Debate overall backcourts

[Rummpd]

Everyone is giving Pistons edge in media. Not so fast, Spurs also have a damm good backcourt and in reality, it depends on if Parker "brings it" and attack aggressively and smartly. Manu will be there and although not the scorer always of Wade is just as dangerous in clutch time.

If Parker does, Spurs right there with them period. Not to disrespect Billups but he is not facing an aging Gary Payton or Derek Fisher in this finals matchup.

Debate.

[DetroitFolly]

I think its an absolute gem of a matchup. Billups and Hamilton v Parker and Ginobili...probably the two most UNDERRATED backcourts in the game. Neither point guard is a Nash/Kidd type player, but they are quietly efficient.

Why Rip Hamilton is not considered a superstar is beyond me. All he does is show up and score 20 ppg every night, and hits clutch jumpers in the fourth quarter. And, I think he has the energy to both keep up with Manu on the defensive end, and run him ragged coming off all of those screens on the offensive end.

Parker might be more explosive than Billups...but Chauncey is incredibly strong, and also hits huge shots for this team.

Frankly, I think its a wash.

Sheed v Duncan is also pretty darn close, but the edge of course goes to Duncan...if his ankle isn't affecting his mobility too much. Sheed's ability to hit the three MIGHT force Duncan to abandon the paint more, opening up the lane for penetration by the Detroit Guards and Tayshaun.

As for Ben and Nazr...look for an absolute BRAWL under the hoop. If Detroit can work the offensive boards, it could be a long series for San Antonio.

The real question for me is...who will guard Tayshaun Prince? He's got Bowen by a couple of inches already, and his wingspan is massive. That could be tough, if we can get Bowen (a SOLID, SOLID defender) in foul trouble.

[Rummpd]

You make solid points for a "Pistons" fan!

[orhe]

i don't know about tayshaun, the guy hits jumpers etc and post up quite a bit.
the success rate of his post usually depends on the position where he catches the ball.

if he gets it at jump hook range he was pretty good (albeit he'll struggle a bit more w/ Manu guarding him (coz manu is so so tough to postup on). (he did burn manu on the last game, but that was w/o duncan guarding the middle)

if tayshaun prince emerges as a scoring threat kudos to him, but w/ the spurs drive to defend i don't think he'll get off at all. (Tay was also scared to shoot during the 4th quarter of game 7 too bad the heat didn't notice that. but damn he was scared)

[DesiSpur_21]

The real question for me is...who will guard Tayshaun Prince? He's got Bowen by a couple of inches already, and his wingspan is massive. That could be tough, if we can get Bowen (a SOLID, SOLID defender) in foul trouble.

Ginobili handles Prince - Spurs got to live with this matchup.

[Slo spurs fan]

I think that bench players gives Spurs a little more chances vs Pistons.

Spurs starters = Pistons starters, BUT:

Spurs bench >>>>>>> Pistons bench.

Spurs in 6.

[nkdlunch]

The backcourts looks like are gonna cancel each other out. I agree, Spurs in 6.

[coz]

I'm not so sure our bench is so much greater than the piston's....

IMO:

Billups > Parker
Manu > Rip
Prince > Bowen

The great thing about this finals is how similar these two teams are. I think the big difference in this series will be Manu's ability to create outside of the offense.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

Starting backcourts? I think it's a bit of a push. Billups hits clutch jumpers but if Tony gets aggressive he can really get the whole team moving. And Ginobili and Hamilton are a couple of damn energizer bunnies. I think where the real advantage exists for the Spurs is in the depth of the backcourt. The Spurs have Beno and Barry off the bench, while the Pistons bring in Arroyo and Hunter. Hunter's D is pretty good but his O is lacking, and from what I've seen Arroyo hasn't had much impact when he's been in.

[geerussell]

The starting backcourts are kind of even. The spurs will find it hard to stop hamilton from scoring and the pistons' achilles heel is a point guard who can dribble penetrate so parker will be a hand full all series long.

I'd go so far as to say Parker is the key to the whole series. If detroit can't find an answer defensively to keep Parker in front of them, it could be a short, ugly series in favor of the Spurs. If the pistons can find that answer, they have a puncher's chance at winning.

[SPARKY]

I'd give a slight edge to Detroit in the backcourt. The problem is, the Spurs' edge in the frontcourt more than makes up for that. Detroit is highly dependent on their backcourt for their offensive production. For the Spurs, when all else fails you have a Tim Duncan to go to in the post.

It's going to be the relative weakness of the Pistons' offense that is the deciding factor in this series.

[Xolotl]

My question is what has happened to Ben Wallace he just doesn't seem to have his normal amount of energy. Is he hurt or just beat up by Shaq?

[The Mask]

I'd give a slight edge to Detroit in the backcourt. The problem is, the Spurs' edge in the frontcourt more than makes up for that. Detroit is highly dependent on their backcourt for their offensive production. For the Spurs, when all else fails you have a Tim Duncan to go to in the post.

It's going to be the relative weakness of the Pistons' offense that is the deciding factor in this series.

I don't see a major advantage for the Spurs in the frontcourt. While Duncan is better than any one Piston player, the combo of Sheed, Ben, and McDyess may be overall better than the Spurs. I think the Spurs better prepare for a huge jump in intensity that Den, PHX, and SEA can't match. Those teams play no D. Det has played against better teams this playoff run. PHX was a good team but everyone knows you can't win the le with a run and gun style.

[The Mask]

My question is what has happened to Ben Wallace he just doesn't seem to have his normal amount of energy. Is he hurt or just beat up by Shaq?

He was just taken out of his game by Shaq. He came up big last night with that monster dunk in the fourth.

[SPARKY]

I don't see a major advantage for the Spurs in the frontcourt. While Duncan is better than any one Piston player, the combo of Sheed, Ben, and McDyess may be overall better than the Spurs.

TD
Mohammed
Horry
Nesterovic
Massenburg

Yes, TD is the deciding factor but overall the Spurs' frontcourt has much more depth, can match whatever style you want to play, and yes, again, the best frontcourt player on the court.

I think the Spurs better prepare for a huge jump in intensity that Den, PHX, and SEA can't match. Those teams play no D. Det has played against better teams this playoff run. PHX was a good team but everyone knows you can't win the le with a run and gun style.

Sure, but can the Pistons' O handle it when their offense faces such a dominant and complete defense? The Pistons don't have anyone they can reliably go to in the post. The Spurs can easily turn their bigs into jumpshooters and limit them to one and done. Detroit fans seem to be forgetting that they will be facing the best defense in the NBA. It's one thing to struggle to score when you are facing the Pacers...

[SWC Bonfire]

My question is what has happened to Ben Wallace he just doesn't seem to have his normal amount of energy. Is he hurt or just beat up by Shaq?

"Tell your old man to drag Walton and Lanier up and down the court for 48 minutes..."

[SWC Bonfire]

I think the Spurs better prepare for a huge jump in intensity that Den, PHX, and SEA can't match. Those teams play no D.

Obviously didn't ask Manu why they were trying to rip his head off in the earlier rounds. You can't "flop" a shot to the face.

[The Mask]

TD


Sure, but can the Pistons' O handle it when their offense faces such a dominant and complete defense? The Pistons don't have anyone they can reliably go to in the post. The Spurs can easily turn their bigs into jumpshooters and limit them to one and done. Detroit fans seem to be forgetting that they will be facing the best defense in the NBA. It's one thing to struggle to score when you are facing the Pacers...

Sheed and Prince can both post and Billups would likely post Parker up to force a double if Parker can't stop him. Dice can post too. Pacers are our main rival and play good D. We are their major obstacle to the next step. It is that kind of test that will help DET.

[SPARKY]

Sheed is not a post player. If you are trying to post up Prince you aren't going to go far with that. Dice could be useful but even his post game is pretty much just a turnaround J.

[mookie2001]

whats to debate
san antonio is clearly superior
yeah billups has "strength" on parker but who cares, according to espn andre miller was the "strongest" PG of all time
manu owns rip in everyway but maybe shooting mid range jumpers, thats what rip and billups are going to be doing all series is chunking up jumpers, which they are good at, but they cant score enough or shoot a high enough % to win

[1Parker1]

I don't see a major advantage for the Spurs in the frontcourt. While Duncan is better than any one Piston player, the combo of Sheed, Ben, and McDyess may be overall better than the Spurs. I think the Spurs better prepare for a huge jump in intensity that Den, PHX, and SEA can't match. Those teams play no D. Det has played against better teams this playoff run. PHX was a good team but everyone knows you can't win the le with a run and gun style.

Right because the 76ers, injury depleted Pacers team, and injured Shaq and Wade team are so much tougher then the hottest team in the NBA post AS break, the suprise 3 seed in the West, and the team with the best record in the NBA--despite not playing defense. Are you on crack?

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

It seemed like Rasheed got scared out of the post kind of easily against Miami. He'd try to take it into the paint every once in a while against Haslem, but when the ran the Zo'Neal lineup he started living at the three point line. If the Spurs can keep him out there I think that's big because he can be a dangerous 3 baller if he can get some points in the paint first and get into the flow of the game, but if he starts his game shooting out there he won't be nearly as threatening. Posting Prince or Billups is a bit of a gamble with the Spurs shot blockers looking to help. The Heat didn't rotate well at all on D, but that's not a mistake the Spurs will make much. And Dice I think is better off a pic and roll for that baseline jumper rather than forcing a post matchup. If he's being covered by anyone but Horry in the block he's going to be giving up size and athleticism.

[fekz]

whats to debate
san antonio is clearly superior
yeah billups has "strength" on parker but who cares, according to espn andre miller was the "strongest" PG of all time
manu owns rip in everyway but maybe shooting mid range jumpers, thats what rip and billups are going to be doing all series is chunking up jumpers, which they are good at, but they cant score enough or shoot a high enough % to win

Im just gonna dismiss that as the fan in you coming out.

Billups - Parker: Advantage Pistons. While parker is known for his explosive quickness and unblockable floaters, billups has the ability to post him up, and theres not much he can do. Billups can do pretty much everything TP can. Billups is known to hit extremely clutch shots with no remorse when they count. TP is explosive, but Billups is a closer.

Rip - Manu: Wash. Both of these guys serve the same purpose. penetrate, score and distrubute if necessary. They cause defenses to collapse in the paint, then can finish, or distribute the ball to a Rasheed Wallace or Tim duncan.

Prince - Bowen: Advantage Pistons. While bowen is an excellent defender, I don't see him having an offensive explosion in this series that tayshaun can. I wouldn't be surprised to see tayshaun switch off to manu to stop the penetration he's known for, while rip temporarily guards bowen because of his role in the Spurs offense.

'Sheed - Duncan: Advantage Spurs (I'm not that much of a homer). While 'Sheed's in and out game could tire duncan, Duncan is consistent down low, and is known for hitting clutch shots. He is a closer. 'Sheed is an igniter. The advantage is with the Spurs, but will it be exploited?

Ben - Nazr: Advantage Pistons. Ben is a defensive monster. Period. Defensive rebounds, offensive rebounds, key hustle plays, clean ups off misses, and the occasional jumpshot. Nazr is OK, but its clear the advantage is to the Pistons Mainly because of the defensive hustle in Ben Wallace.

Pistons bench - Spurs bench: Advantage Spurs. Just having robert horry and brent barry alone speaks volumes. dice (as we like to call him) well be huge for us, and so will lindsey, but for every two points they score, those guys can erase and increase with a three. Rasho, Devin, and glenn rob are all decent players, but this advantage comes because of Horry/Barry.

All of this is subject to change, other matchups could be exploited, so im not basing my prediction off paper advantages.

Pistons in 6. Too hungry, Too much to prove.

[samikeyp]

Too hungry, Too much to prove.

I agree...that is why I say Spurs in 6.

[Supergirl]

The real question for me is...who will guard Tayshaun Prince? He's got Bowen by a couple of inches already, and his wingspan is massive. That could be tough, if we can get Bowen (a SOLID, SOLID defender) in foul trouble.

Robert Horry.