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I'm quite certain that the entire election has now changed and that McCain is going to win convincingly.
Probably one of the biggist mistakes Obama could make when talking against McCain:Problem here is, he probably just lost everyone who is a small business owner with employees, and employees of trades.He's trying to suggest that a plumber is the guy he's fighting for.
How many plumbers you know that are making a quarter-million dollars a year?
How can Obama hate the working class and small business owners so much? McCain wasn't fighting just for Joe, but all the hard working Joe's out there.
I'm quite certain that the entire election has now changed and that McCain is going to win convincingly.
Would you say there's 10% of the population in the country making over $250,000+/year? More, less? Whatever it is, it's never more than probably 30%. That means that when he says that, he's catering to the other 70% of the population. It's not really that complicated to see why...
But what do you think many small business owners will be telling their employees?
Yes, he is using class warfare, but in this case, it will very likely backfire on him.
What are they gonna tell em?
I honestly doubt it. It might be 'socialist', but I think it's a great way to appeal to the majority of the population out there...
They can say many things, including "I may have to let some of you go if Omaba raises my taxes."
But he already has those people that it appeals to. If you think the "Robin Hood" mantality appeals to the majority, you really don't talk about such things with very many people.
Most plumbers I know cling to guns or religion.
Loaded questions are stupid.
Fact check: Plumber Joe's taxes
McCain has entrepreneurs spooked about tax hikes, but fewer than 2% of small business owners would pay more under Obama's plan.
By Stacy Cowley
Last Updated: October 16, 2008: 12:30 PM ET
(CNNMoney.com) -- In speech after speech, presidential candidate John McCain hammers on the claim that his rival Barack Obama will raise taxes on many small businesses.
At the debate on Wednesday night, McCain said, "The small businesses that we're talking about would receive an increase in their taxes right now."
More typically he has said: "What [Obama] hasn't told you is that he would tax half of the income of small businesses in America," a line used in La Crosse, Wisc., last week.
Should small business owners fear for their wallets if Obama is elected? Not the vast majority, business and tax experts say.
To make its claim, according to a McCain spokesman, the campaign counts as a small-business owner any taxpayer who files a Schedule C, E or F - the forms used to report gains and losses from business ventures and farms.
Using that definition and citing IRS data, the campaign notes that "56.8% of total small business income is earned by businesses in the top two rates, which Barack Obama has pledged to raise."
It's true that Obama has proposed raising taxes on the top two income rates.
But there are three main problems with McCain's charge.
What is a small business?
First, it relies on a broad definition of what counts as a small business, including everyone who files a Schedule C, E and F.
But most people who file those forms don't run a business for a living: Those forms are also used to report income from freelance and consulting work, real-estate rentals, and most other non-salary sources.
For example, McCain and Obama both file Schedule C returns, thanks to their book royalties - but they hardly should be considered small business owners.
In 2005, there were 21.5 million Schedule C returns filed, according to the IRS.
A more realistic definition of small businesses turns up far fewer firms. The Small Business Administration estimates that there were 6 million small businesses in 2005, as measured by those with fewer than 500 employees and with staff on the payroll other than the owner.
Who pays?
Second, even using the broad definition of small business that McCain likes, very few owners would see their own taxes rise.
That's because the lion's share of taxable income comes from a small number of wealthy businesses. Out of 34.7 million filers with business income on Schedules C, E or F, 479,000 filers fall into the top two brackets, according to an analysis of projected 2009 filings by the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center.
The other 34.3 million - or 98.6% - would be unaffected by Obama's proposed rate hike.
That includes Joe "The Plumber" Wurzelbacher, whom McCain invoked nearly two dozen times at the debate Wednesday night to illustrate the plight of the average worker and small business owner.
"Joe wants to buy the business that he has been in for all of these years ... he wanted to buy the business but he looked at your tax plan and he saw that he was going to pay much higher taxes," McCain said.
In an interview afterward with WTOL, Wurzelbacher acknowledged that he'd still like to eventually buy the plumbing company he works for but that he wouldn't yet be hit by higher taxes.
"I want to set the record straight: Currently I would not fall into Barack Obama's $250,000-plus,"
Few owners are that lucky in business. In a member survey conducted late last year, the National Federation of Independent Business (NFIB) found that only 14% of respondents said they had $200,000 or more in annual income.
As Tax Policy Center fellow Len Berman recently toldFortune Small Business: "Most owners of small businesses have small incomes."
What gets taxed?
Third, even if you're one of the rare business owners making enough money to be affected by Obama's proposed tax increases, you still won't see a big hike in your tax bill.
McCain's claim that Obama "will increase taxes on 50% of small business revenue" - the line he used in the second presidential debate - is incorrect because of how income is taxed.
If a business owner falls into the top bracket, that doesn't mean that all of his or her income is taxed at the highest level.
For example: If a small-business owner makes $210,000 in taxable income, he edges into the 33% bracket, one of the two top tax rates that Obama would like to raise.
But he would pay the higher tax only on the amount that exceeds the cutoff - in 2007, the two top tax rates applied to single filers with income of $160,850 or more and joint filers with income of at least $195,850. As a single filer, this business owner would see his federal taxes increase $1,475 under Obama's plan, which calls for raising the 33% tax rate to 36%.
"While Obama does favor raising the top two rates, the quote is not true because not all the small business income of those in the top two rates is taxed at the 33% and 35% rates," said Gerald Prante, a senior economist at the nonpartisan Tax Foundation.
The bottom line: McCain's claim only works by using an overly broad definition of what counts as a "small business" - and even with that definition, fewer than 2% of business owners would be hit by Obama's proposed rate increase. For those who are affected, the increase would be levied only on a part of their earnings, not all of them.
CNNMoney.com writer Emily Maltby contributed to this report.
Apples and Oranges.
Still, 479,000 small businesses will see increased tax rates. Sorry, that's 479,000 too many.
game changer
I'm a small business owner and I'm better off under Obama's tax and health care plan.
Just off the top of my head, the other small business owners I know and talk to will be better off under Obama's plans as well.
And that's with him hating us. Go figure.
I understand.
You fall into the "Tax Credit" area where the govenment might give you back more than you paid in estimated taxes.
How Anti-AMerican...
With the economy in pieces as it is, I'm sure those employees don't feel any safer. I mean, that's exactly why they're voting for Obama in the first place.
I also would be the first to tell you that if I ever have a boss that even suggests the way I should vote, I would go vote for the other guy, and the day after the election I would give him my middle finger along with my resignation.
The problem is that right now, people hate more the 'Trickle down' mentality than the 'Robin Hood' one.
Don't worry, I'm already bracing myself to hear 4 years of ing and complaining from you, Anti.Hero and 101A.
I guess.
I worked hard, got an education, and started a business providing a service to the community I live in. I built the business from the ground up and was the only employee in the beginning. The business has grown and I now provide wages to two full-time employees.
If that makes me anti-American, then so be it.
Do you think it's right to take a tax credit if it gives you money back you didn't pay in taxes?
I guess.
I worked hard, got an education, and started a business providing a service to the community I live in. I built the business from the ground up and was the only employee in the beginning. The business has grown and I now provide wages to two full-time employees.
If that makes me anti-American, then so be it.
That's what Obama's doing for small of the small businesses.
, tax breaks are one thing, but tax credits are un-American.
Only 15% of all households have $100K+/year
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Househo..._United_States
Median household income is just under $50K.
Is he doing this out of his sense of hatred for small business and small business owners?
So Obama "hates" small business owners so much that he is giving them a tax credit in excess of what they pay in taxes?
Pardon me.......
I didn't think it could get any worse but this Joe the Plumber charade takes the cake.
Guy is not even a plumber, nor does he earn $250,000 a year. Game changer indeed.
Wild Cobra is a moron.
"Plumber Joe" was on NPR saying that he realizes that he won't get taxed under Obama's tax plan.
That er is just against paying taxes.
Oh . . . . newsflash . . . NPR reported that "Plumber Joe" owes $1,700 in back taxes.
Democrats would be well advised to refrain from digging up a bunch of dirt on this guy in the next week and making another "Liberal Media Martyr" out of him, but I know you guys will eagerly this up for yourselves as you always do.
Who's digging up anything?
That dumbass made himself stand out.
He was making the rounds on T.V. shows.
Of course they're going to look into who he is and what he's all about.
And, it turned out that deadbeat isn't even paying his god damned taxes, like you and I do.
It also turns out that he doesn't even have a plan on buying the plumbing business that he works at. Which by the way, earns less than $200,000 a year.
When they asked him if he makes $200,000 a year, he said that he makes "no where near that much". So, he has no reason to about the increase in taxes for those who make more than $250,000 a year under Obama's plan.
Please keep the facts strait and in context. Joe will not see a tax increase because the Plumbing company isn't his. He said he was thinking of buying it. If he buys the company, he will now have a larger tax burden than he originally bargained for when he decided to buy.
Keep in mind how often NPR twists the facts. Besides, Joe owes the state of Ohio $1,182.98. Not $1,700.
Is 'Joe the Plumber' really a plumber? That may be debatable
I think you left out part of the quote. Where's the part where he says "He's only a plumber?" Please include the rest of the quote.
And is biggist bigger than biggest?
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