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Oh brother! Reaction times?
They shouldn't have been out past curfew and driving toward a checkpoint at a high rate of speed. Everything's a calculation and a conspiracy with you. Sometimes... happens.
Yahoo NewsWASHINGTON (AFP) - A US satellite reportedly recorded a checkpoint shooting in Iraq last month, enabling investigators to reconstruct how fast a car carrying a top Italian intelligence official and a freed hostage was traveling when US troops opened fire.
The report, which aired Thursday on CBS News, said US investigators concluded from the recording that the car was traveling at a speed of more than 60 miles (96 km) per hour.
Giuliana Sgrena has said the car was traveling at a normal speed of about 30 miles an hour when the soldiers opened fired, wounding her and killing Nicola Calipari, the Italian agent who had just secured her release from a month's captivity.
<snip>
CBS said Italian investigators refused to accept that the Americans were justified in shooting so quickly, arguing among other things that the checkpoint was not properly marked.
Nice 'reconstuction' from very fortunate satellite images I may add. Nothing fishy here...well, maybe a little fishy...
Counter PunchThe Killing of Nicola Calipari
Sgrena has told CBS that the car she was in was going 30 mph. At 30 mph, a car is going 15 yards per second. So, according to the U.S. military, they fired warning shots within 2.7 seconds of flashing a warning light, and used "deadly force" 2.3 seconds after that. And actually, if the U.S. military story were true and the car were really travelling at "high speed", let's be generous and call that only 45 mph, that's 22 yards per second, meaning 1.8 seconds between warning lights and warning shots, and 1.6 seconds between warning shots and deadly shots.
Now, there are variables, but typical perception plus reaction times are of the order of 1.5 seconds, that is, the time it takes to perceive a problem (such as a warning signal) and move your foot to the brake. That means that, according to the military's story, shots were fired at the vehicle less than 0.3 seconds after the vehicle could possibly have begun to slow down, even if they were paying close attention and they had immediately perceived that the alleged flashing light was meant as a signal to stop.
However that 0.3 second is actually overstated, because the gunman (or gunmen), attempting to perceive if the car was responding to their warning signal to slow down, have perception and reaction times of their own, so in fact, they were pulling the trigger before they could possibly have perceived if the car were slowing down. And likewise, if the so-called warning shots were supposed to have served any purpose whatsoever, once again the "deadly force" shots were being squeezed off well before the warning shots could possibly have had any effect.
And on that basis, the military has "exonerated itself" from any wrongdoing.
Oh brother! Reaction times?
They shouldn't have been out past curfew and driving toward a checkpoint at a high rate of speed. Everything's a calculation and a conspiracy with you. Sometimes... happens.
so, then they were speeding toward a checkpoint at night... FIRE! FIRE! FIRE!
better than being blown up. if the dumb ass italians can't figure not to speed at night in an american controlled area, they deserve to die....
You sound skeptical. are you really stupid enough to believe that the US does not have 24/7/365 real time satellite coverage over the entire Middle East?Nice 'reconstuction' from very fortunate satellite images I may add. Nothing fishy here...well, maybe a little fishy...
(don't answer that)
Oh wait, I forgot, all the satellites are pointed at your house
god you're a dumb ass
From reading your posts I would've thought you'd agree.
the deserve to die was a joke. but come on head. they know they are in a dangerous ing place.. that is why they are there. and they know that the americans are on patrol constantly. why the were they speeding??? american soldiers can't wait for a speeding car to pull up to the checkpoint first to see who it is. it is their life on the line..
Can you say Ooppss?
BBCItaly media reveals Iraq details
By David Willey
BBC News in Rome
Entire pages of the US report had been blackened out
Italian media have published classified sections of an official US military inquiry into the accidental killing of an Italian agent in Baghdad. The 40-page report was censored by the Pentagon before being officially published on Saturday.
Italy has refused to accept the US report's findings and is to publish its own version of events later this week.
Details of the official report were published in newspapers on Sunday with censored material restored in full.
Missing text
A Greek medical student at Bologna University who was surfing the web early on Sunday found that with two simple clicks of his computer mouse he could restore censored portions of the report.
DIFFERING ACCOUNTS
US military: Car approaches checkpoint at high speed Troops attempt to tell driver to stop with arm signals, lights and warning shots Soldiers shoot into engine
Italian government: Italy makes all necessary contacts with the US for safe passage
The driver stops immediately when a light flashes 10m away. At the same time, shots are fired into car for 10-15 seconds
Accounts in full
Profile: Nicola Calipari
Italy's papers reject US findings
He passed the details to Italian newspapers which immediately put out the full text on their own websites.
The missing text contains the names and ranks of all of the American military personnel involved in the killing of Nicola Calipari, the Italian agent who was given a state funeral and awarded Italy's highest medal of valour.
It also reveals the rules of engagement in operation at the military checkpoint near Baghdad airport which have been contested by the Italian authorities.
The censored sections include recommendations that the American military modify their checkpoint procedures to give better and clearer warning signs to approaching vehicles.
The official Italian report on the incident expected to be published this week will accuse the American military of tampering with evidence at the scene of the shooting.
The Americans invited two Italians to join in their inquiry, but the Italian representatives protested at what they claimed was lack of objectivity in presenting the evidence and returned to Rome.
Relations between Rome and Washington remain tense.
Here is a link to the entire 37 page do entRepubblica.It
And the blacked out version: Link
Who's handling national security at the Washington press office again? Mickey Mouse?
So what Dan? It changes nothing. The incident is still just an accident and a case of friendly fire. The fact that the troops now are trying to improve the way the engage unknown vehicles should be considered a positive. You have been proven wrong twice on this case alone. The women reporter at the very least was highly exaggerating what happened that night.
yeah, it changes nothing.. italians were still speeding.. unfortunate accident. "SPEED KILLS!"
It was the Italians' fault. End of story...
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