Can't really say Mayo would be a huge upgrade over Green the way the current Spurs' team is constructed. Most of Mayo's positives are in areas the Spurs are already stacked in. Spurs need defense, so technically going from Green to Mayo wouldn't be a big plus due to the defensive downgrade. Might not even be a plus at all. Mayo's basically Neal with worse shooting and better handles. I don't think the Spuirs need a second Neal. Green is fine.
Because if anyone has welshed their way out of betting/bets its been me, not you.
You have been wrong so much, then just point out the times I am when I have won more actual bets on here than I have lost (not that it matters).
I try and have discussions with you but you say things like "advanced stats, market value and their bad years don't matter" so it's hard to really talk.
I've never welshed on a bet to date, and I'm not interested in talking to you I want to make a bet.
Do you accept yes or no?
So you are saying you didn't say the Spurs were not a contender and couldn't make it to the WCF?
If you did say that, are you willing to leave the site forever?
You were also wrong about the Chandler trade (I was right) and you said the Mavs weren't contenders the year they won it (you quit on the team).
How are you so sure what DG true potential is? He just came off playing his first full season in the NBA.You're going way out of your way to convince me of something that you're never going to convince me of
The "eyeball test" as you put it allowed me to be right about them spurs and heat as well as just about every other playoff series this year. I do use stats but I don't feel that this one is quantifiable. OJ has been misused and was disgruntled these past 2 years IMO, and that speaks nothing as to his true potential. We all already know what Danny Green's potential is. Comparing a Spot up shooter to a guy who has the ability to create his own shot and make plays is flawed. Also, Mayo probably isn't truly worth only 4 mil. The consensus here was that he was worth about 8-9 mil. The FO did good on this one.
And what does being disgruntled have to do with performance on the court if he is as great as you think he is?
Truth is, in Memphis Mayo lost his starting gig to Tony Allen because Allen provided as much O and better D than Mayo.
No because you proposed bet is silly - especially the method you are using. You are also moving the goalposts on the agrument. I never said OJ can't have a better year than DG. I said it's not laughable when you factor in stats, %'s & defense to say you would rather have DG than OJ.
I said that the spurs were in a mix of darkhorses with several other teams not named the heat.
The real bet here to be made, in this thread about OJ mayo, is the OJ mayo/danny green bet I proposed. Why are you furiously trying to move the goalposts and change the topic? Do you accept my bet or no? Thats the ONLY thing I'm interested in further discussing with you.
Exactly, you won't take the bet because you know good and well who the better player is and should really shut the up.
My negro D, what you said was just dumb...own it and move on, brotha. We all say stupid on here, but you gotta own it.
Start to have a serious discussion and you avoid it, move the goalposts and try to make a stupid bet that wasn't even the point of what I was saying. Props
Last edited by DPG21920; 07-17-2012 at 06:13 PM.
You are an idiot
D
No - you are in the same boat as M>S when it comes to basketball. You like it, hang around here but know you really don't care to dig deep or use anything besides the eye ball test and emoticons.My negro D, what you said was just dumb...own it and move on, brotha. We all say stupid on here, but you gotta own it.
I really have failed to see how saying OJ is a more naturally talented player, but I'd rather have DG for the Spurs system is dumb. If I said something stupid (like the Heat would beat the Mavs
This is not one of those cases - or the "throw out half his career" & "OJ has unlimited potential and we know Danny's even though they are the same age and Danny has been in the league less years" arguments have not persuaded me.
Again, I was never arguing a huge gap - in fact it was the opposite with regards to this argument.
Is that an emoticon? I thought real hardcore basketball discussers didn't use those?You are an idiot
No - you are in the same boat as M>S when it comes to basketball. You like it, hang around here but know you really don't care to dig deep or use anything besides the eye ball test and emoticons.
I really have failed to see how saying OJ is a more naturally talented player, but I'd rather have DG for the Spurs system is dumb. If I said something stupid (like the Heat would beat the Mavs
This is not one of those cases - or the "throw out half his career" & "OJ has unlimited potential and we know Danny's even though they are the same age and Danny has been in the league less years" arguments have not persuaded me.
Again, I was never arguing a huge gap - in fact it was the opposite with regards to this argument.
nobody agrees with me
I troll only because the basketball discussion is not high level enough
I'm still confused as to why saying DG > OJ is such a big deal.
No - you are in the same boat as M>S when it comes to basketball. You like it, hang around here but know you really don't care to dig deep or use anything besides the eye ball test and emoticons.
I really have failed to see how saying OJ is a more naturally talented player, but I'd rather have DG for the Spurs system is dumb. If I said something stupid (like the Heat would beat the Mavs
This is not one of those cases - or the "throw out half his career" & "OJ has unlimited potential and we know Danny's even though they are the same age and Danny has been in the league less years" arguments have not persuaded me.
Again, I was never arguing a huge gap - in fact it was the opposite with regards to this argument.digging deep. That was seriously one of the gayest things you've ever said here. Calm down, dude...John Hollinger has made such gots out of basketball fans...don't be one of them.
Lemme help you out:
So why on Earth would you take a scrub over him? I think we all can agree Pop is the best current coach in the NBA and knows how to maximize the talent of his players--right?In this role?
The defensive argument is also incredibly weak. The difference between Danny Green's defense and OJ Mayo's defense is inconsequential in the big scheme of things (i.e. it's not a big enough difference to swing a series or change playoff seeding). Danny Green shat the bed when it mattered most on defense, and Pop lost faith in him to the point where he played sparingly off the bench.
Lastly, there's a reason why Pop found Danny Green on the scrap heap of some chicken eastern euro league.
It's not - but once they get set to scoffing and talking about things they don't really know (you can tell by the way M>S evaluates DG and says things like "OJ has a lot of potential, but Danny has shown everything") there isn't really stopping them.
They also like to twist arguments when the quotes are right there.
Because Danny isn't a scrub and because the league is loaded with guys with "natural ability" (JR Smith, OJ Mayo, Anthony Randolph, Eddie Curry) that for whatever reason (mental, at ude or not as good as we thought) don't perform.
Lemme help you out:
So why on Earth would you take a scrub over him? I think we all can agree Pop is the best current coach in the NBA and knows how to maximize the talent of his players--right?
The defensive argument is also incredibly weak. The difference between Danny Green's defense and OJ Mayo's defense is inconsequential in the big scheme of things (i.e. it's not a big enough difference to swing a series or change playoff seeding). Danny Green shat the bed when it mattered most on defense, and Pop lost faith in him to the point where he played sparingly off the bench.
Lastly, there's a reason why Pop found Danny Green on the scrap heap of some chicken eastern euro league.
The difference in defense is inconsequential? I disagree. Danny had a very good first two playoff rounds and was essentially a playoff rookie. If you are going to ding him for not having a great WCF as a playoff rookie and disregard his first two rounds - well, that just goes back to what I was saying about the way you and M>S argue. So for OJ, we ignore the fact his own team didn't want him, that he's declined every year, that he's proven to be nothing more than an inefficient chucker and that his market value was less than guys like Green, Diaw, Novak, Crawford, Line depsite having all this "potential". That is the same logic as saying "that's how Danny was found on the scrap heap". He's been given a chance and is now growing as a player. He could bust, but since he has defense, he can still be useful. OJ, without offense (and his offense sucks at the moment) is useless.
Also, if you are going to cite Green "choking" why not Mayo? Mayo's playoff averages: 10 points, 3 rebounds, 2 ast on 35% shooting (including 27% FG last year).
Green: 6 points, 3 rebounds, 1 ast on 41% FG with better all around better advanced stats too (although it's close, which was my argument from the get go).
It's just a case of guys not knowing a player and it being popular to scoff.
DG isn't a scrub...he started and did reasonably well. It's gonna sound corny as to say but he's got a good head on his shoulders and he works hard. He's certainly worth the 4m he just earned. Also, how many players get benched by their coach in the WCF after starting most of the year and are eager to get back to work with that same team? That's almost unheard of. I guess what I'm saying is that it's hard to maximize talent when the person who possesses it is a chucker with a huge ego.
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthre...layer+pairingsThe defensive argument is also incredibly weak. The difference between Danny Green's defense and OJ Mayo's defense is inconsequential in the big scheme of things (i.e. it's not a big enough difference to swing a series or change playoff seeding). Danny Green shat the bed when it mattered most on defense, and Pop lost faith in him to the point where he played sparingly off the bench.
Looking at the pairings, Green was really good on both ends. Where he shat the bed in the WCF wasn't on defense, it was on offense when his shot stopped falling and they literally stopped guarding him. If he can figure a way to not completely up the Spurs offense when his shot isn't falling, we might be able to pull out another W in that series.
There's also a reason OJ Mayo lost his starting gig to Tony ing Allen.Lastly, there's a reason why Pop found Danny Green on the scrap heap of some chicken eastern euro league.
But OJ Mayo would win in 1on1 monkeyball so obviously he has the edge.
He did a splendid job on Randy Foye and Gordon Heyward. Much props.
yes his defense was inconsequential in the playoffs. They played 2 vastly inferior playoff opponents (one of which was the walking wounded), and they were never in doubt. Put OJ Mayo in there and they still wipe the walls with both teams--are you really going to argue against that?
Also, don't group my opinions with his just b/c multiple posters are calling you on your . You're the one who said OJ has a higher ceiling and is more talented...that's a direct quote and your words weren't twisted--yet you don't think the best current coach in the game with an excellent track record of developing talent can work his magic with him?
Explain yourself.
HAyward brah
And dude is a baller
OJ had his chance against LAC
You can't say the defense throughout the regular season (which played a large role in getting the best record in the West) and his defense against CP3 (which helped sweep two teams and give the Spurs their best shot at getting to the finals) was not worth anything. That is just a ridiculous argument to prop up the no defense playing, no shooting Mayo.
I am lumping you in with him because you don't know what you are talking about. All you do is base your opinions off of name recognition. I know you don't watch a ton of basketball nor do you look at stats to help shape your position. I said OJ has the higher ceiling and has more natural ability - I also already explained why I would take DG in spite of that. I also said that the gap isn't far either way at least not to the point where you start stupid threads like this or "Dwill v Mills" to scoff, but you and M>S keep failing to grasp that.
The posters that are calling me on my " " are the same ones saying "throw away half of OJ's career when evaluating" and "Dwill v Mills" and "He's a scrub! I don't care what the stats or market says!" so I don't really care
I also love how you ignore how OJ s the bed in the playoffs worse than Green and how you just randomly say even though OJ is a horrific defender and Green is a solid one how it just doesn't matter somehow.
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