That footage of Tim Duncan....

**texbumTHElife** · 06-17-2005

... sitting on the bench sulking is really going to haunt me. Every time I see that I cant help but feel disgusted. I know what Tim Duncan has meant to this franchise but that footage makes me almost want to re-think his place in not only Spurs but NBA history.

I think the Spurs have what it takes to win this thign and I still think they will but Tim Duncan needs to wake up. Being straight up out played by Antonio McDeyess is unacceptable.

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

yup. right on the money.

whats happend in this series is kinda weird. before the 2 games against detroit (in the finals) manu was still having an INCREDIBLE playoff run. but all of a sudden he's getting star treatment, in the press and on the court, and he doesnt know how to deal with it???

and tim duncan... he's so used to getting star treatment, and also just relying on his talent - that it doesnt seem like he wants to work really hard to keep it. i know he's slowed because of the ankles and he's not 100% -- but he was good enough to not lose focus in the last few series. (for more than one game anyway)

tim needs to put up or shutup... and so does manu... even though it seems like its a bad thing to do the whole "rely on 2 stars" -- its not. you can still play like a team, like they have the whole season, the whole playoffs. this added attention shouldnt be killing them or frustating them... it should be a kick... they should want to drive even harder into the lane... and get hit even harder by the wallaces on the forearms... even take a few offensive fouls early... to get the other team in trouble late.

thats actually what the refs are expecting.

but so far 2 games into the "new-look" spurs... they're not. and i agree with you 100% on tim... if he doesnt show some nuts now (without david to take the blame) if he doesnt make these guys regret how they're guarding him in this series and they lose it... people should look at that for his future legacy.

**cheguevara** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by constantstate

but all of a sudden he's getting star treatment, in the press and on the court, and he doesnt know how to deal with it???

WTF u talking about??? Manu is used to being the star in Europe he was the MAN and Argentina National team also.

**ididnotnothat** · 06-17-2005

To rethink Tim's place in NBA history is ridiculous.

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by cheguevara

WTF u talking about??? Manu is used to being the star in Europe he was the MAN and Argentina National team also.

well thats why i put the ??? there. did you read that part man?

the whole point im making is that this is JUST LIKE europe and argentina... except its the nba finals. if he wants that s om... go get it. so far... nothing.

**Phenomanul** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by constantstate

yup. right on the money.

whats happend in this series is kinda weird. before the 2 games against detroit (in the finals) manu was still having an INCREDIBLE playoff run. but all of a sudden he's getting star treatment, in the press and on the court, and he doesnt know how to deal with it???

and tim duncan... he's so used to getting star treatment, and also just relying on his talent - that it doesnt seem like he wants to work really hard to keep it. i know he's slowed because of the ankles and he's not 100% -- but he was good enough to not lose focus in the last few series. (for more than one game anyway)

tim needs to put up or shutup... and so does manu... even though it seems like its a bad thing to do the whole "rely on 2 stars" -- its not. you can still play like a team, like they have the whole season, the whole playoffs. this added attention shouldnt be killing them or frustating them... it should be a kick... they should want to drive even harder into the lane... and get hit even harder by the wallaces on the forearms... even take a few offensive fouls early... to get the other team in trouble late.

thats actually what the refs are expecting.

but so far 2 games into the "new-look" spurs... they're not. and i agree with you 100% on tim... if he doesnt show some nuts now (without david to take the blame) if he doesnt make these guys regret how they're guarding him in this series and they lose it... people should look at that for his future legacy.

Series is not over yet...

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by ididnotnothat

To rethink Tim's place in NBA history is ridiculous.

why? he's the most talented guy on the court in this series and he is in his prime. thats not hype, thats fact. if he cant adjust, or press the issue and get two lesser players (good - but lesser by a mile) in foul trouble or make them change what they're doing... than why not rethink whether or not he's the greatest PF of all time, or even if he's good enough to win without a really good/used to be great.. second bigman like david?

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by hegamboa

Series is not over yet...

i know. i love the spurs. i think they've done a great job in the playoffs (aside from these last two games) but someone has to be telling them to get with it... cause damn.

**boutons** · 06-17-2005

"he is in his prime"

absolutely not. I was amazed to watch Tim playing on NBATV Classics or old Playoffs game to see how many more moves he had, how fast he was. For age and/or injuries, Tim 05 is not in his prime.

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

he came out of college in his prime... i think you're right about that... but technically, this is the age where bigmen are usually at their peak/prime age. a couple of years after today, and its all downhill.

**HubieBrownBuysOffMe** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by constantstate

yup. right on the money.

whats happend in this series is kinda weird. before the 2 games against detroit (in the finals) manu was still having an INCREDIBLE playoff run. but all of a sudden he's getting star treatment, in the press and on the court, and he doesnt know how to deal with it???

and tim duncan... he's so used to getting star treatment, and also just relying on his talent - that it doesnt seem like he wants to work really hard to keep it. i know he's slowed because of the ankles and he's not 100% -- but he was good enough to not lose focus in the last few series. (for more than one game anyway)

tim needs to put up or shutup... and so does manu... even though it seems like its a bad thing to do the whole "rely on 2 stars" -- its not. you can still play like a team, like they have the whole season, the whole playoffs. this added attention shouldnt be killing them or frustating them... it should be a kick... they should want to drive even harder into the lane... and get hit even harder by the wallaces on the forearms... even take a few offensive fouls early... to get the other team in trouble late.

thats actually what the refs are expecting.

but so far 2 games into the "new-look" spurs... they're not. and i agree with you 100% on tim... if he doesnt show some nuts now (without david to take the blame) if he doesnt make these guys regret how they're guarding him in this series and they lose it... people should look at that for his future legacy.

Ho-kay, now you're David Robinson. You've heard for years that you're soft, that you don't have what it takes to be a champion. Then you win two les in 4 years, and suddenly, your career is validated, ho-kay?

So now, you're Tim Duncan. You BEGIN you're career by winning two les in 4 years, so you don't get tagged with a 'soft' label. But you struggle for a couple of games in one NBA Finals, and everyone suddenly turns on you.

Now, you're a Spur fan. You've been through the likes of Uwe Blab, Mike Smrek, and Peter Gudmundsson. So you'd think you'd recognize a great player, versus a piece of flotsam, when you see it. But apparently, you don't because you're a fickle idiot.

**BillsCarnage** · 06-17-2005

this one?

**JamStone** · 06-17-2005

I'm a Piston fan trying to talk objectively, so take this with a grain of salt ...

Watching that footage of Tim sulking on the bench needing encouragement from Pop made me feel like the Pistons had beaten him mentally. He was so frustrated and distraught, that he just had to put his head down and sulk.

Now OBJECTIVELY, or even if I were to put myself in the shoes of a Spurs fan, last night was the PERFECT TIME for Tim Duncan to get himself EJECTED from the game. There was that horrible miss of a call when Ben raked his arm early in the game, and that was not the time to do it. But, in the second half, I think there were a couple of times where Tim got fouled and did not get the call. Even though they were not as egregious as the Ben Wallace "steal/hack," when the game was out of hand and the Pistons were about around 20, it would have been good to see Tim Duncan DEFIANT and egging the officials to throw him out of the game. Challenge the officials and call the crap and make them kick you out.

I think in a blowout loss, it could help the rest of his teammates in terms of confidence, getting an edge or a chip on their shoulders, and as a fan, I'd look at that as a highlight in a game without any for the Spurs.

As great as Tim Duncan is and as classy and non-flashy and unassuming as he is, when your team gets beat that badly, as the leader (silent or not), Tim needed to give the team a boost or a lift for game 5. Not playing for the last 6 minutes and sulking on the bench (in my personal opinion) was not a good way to do it.

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

questioning a guy's legacy is different than calling him a bum. and you must be close to hubies age (if thats posible) because you didnt read the part where i said... if they lose the series...

Ho-kay, now you're Hubie Brown, a former respected coach turned television analyst. A good job where no one questions you about facts and details. So you come out of retirement at age 175 to prove to yourself you're not dead.... yadda yadda...

**constantstate** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by JamStone

I'm a Piston fan trying to talk objectively, so take this with a grain of salt ...

Watching that footage of Tim sulking on the bench needing encouragement from Pop made me feel like the Pistons had beaten him mentally. He was so frustrated and distraught, that he just had to put his head down and sulk.

Now OBJECTIVELY, or even if I were to put myself in the shoes of a Spurs fan, last night was the PERFECT TIME for Tim Duncan to get himself EJECTED from the game. There was that horrible miss of a call when Ben raked his arm early in the game, and that was not the time to do it. But, in the second half, I think there were a couple of times where Tim got fouled and did not get the call. Even though they were not as egregious as the Ben Wallace "steal/hack," when the game was out of hand and the Pistons were about around 20, it would have been good to see Tim Duncan DEFIANT and egging the officials to throw him out of the game. Challenge the officials and call the crap and make them kick you out.

I think in a blowout loss, it could help the rest of his teammates in terms of confidence, getting an edge or a chip on their shoulders, and as a fan, I'd look at that as a highlight in a game without any for the Spurs.

As great as Tim Duncan is and as classy and non-flashy and unassuming as he is, when your team gets beat that badly, as the leader (silent or not), Tim needed to give the team a boost or a lift for game 5. Not playing for the last 6 minutes and sulking on the bench (in my personal opinion) was not a good way to do it.

wow i thought about that too. that he should have tried to get tossed in the second half... or at the very least pop should have... pj... someone.

objectively: pistons are playing tough... they're supposed to... the spurs arent supposed to get calls at detroit early. the spurs are supposed to draw attention to themselves... and it seems like they just shrank away from any confrontations... period.

**MadDog73** · 06-17-2005

Hmmm. Not a bad idea at all. The Spurs needed someone to spark something.

If Tim was so frustrated that he couldn't contribute on the court, he might as well get himself ejected.

(I'm not advocating this, but would a flagrant foul against Ben or Rasheed be out of the question? Just as long as Tim doesn't get suspended....)

**Dirty_Sanchez** · 06-17-2005

Originally Posted by BillsCarnage

this one?

Did anyone think that Pop kept his hand on Duncan leg just a little too long last night? It was making me uncomfortable just watching it.

Sincerely,

Tommy Chong

**Vashner** · 06-17-2005

I would get fouled out at least... take it to the hoop Tim..

Also don't forget your backboard shot man...

Don't let thugz push you around... man tell Sheed "your momma" and stuff
to get him fouled out...

etc..

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