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Not really. The Mavs in 2006 and 2007 had VASTLY improved defense than before Nash. With Nash in the lineup, the Spurs would've beaten the Mavs in 2006 with Parker averaging like 36 a game.
What do you guys think? I think 2 MVP caliber players in the same team would at least amount to one championship.
Not really. The Mavs in 2006 and 2007 had VASTLY improved defense than before Nash. With Nash in the lineup, the Spurs would've beaten the Mavs in 2006 with Parker averaging like 36 a game.
If Nash stays then San Antonio might have 3-peated.
If Nash stays, so does Nellie. And they continue to score 115 a game and lose in the playoffs with Nash, Finley, Dirk and Bradley. Nash was a borderline All Star in Dallas, in Phoenix they built their team around him.
as opposed to what they are doing now?
The question was whether it was a mistake, though. It wasn't, unless you think they would've won a championship with Steve Nash and Nellie ball.
truth is we'll never know.
the problem with the Mavs isn't their PG, it's that their star player is soft and doesn't show heart when backed into a corner. A team takes on the mentality of their leader.
The Mavs enjoyed their most successful stretch as a franchise without Nash or Kidd.
The point was obvious to anybody who has an IQ above room temperature.
It's funny as the Mavs-Spurs series draws to a close to see the blame laid at the feet of one Dirk Werner Nowitzki. Funny, because he's been the best player on either team while getting little to no help from his teammates, and because the 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th-best players in this series are all Spurs. Makes you wonder what series some people have been watching.
i dont get it
Yeah the improved defense was due to Nash not being there. It had nothing to do with Avery Johnson.
I'll never understand this either. And people saying he doesn't play w/ heart or that compe ive "championship" fire is laughable. The guy's a stud.
The opinion that he shouldn't be the #1 option on a team in order for it to succeed is debatable, I suppose, but to say he's not the scariest person on the floor w/ the ball in his hands is ludicrous. There's a very select number of people in the league that, as soon as they get the ball, I naturally assume it's going in. He's in that dreaded group.
u cant put a prime mvp nash on the mavs cause his not the same player when he was on the mavs, and who knows if he wouldve peaked or carry out that mvp performance cause the teams system in dallas is not built around him, he will just avg 10apg compared to what he was gettin on the suns
tbh the mavs were ing stacked when they had dirk, nash, jamison, and the younger versions of antoine walker and michael finley...plus the young up and coming howard and marquis daniels. I think this whole notion that dirk hasnt had the same amount of talent as other nba greats who has won it is bull . Fire Nelson, hire Avery and with that team the Mavettes wouldve been pretty scary.
This thread is five years old.
Did the Suns make a mistake with Joe Johnson?
It's pretty clear the Suns made a mistake with Joe Johnson. If you can find a way for the Mavs to get past the Spurs and into the Finals with Steve Nash and Dirk Nowitzki on the floor together, then I'd have to concede the Mavs made a mistake.
Nash would've helped against Miami and Golden State, but they never would've gotten that far in the case of the former, and they still would've had to play the Spurs in the case of the latter.
The Mavs got tired of watching him get curbstomped by Mike Bibby and Tony Parker in the playoffs.
Last edited by Findog; 04-27-2010 at 12:06 PM.
Cuban made the mistake of getting Jason Kidd. Nash is a painful move in hindsight as well along with all the various coaching dramas the Mavs are renowned for.
Yeah the improved defense was due to Nash not being there. It had nothing to do with Avery Johnson.
Findog already explained that Nellie never leaves if Nash is still there, and yeah it had a lot to do with Avery Johnson, but they weren't going to make that defensive leap as long as Nash is on the team, and given how Nash clashed with a coach who liked to micro-manage anything, it's fair to say Nash and Avery wouldn't have been able to co-exist.
Unless all you're comparing is when they happened, that's an asinine comparison. Joe Johnson is everything the Suns need right now while the Mavs had a ceiling they'd never get over as long as Nash was their PG.
Apparently my statement went right over everyones heads.
I was saying that this has been discussed to death, much like the Joe Johnson debate.
That is, lets talk about other things we were talking about five years ago...
But for the record, I dont believe for one second the Mavs wouldn't be better with Nash instead of Kidd and Dampier right now.
That's why I had the qualifier "Unless all you were comparing is when this happened"
All things considered, it clearly wasn't a mistake. We don't know where the health of Nash's back would be if not for Aaron Nelson, the player Nash was on Dallas was not worth what Phoenix paid him (the player he was on Phoenix from 2005-2007 is irrelevant to the question since he was never going to be that player on Dallas), and it's pretty impossible to deny the fact Dallas would not have gotten by San Antonio in 2006 as a Nellie ball team.
As much as it hurt to lose JJ, the loss is overblown and it's stupid that people talk about it like Phoenix lost the top 5 SG JJ is on Atlanta. As long as JJ stayed in Phoenix with D'antoni as coach, he would have never developed into more than a spot up shooter who played off Nash most of the time, got scarce ball handling as back up point and would have never developed an off the dribble game or taken the next step. A few seasons of D'antoni's system would have done to JJ's career what one season of his system did to Quentin Richardson.
One of the most uninformed opinions Ive ever read.
When D'Antoni took over for Frank Johnson, Joe Johnson was a kid with huge confidence problems who couldnt average double digits a game.
That same season (before Nash), Joe started putting up 30 point games and near triple doubles.
Joe was phenomenal in his role with Nash, and to say he was a spot up shooter makes me believe you didnt even watch the Suns back then. Amazing how many floaters, isolations and post-fadeaways I remember from a dude who was just a spot up shooter.
I hated D'Antoni as much as the next guy, but to say that he wouldnt be the player he is today if he stayed in Phoenix is ridiculous, because he's pretty much the exact same player he was in Phoenix.
Judging by the number of les they've won since Nash left, pretty much status quo...
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