Woj: Spurs Held Players-Only Meeting to Implore Kawhi's Potential Return to Lineup

[sasaint]

maybe it's time to start thinking there's a chance he's not a Spurs soon

I have been wondering about that chance since November.

[coachmac87]

The media trying real hard to get kawhi to leave to a bigger market... the media too

That’s something nobody is really talking about...they’re desperate for the Lakers to be relevant..but it’s great for their businesses. They were doing the same for Westbrook and then he took the $$$..

[offset formation]

Good time to post this again, tbh..it was probably Parker and Manu doing the talking, though..

How have I not seen this yet... has me rolling.

[r0drig0lac]

I thought it was 100% Pop's decision to hold him out for the rest of the series last year, but right now I'm thinking it might have been Kawhi. He may have answered with something like this " no I can't play, are you crazy?! I got a sprained ankle."

for now everyone is making assumptions (and this is normal), the problem is when some act as if something had already been confirmed

[Ice009]

Bottom line, if it was me instead of Kawhi and I was told it would not worsen the injury any further by playing on it, I would have been out there a couple of months ago trying to play through it.

If it was anything to do with an Isaiah Thomas situation, that wouldn't have stopped me from playing at all. I would have gotten a second and maybe even 3rd opinion, but if they all said it's OK to play, I'd 100% at ease about playing.

I know it's very easy for me to say behind a computer screen, but unfortunately the reality is, different people have different make-ups.

[cd021]

I still lean toward them offering and him accepting the super max this summer, but at the same time, I don't know how the relationship between him and his teammates (specifically the long time ones, who outside of Ginobili, will probably be around for a while) gets repaired.

This is basically the two professional cardinal sins among teammates in one: 1) Either not playing despite being medically cleared or doing so but giving little to no effort and 2) Spending little time around the team, not keeping them in the loop and forcing them have to answer on your behalf constantly.

I tend to agree. If they feel that he is right going forward (which is probably easier said then done considering he has been to play and he still hasn't) then bringing him back on the Super max is still probably the right move. Pop was able to repair the relationship with LMA and I would think that Pop's relationship with Kawhi and his relationship with Parker and Manu ,and others that might be discontent, would be able to help smooth over any rift between the two sides.

[offset formation]

the most ridiculous season in spurs memory

can you guys imagine the reaction on ST if it was LMA acting this way? he'd be eviscerated

Truth bomb.

[offset formation]

I've postulated in other threads that Kawhi has become a hypochondriac due to Pop's abnormal obsession with injuries. It screwed up Kawhi's mind.

We're seeing karma at work. For years, Pop has screwed fans, networks and the league by routinely sitting healthy players. So what does he get?... A top 5 player who is afraid to play due to pain, and will not play even when the most conservative medical staff in the league has cleared him.

Karma's a .

[cd021]

Duncan also missed entire playoffs due to injury, and kawhi played on the same sprained ankle twice, until zaza sprained it a third time...and guess what ppl said...he should have sat before it got worse...now ppl are mad at him for not going out there when HE can feel somethimg isnt right...go yourselves

Duncan could've played by Pop shot him down, it's actually the opposite here.

Kawhi can play but isn't.

[gameFACE]

He didn't injury his other ankle until the last game of the Seattle series where he hit the game winner to take us to the WCF after playing through the pain IIRC.

For some reason I keep thinking he had hurt one ankle earlier in the regular season and then the other during Spurs/Pistons in March or so. Articles aren't coming up in my 60 second search. I remember Pop saying something like "it's going to be jelly in the morning" after he sprained it in Seattle. In any case he played through it and won his 3rd ring.

[offset formation]

Also, I’m not surprised to see Manu/TP being the one’s speaking out. Obviously, times have changed. Kawhi is very obviously not a Tim Duncan (nor is that fair to expect that).

We should expect however, for the face of a franchise, for him to be a better communicator and respect his teammates enough to stay close, cheer them on and be a leader. SA shields Kawhi because of his nature from most of the duties of a franchise superstar. But someone looking to get paid 200M as the face of franchise owes his teammates a of a lot more than he’s given them.

Not only watching them battle and fight and scrap, but then to have to answer non-stop questions from media/fans on his behalf? Kawhi has royally screwed his teammates over. They would understand (and it was reported in this recent meeting that they still do understand) and support him not playing through an injury. They don’t understand why he’s not around and distanced himself from them.

But back to my main point of Manu/TP doing the talking. They are legends who grew up with Tim and they themselves put the team first. Kawhi is obviously like the 99% of other NBA players who don’t think like that (and that’s fine), but Manu/TP aren’t used to it, don’t like it and they are on their last legs. They don’t care if they alienate Kawhi because they know they don’t have much longer anyways.

As much as TP/Manu love the Spurs, they are legends that are fading and don’t want to deal with this crap and would prefer their last years be spent with the best chance possible of going out winners.

Good take.

[Leetonidas]

For some reason I keep thinking he had hurt one ankle earlier in the regular season and then the other during Spurs/Pistons in March or so. Articles aren't coming up in my 60 second search. I remember Pop saying something like "it's going to be jelly in the morning" after he sprained it in Seattle. In any case he played through it and won his 3rd ring.

You are correct. Duncan injured his ankle pretty bad against the pistons in Detroit. He missed the rest of the season and came back for the playoffs. He did also tweak the ankle against Seattle in the second round. I still vividly remember their crowd cheering as he writhed in pain.


But that was different. Tim had played the whole season til then. Kawhi has barely played at all

[cd021]

Kuzma, Ingrim +picks for him? Who says no?

Yuck.


Phoenix could end up with the 1st, 15th, 16th, and 31st pick (all based on current standings) I would suspect that they'd be willing to part with the 1st, 15th, and 31st -if it really came down to it, maybe even without an assurance from Kawhi long term. They haven't made the playoffs in 9 years and don't look like their going to do so for at least the next three the way things are currently going.

Cleveland and Boston could also top an L.A. offer.

[offset formation]

Yuck.


Phoenix could end up with the 1st, 15th, 16th, and 31st pick (all based on current standings) I would suspect that they'd be willing to part with the 1st, 15th, and 31st -if it really came down to it, maybe even without an assurance from Kawhi long term. They haven't made the playoffs in 9 years and don't look like their going to do so for at least the next three the way things are currently going.

Cleveland and Boston could also top an L.A. offer.

Indeed. the Lakers.

[gameFACE]

Duncan also missed entire playoffs due to injury, and kawhi played on the same sprained ankle twice, until zaza sprained it a third time...and guess what ppl said...he should have sat before it got worse...now ppl are mad at him for not going out there when HE can feel somethimg isnt right...go yourselves

Mad?

Here's the moral of the story while your hot headed - Duncan wasn't the face of the franchise back in '00. But he became the leader and willed the team to win later, hurt or not. Great players do that. Kawhi isn't 19. He's been here for some time now. If you want to be the face of one of the best franchises in sports history you either communicate or play through it. If he's really hurt, so be it. But don't pansy around. Be a leader.

[sasaint]

Get rid of him in the off-season. Manu will retire, Tony will go somewhere else and rebuild this thing. You guys seriously want to build around this dude after this? He is not made of what it takes to be that Guy. He is not that Guy. Enough is enough..

Two of the things I have said for several weeks were 1) Kawhi is not a leader and does not have any desire to be the face of the Spurs' franchise, and 2) the team is experiencing a leadership vacuum. We desperately need a leader to take the team's reins from the remaining old guard. That guy is not Kawhi.

[sasaint]

I tend to agree. If they feel that he is right going forward (which is probably easier said then done considering he has been to play and he still hasn't) then bringing him back on the Super max is still probably the right move. Pop was able to repair the relationship with LMA and I would think that Pop's relationship with Kawhi and his relationship with Parker and Manu ,and others that might be discontent, would be able to help smooth over any rift between the two sides.

Smoothing things over with Kawhi probably means reducing LMA's touches. Then the team might be back where it was at the end of last season. I personally have never thought LMA and Kawhi meshed well in an offense or a locker room.

[cd021]

For some reason I keep thinking he had hurt one ankle earlier in the regular season and then the other during Spurs/Pistons in March or so. Articles aren't coming up in my 60 second search. I remember Pop saying something like "it's going to be jelly in the morning" after he sprained it in Seattle. In any case he played through it and won his 3rd ring.

He rolled his ankle in March against Detroit, I watched that and remembered him being helped to the locker room. He was gimpy during the Denver series but I also remember him rolling the other ankle in game six of the WCSF @ Seattle too. Still, he carried us to 3

[MannyIsGod]

Also, I’m not surprised to see Manu/TP being the one’s speaking out. Obviously, times have changed. Kawhi is very obviously not a Tim Duncan (nor is that fair to expect that).

We should expect however, for the face of a franchise, for him to be a better communicator and respect his teammates enough to stay close, cheer them on and be a leader. SA shields Kawhi because of his nature from most of the duties of a franchise superstar. But someone looking to get paid 200M as the face of franchise owes his teammates a of a lot more than he’s given them.

Not only watching them battle and fight and scrap, but then to have to answer non-stop questions from media/fans on his behalf? Kawhi has royally screwed his teammates over. They would understand (and it was reported in this recent meeting that they still do understand) and support him not playing through an injury. They don’t understand why he’s not around and distanced himself from them.

But back to my main point of Manu/TP doing the talking. They are legends who grew up with Tim and they themselves put the team first. Kawhi is obviously like the 99% of other NBA players who don’t think like that (and that’s fine), but Manu/TP aren’t used to it, don’t like it and they are on their last legs. They don’t care if they alienate Kawhi because they know they don’t have much longer anyways.

As much as TP/Manu love the Spurs, they are legends that are fading and don’t want to deal with this crap and would prefer their last years be spent with the best chance possible of going out winners.

You're probably right that it's not fair to expect him to be Tim Duncan in some respects, but I do expect a guy trying to make 40 million a season to be the kind that is willing to sell out for his teammates and it really doesn't seem like that is Kawhi. I'm really shocked, honestly, but I don't know how this can't be on him after all we've heard this season and what we know of PATFO and Tony and Manu.

[cd021]

Smoothing things over with Kawhi probably means reducing LMA's touches. Then the team might be back where it was at the end of last season. I personally have never thought LMA meshed well in an offense or a locker room.

Some of this is on Pop tbh. They seldom ever ran P&R together, instead it was Kawhi and Pau with LMA spotting up in the left corner. Kawhi would either pullup, drive, or pass back to Gasol for an open 3, Aldridge would pretty much be left out of the play.

If Kawhi is back next season, I hope that Pop continues to start LMA at center with Murray, Green, Leonard, Bertans and filling out the starting lineup. LMA would be the primary screener for Kawhi with Bertans and Green helping to space the floor on those possessions. During LA's post ups, Leonard, Bertans and Green can space the floor. The Spurs have better much better offensively and fairly even defensively with LMA at center as opposed to Aldridge and Gasol units that would figure to be much better if Kawhi is healthy.

Leonard does need to do a better job of seeking Aldridge out and stop resorting to Kawhiso's as much. They should be able to help each other gain mismatches; LMA pulls the opposing big away from the rim ( Bertans would do the same with the other one) teams generally wouldn't be able to switch the p&r or risk having Kawhi being guarded by a 4 or 5 and Aldridge by a 3 leading to a miss match on the perimeter and in the post.

[cutewizard]

Just trade Leonard for Irving, period

[cutewizard]

Or send Kawhi to NY for the Unicorn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[duncan2k5]

Some of this is on Pop tbh. They seldom ever ran P&R together, instead it was Kawhi and Pau with LMA spotting up in the left corner. Kawhi would either pullup, drive, or pass back to Gasol for an open 3, Aldridge would pretty much be left out of the play.

If Kawhi is back next season, I hope that Pop continues to start LMA at center with Murray, Green, Leonard, Bertans and filling out the starting lineup. LMA would be the primary screener for Kawhi with Bertans and Green helping to space the floor on those possessions. During LA's post ups, Leonard, Bertans and Green can space the floor. The Spurs have better much better offensively and fairly even defensively with LMA at center as opposed to Aldridge and Gasol units that would figure to be much better if Kawhi is healthy.

Leonard does need to do a better job of seeking Aldridge out and stop resorting to Kawhiso's as much. They should be able to help each other gain mismatches; LMA pulls the opposing big away from the rim ( Bertans would do the same with the other one) teams generally wouldn't be able to switch the p&r or risk having Kawhi being guarded by a 4 or 5 and Aldridge by a 3 leading to a miss match on the perimeter and in the post.

Wait... Kawhi needs to do a better job at finding LA? u have a prob with Kawhi isoing, but it's ok when the black hole touches does it? U act as if LA ever passes... I swear the way u guys talk, LA has several burner accounts on here...

[dbreiden83080]

How will Tony rebuild this thing from somewhere else?

He can find new mates wives to ..

[dbreiden83080]

Just trade Leonard for Irving, period

He has little trade value right now. This is what sucks. He has derailed his value. Rep is that he is soft, won't play though injury, not a leader. Nobody wants that.. Curry has sprained his bad ankles like 5 times this year. And he has had short rests and come back. KL would have been sitting out the whole year just with those sore ankles.