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Player genuflection es no bueno.
Only two players have never lost in the Finals appearing 4 or more times in the last 40 years.....that is MJ and Duncan. They are a combined 10-0.( and we are talking non role players...not Robert Horry and Scottie Pippen)
Duncan has also won just as many Finals MVP's as Magic and more than Bird.....once again...MJ and Duncan account for 9 Finals MVP's combined out of their 10 championships.
And for the Kobe fans...Duncan even has more regular season MVP's as well.
If Duncan wins his 5th ring this year and plays like he is and wins his 4th Finals MVP...we are no longer talking Duncan vs. Kobe....but Duncan as a top 3 player of all time with MJ...and everyone else gets to argue who is #3.
Player genuflection es no bueno.
I didn't want to start a whole thread about this, but this thread seems about as good a place to ask my question as any other.
If the playoffs ended today who would be the MVP? Is it Duncan? Tony? Someone Else? I can't quite figure it out.
Drachen- its all about match-ups. Duncan carried us through the playoffs into the Finals the last time...but Parker had a great matchup in the Finals and won the MVP. If we face the Heat with no Bosh....look out...Duncan just showed he is fresh and almost averaged 20 and 10 on Blake Griffin. If we make the Finals and if the matchup is right(Miami)...Timmy wins his 4th Finals MVP...if we face Boston...Parker does because he would have to outplay Rondo.
With Duncan's resurgence, he's been the best player on the team this playoffs. It's still Tony's to lose if we make the finals.
/thread
LeBron James is, obviously.
What's he won?
It's not about what he won. It's about what he will win, obviously...
That's my point, though... he has incredible potential. His ceiling is immense, and he's realized it to become a truly incredible regular season player, but he hasn't won anything yet. So when he actually does what he should be capable of, then we'll talk some more.
Right now, he's still captain of the Karl Malone Brigade.
Nobody can match Karl Malone in terms of wilting down in big games. His clutch meltdowns could only rival that of Wilt Chamberlain's, but only without two rings.
To be specific, I mean that even if LeBron's career ended tonight in a freak car accident, he's won the le "best player ever to not win a ring." He's a tremendous player, and not being great under pressure is a knock on him, but it still doesn't change how freaking good he is.
But until he actually wins the rings, I've got Duncan higher.
Even if he wins one or two, I still probably have Duncan higher. He could have picked nearly any franchise, and any of them would have done whatever he wanted to build a team around him. If he doesn't bring home at least 3, it's his own fault, and he should be penalized for it historically.
yes, Duncan is the best player in the post-Jordan era, and I've known this since 2003.
Don't even mention Lebron James in this conversation. That's an insult to Tim Duncan. As of now, Duncan is a top 5 all time player. James is merely a top 25.
It's Duncan and Kobe.. Lebron will join them when he starts collectingand stops just stuffing stat sheets...
It's kind of hard to understand why someone that talented isn't winning it all each year. There's no one that can really guard him.It's Duncan and Kobe.. Lebron will join them when he starts collecting
exactly after mike duncan and kobe bar none most success
Id say he was better than top 25. Even without a championship hes still top 10.
clipps is for Tim jazz for TP we need a tie breaker... nice we have OKC
If you value individual performance over winning, sure. But if you think the most important thing you can do on a basketball court is lead a team to a le, then the first 10 spots on your list go to guys who have.
Here's 11 guys (in more-or-less chronological order), who led multiple teams to les:
Russell, Wilt, Kareem, Magic, Bird, Isiah, Jordan, Hakeem, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe.
I have all of those guys ahead of LeBron until he can do that.
I thought we were talking about post Jordan era. Out of the players of ALL time he's probably NOT in the top 25.
Gotcha. Yeah, I'd certainly go for Top 10 post-Jordan.
until he gets more help then wade,bosh he will win nothing
24-2!!
You are on a roll!
Shaq has 4 rings, and was the best player on 2 of those teams; he and kobe were equals on the 3rd ring, and wade was the man for his 4th.
Kobe was the best player/co player on the 3rd of the first set, and was the best player on the recent two championship teams.
Duncan was the best player on every Spurs team. Tony and Manu had GREAT series in every playoff, and obviously tony got finals MVP once. But Duncan was still the best player on each spurs championship team.
It is close, and Kobe and Shaq are worthy of discussion, but those numbers are a simple way to make the case that Duncan is the best champion post-Jordan.
Best regular season player? Another story.
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