Reply With Quote
TD is not the same position so it wont be compared, I think TMAC would have destroyed Jordan in his time. One on one of course, Jordan never really faced talent like that of Kobe or TMAC in his days.
Cannot include whole list but full article for subscribers is at: http://www.hoopsworld.com/member/article_8312.shtml
Refers to players in the mix for impact on the game as the next Jordan.
"The Timbers that Ought to Get More Consideration"
Lets start with the player that many of you might immediately would dismiss in the comparisons, as he is not a marketing dream, i.e., Tim Duncan.
However, like Shaquille O'Neal below, a strong case can be made that his impact on "winning basketball" is approaching that of Jordan's.
Mr. Duncan's resume right now is arguably the most impressive so far of NBA players - or at least those with more than five years of service. Duncan has three les, 2 MVPs, has been first team NBA each year in the league, and is a 3 times finals MVP. He is also a superb defender and his career figures to be on the upswing with the addition of some substantial talent to an already championship squad in the Spurs.
Right there with Duncan is the "more media friendly", Shaquille O'Neal, who is still the most dominant interior force in the game. Like Duncan he has three les (sharing those with Kobe Byrant below), and three finals MVPs. He is also won 2 scoring les and like Duncan and Kobe Bryant has been correctly placed on several All NBA defensive teams.
"Now Those in the Current Discussion as Rated by this Editor"
1. Kobe Bryant. Granted Kobe has not won without Shaquille (but neither has O'Neal yet!). Granted he does not have MVPs or scoring les but still this is a special player; that I fully believe is still as good if not better than either LeBron James or Dwayne Wade listed below. Kobe has also demonstrated repeatedly in his career that special "clutch factor".
He may not be MJ, but he is still pretty damm good - period! Don't bet against a great year from him this year under Phil Jackson again. He will improve this year on his already heady 22.4 PPG, 5.1 RBG, and 4.4 ASG. As a fan of other teams, if he has the ball in the final seconds, he still scares me as much as anyone in the game!
2. Dwyane Wade. Tough choice over next two-three below . . .
TD is not the same position so it wont be compared, I think TMAC would have destroyed Jordan in his time. One on one of course, Jordan never really faced talent like that of Kobe or TMAC in his days.
Yeah, before 2000 the leauge was a bunch of 5'11" balding middle aged white guys and MJ.
Are you serious? That is the most ridiculous post I've ever read in this forum. TMac wouldn't stand a chance against Jordan's Bulls. In fact, he didn't have a strong impact in the game since he got to the NBA. (apart from ESPN highlights of course). You are talking about the best player ever against a quitter who never won .
Read my post again, i said TMAC would have taken Jordan one on one not team against team, the rockets dont have a team that would have competed against the Bulls.....the spurs now do though
I think the biggest in Jordan's armor of invincibility is the fact that in 1993-94 his first year in minor league baseball, the Bulls were able to amass a 55 - 27 record and take the Knicks, the eventual NBA finalists that year, to a game seven in the Eastern playoff semi-finals.
I think it would be unlikely for the Spurs to enjoy that kind of success sans Duncan for the year. That said I don't think Duncan is on Jordan's level. However, personally, I think Hakeem at his peak surpassed Jordan in total abilities and if you switched those player's teams it would be Hakeem with six or more rings.
Jordan = Greatest player ever. Period.
I don't know, Jordan is just a special player who came in to the leauge worked hard and always got better and better every year. Winning 3 and 3, probably winning four or more in a row had he not retired is incredible. I do not believe that T-mac could take jordan one on one, however as a team guy T mac will never be close to being what jordan was. I mean honestly jordan could do so much, to me the most direct comparison would be Kobe, he is a good all around player, once he masters the team concept and excepts phil we will see if he is as good as jordan was.
OI think there was tons talent like t mac in jordans days. Drexler, barkley, reggie miller, malone, just to name a few.
oh , that's funny
TMAC can't even get out of round 1 of the playoffs. And Jordan would have still kicked his ass 1 on 1, 1/2 on 1/2 or whatever.
Amen Brother.
This is how I see it:
If T.D. would have say for example played on that Portland team that went to the finals Portland would have won it. If T.D. was on that Laker team in 91 in place of Vlade, The Lakers would have won it and so on and so on. Tim is not to be under rated. Jordan is.
Sorry, I was never really a big Jordan Fan.
Think about. Put Tim as P.F. in any of those teams that went to the finals and I still am convinced "that" team would have taken it.
My personal opinion.
I don't really agree with that position because all that would really prove is that Tim Duncan is better than Vlade Divac and Kevin Duckworth/Buck Williams. I think you could say that about a lot of All Star-level players.
The real litmus would be if you replaced Jordan with Duncan, would the Bulls be as good. But even that is somewhat oversimplified.
that is a great point Spurminator...
i'd venture to say TD does NOT win 6 les with the same teams Jordan had in Chicago, and i'd also venture to say Jordan has at least 4 Rings with the same Spurs teams TD has had...
Jordan is in his own class...the only ones that can be in his class are Magic and Maybe Bird.
TD is right there though, in the 2nd tier. I guarantee you any of the above players would not be bricking freethrows in the clutch...and the fact that they did play different, ball control oriented positions does give them the opportunity for greater stats, contributions, but when you count Heart? yeah, TD is in that class, no doubt. MORE so than Kobe and Shaq by FAR. Last shot? yeah, that's Kobe or TMac or Lebron, BUT lemme tell you...i'm more than satisfied with it being in TD, Manu's or...hmmmm...i guess that guy Robert Horry can hit a few too...
These are Great Times to be a Spurs Fan!!!
Duncan has something only the greatest players have - masterful basketball abilities both mental and physical, but that drive, that force, that will to win thats so strong it affects all of his teammates. If we can tie or win with a two, I'd always have duncan take the shot, and if we need 3, then the ball still goes through duncan.
I still disagree. I'll take any western conference team with T.D. in it and still think T.D. and that team beat the Bulls. Again, always thought M.J. was over rated. Always have. Always will.
But thats for another discussion as to why I think M.J. was over-hyped. This hypothetical is fun.
Tim Duncan is the best power forward in the history of the NBA. I don't think it's even close. Karl Malone, Bob Pe , Charles Barkley, Kevin Garnett, and Kevin McHale are all well behind. TD has the best combination of physical tools, mental edge, and championship mettle.
Now is he without fault? Of course not. As recently as the 2004 playoffs, Tim Duncan struggled with the most basic of basketball fundamentals, his free throw shooting. And, as recent as the 2005 NBA finals, people questioned whether Tim Duncan could really take over a game when it counted (game 7) without a guy like David Robinson there to help him. He proved he could.
Now, while MICHAEL JORDAN is considered by many as the best player ever to play the game, I personally don't think he's even the best guard to ever play the game. I think OSCAR ROBERTSON was a better overall player than Michael Jordan. However, there is no questioning that MJ mastered the mental aspect of winning better than anyone in the history of the NBA not named BILL RUSSELL.
IS TIM DUNCAN in the same category or discussion as Michael Jordan? Sure, absolutely. A multiple championship winner, a multiple regular season MVP, a multiple NBA finals MVP. Sure, he's in the same discussion as MJ. Is he AS GOOD AS Michael Jordan. I don't know if that's the case. Because once Michael Jordan got past the Bad Boy Pistons, he couldn't be beat when it came to the playoffs. Disregard the half-season when he returned from baseball. His prime years, he was unstoppable. I think Tim Duncan can still be beat in the playoffs. And, maybe that's more of an indication that the compe ion is better in Tim Duncan's era, considering Shaquille O'Neal's teams. However, it's not Michael Jordan's fault that Charles Barkley, Dominique Wilkins, Patrick Ewing, and Karl Malone couldn't beat him.
Tim Duncan is in the same category. But, TD is still a few more championships away from the likes of Michael, Russell, and Magic.
Some numbers, for what they're worth...
Win Shares - Best Season Totals (Since 1978)
1 Michael Jordan 56 1988
Michael Jordan 56 1989
Michael Jordan 56 1990
Michael Jordan 56 1996
Shaquille O'Neal 56 2000
6 Michael Jordan 55 1991
7 Michael Jordan 52 1997
David Robinson 52 1994
9 Magic Johnson* 51 1990
David Robinson 51 1995
11 Michael Jordan 50 1992
David Robinson 50 1996
13 Charles Barkley 49 1990
Moses Malone* 49 1982
15 Charles Barkley 48 1989
Larry Bird* 48 1985
Tim Duncan 48 2002
Tim Duncan 48 2003
Kevin Garnett 48 2004
Magic Johnson* 48 1987
Michael Jordan 48 1993
Karl Malone 48 1997
Karl Malone 48 1998
David Robinson 48 1991
May not be all that relevant to the discussion, but I liked seeing David Robinson so many times...
Glossary: http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/glossary.html
your bias is showing vas deferens...
obviously TD is a much better player now, and the games were Close back then, one even went to OT, i think...but Jordan's bulls beat the spurs in 97 and 98 with TD on the court...as a matter of fact...if Anyone has any of those games, nba authorized of course...please pm me or email [email protected] or call me...check the prof for #.
Now could any of Jordans Championship teams beat Today's Spurs in a 7 game series?
It would be close, but with TD, Manu, TP, and Bruce to lock down on MJ...I definitely like our teams chances...Pippen would go off and Jordan would definitely get all the calls...but dayum, it would be awesome to see...wonder which team Kerr would want to play on...he'd be the one opinion that could settle it...
MJ would score 40 with bruce on him because the ball was always in his hands. He was what, 13/33 fg in his last game as a bull? When youre that good and you have the ball all the time... you just cant be stopped from scoring.
sure he could...maybe more...but he couldn't beat the spurs by himself...well maybe...but he'd have to get bruce out of the game and manu too...and get TD in foul trouble and get hot from outside...then he could do it...
TD cannot be single covered either...he's just like jordan in that regard...they only way to Contain them is TEAM D...Kobe can go off anytime, but without Shaq to keep the games close, his last minute heroics will not be seen in the postseason...who cares who scores the most points...it's who wins the game that matters.
Manu could not defend Michael Jordan. It would be, who will do more for their team (because both will score alot of points): TD or MJ.
of course Manu could defend MJ...what are you smoking?
could Manu shut him down...OF COURSE NOT...but i bet Manu could get a steal or two and draw a charge, make MJ work...just let #20 get a couple more years of Ref Respect under his belt...Manu IS Jordan, but without the outside touch....YET...
Manu guard Jordan? Last I checked, nobody could guard Jordan. Manu is a flopper, and he isnt gonna get any calls. Jordan always got the calls.
To who all who say Michael Jordan is greatest ever I give you a Larry Bird quote - asked was MJ best ever he saw = "one of two". At the level of the 5-6 best there is no best only opinion (!) and in my opinion either Bill Russell or Wilt more dominant than MJ and case can also be made for Kareem.
Duncan is now not far from that level = give him 6 more years and he may well be in discussion with MJ and others for top 1-5 period.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
