing the 1.
That's some top level basketball analysis there, tbh.
theres a reason i have pavlov blcked
Bertans is a better overall defender than, both, Mills and Belinelli. Metrics support that fact. He's also mobile (and long) enough to be a better option defending perimeter players too. I don't know why folks have such a hard time observing this obvious fact. Maybe it's the fact that Bertans is mobile (and tries hard) enough to many times be scored over, so in the brain of most it looks like he's constantly getting on, forgetting the times where he does get the stop. Not to mention the fact that in the type of plays where Bertans gets scored over, Mills and Belinelli aren't even in the picture, because they are left behind everytime.
Dex, you're my guy but it wasn't hindsight bias...
A large portion of us were calling Patty and Beli being absolutely useless in a Denver series and they went ahead and the bed, with both playing more than DWhite when it mattered most in Game 7....
Don't call it hindsight when people say beforehand that "Pop is going to the bed by relying on his fat koala too much this series" and Pop goes and does exactly that
Not much else matters expect their shooting.Yeah, and I guess Belinelli is best used opening up the offense playing the 3 and Mills playing the 1.
That's some top level basketball analysis there, tbh.
Bertans is the same as them tbh. When they aren't shooting well, they're practically worthless.
But please continue your retcon crusade all summer. You'll never stop until you're proved right.
Which will never actually happen.
Because it's all over and done with.
(a)Bertans got bullied by Millsap and wasn't hitting shots.
(b)Wombat+Belli couldn't stay in front of anybody and didn't hit shots.
So basically the Popsuckers are simultaneously saying that Bertans didn't deserve another chance because of (a) and that giving Wombat+Belli their coach's pet minutes was fine despite (b)?It's like the White/Wombat discussion all over again.
Except Bertans is a vastly superior defender than both. Supported by metrics and the eyeballs of people who don't have theirs deep up Pop's ass, tbh.
I wouldn't have cared if any of them were benched since they weren't hitting their shots.(a)Bertans got bullied by Millsap and wasn't hitting shots.
(b)Wombat+Belli couldn't stay in front of anybody and didn't hit shots.
So basically the Popsuckers are simultaneously saying that Bertans didn't deserve another chance because of (a) and that giving Wombat+Belli their coach's pet minutes was fine despite (b)?It's like the White/Wombat discussion all over again.
Because I said so!
You will never let your agenda go. As predicted.
lol
Since it would have been Pop the one that made the move, of course you wouldn't have cared. Your sole role on the Spurs section of this forum is to act like Pop never made a mistake in his life.
Last edited by DAF86; 05-14-2019 at 06:56 PM.
Saying Mills got overplayed is an understatement. I just don't know what other options Pop had. Yes, White could have done better than Mills and probably deserved the chance but...Pop sticks with his veterans for better or worse (and in this case, it was probably for worse).Dex, you're my guy but it wasn't hindsight bias...
A large portion of us were calling Patty and Beli being absolutely useless in a Denver series and they went ahead and the bed, with both playing more than DWhite when it mattered most in Game 7....
Don't call it hindsight when people say beforehand that "Pop is going to the bed by relying on his fat koala too much this series" and Pop goes and does exactly that
EWhite has a bright future, but he the bed in Game 7 (along with most of the team). I still don't blame Pop for benching him after the way he started.
Forbes was already playing more minutes than any NBA team should ask him to be playing.
Bertans isn't a guard, so he doesn't even belong in this conversation.
Murray was somewhere rehabbing and posting on Instagram.
Lonnie is a good prospect, but...let's be real here. He wasn't ready for that.
It's not like Pop had other options to go to...sometimes, you just have to go with Plan D and hope for the best. That's what happened and the results were predictable.
Ok. No, he isn't. Because you say so.
Because I said so!
You will never let your agenda go. As predicted.
lol
this(a)Bertans got bullied by Millsap and wasn't hitting shots.
(b)Wombat+Belli couldn't stay in front of anybody and didn't hit shots.
So basically the Popsuckers are simultaneously saying that Bertans didn't deserve another chance because of (a) and that giving Wombat+Belli their coach's pet minutes was fine despite (b)?It's like the White/Wombat discussion all over again.
I jumped on the Bertans train for a spell. I even said there was an outside shot he could be an all star. But I don't feel bad for the guy. He played a scared bunny every time the ball was swung to him. Constantly seeing a 6'11 guy with skills dribble away from the basket with no intent on scoring was really hard to watch.
lolwutFinances are just a way to provide for the family with the rest of their lives. It has never been a priority for me
Oh shucks, someone should've told me that that's just how Pop is.
Going with the veteran, even though he's a vastly inferior player, is definitely the right move now that I know that's just how Pop is!
EWhite has a bright future, but he the bed in Game 7 (along with most of the team). I still don't blame Pop for benching him after the way he started.
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